We have never saw a problem with 2.4 self interfering. Only 900Mhz, and that
is easily fixed. 

Mike Bushard, Jr
Wisper Wireless Solutions, LLC


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 11:40 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] vendor specs -- Jon

Hi,

First, the spec sheet on Motorola's website says -86 RSSI.

What happens when you have more than 3 towers outside of the 8 mile 
range of GPS sync? The 2.4ghz signal will definately travel that far, 
causing self-interference, correct?

Travis
Microserv

Anthony Will wrote:

> Answers in-line
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'd like to go back to the specs on different radios just so I can 
>> compare for myself..
>>
>> Trango 2.4ghz:
>> 5Mbps auto ratio
>> 8 non-overlapping channels
>> 10mhz spectrum per channel
>> -90 Receive level
>> 15 mile range (without a grid)
>> External connector and dual-pol integrated antenna
>> $879 AP (WISP price)
>> $479 SU (WISP price)
>>
>> Canopy 2.4ghz (regular):
>> 7Mbps fixed ratio
>> 3 non-overlapping channels
>> 20mhz spectrum per channel
>> -86 Receive level
>
> 2.4 canopy has a -89 receive level
>
>> 5 mile range (without a dish)
>> $902 AP (reseller price online)
>> $490 SU (reseller price online)
>
> I am guessing your quoting single prices here.  Now that maybe viable 
> for this discussion but realistically if a WISP is not financially 
> able to purchase in 25 packs they likely are very underfunded.  So 
> that the information is available a 25 pack of the "Classic" 2.4 ghz 
> Canopy units is $6709 so if you break that down to single price that 
> is about $269ea + $50 for reflector for a total of $319ea.  
> http://www.doubleradius.com   It is possible to get them cheaper then 
> this but you will have to deal with co-op's or ebay.com
> Also I would never install a unit with a 60* pattern (Trango or 
> Canopy).  Just include the$50 for a reflector or stinger from 
> http://www.wirelessbehive.com
>
>>
>>
>> Based on the information from Mike, I could not use Canopy. In 
>> several areas, I have 4-5 towers located within 5 miles of each 
>> other.... how do I do that with Canopy? With Trango, I use a 
>> different channel for the sector pointing toward another tower 
>> (frequency planning and coordination is very important) and 
>> everything works great. Is there a solution for this with Canopy?
>
> This is where GPS sync comes in.  You can point two different tower 
> locations on the same frequency at each other and they will not 
> interfere with each other.  This is how it is possible to do a 6 AP 
> cluster on one tower with only 3 non overlapping channels.
>
>>
>> Also, by using only a 10mhz spectrum per channel, Trango's channel 1 
>> and channel 8 are actually outside the reach of Canopy and 802.11 
>> (for the most part) and thus can almost always be used in a noisy 
>> environment.
>
> Remember with Canopy you generally don't have to avoid interference.  
> Find the cleanest channel and 90% of the time you will be the few db 
> louder then the noise that you need to make a viable link.
>
> Anthony Will
> Broadband Corp
>
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Mike Bushard, Jr wrote:
>>
>>> Well, so far as we can tell the only thing that can kill canopy, IS 
>>> CANOPY.
>>> We have put it up against WaveRider, Alvarion, and 802.11b. They all 
>>> fell of
>>> the face of the earth.
>>> We have 16 tower sites deployed, all 900Mhz and 2.4, over 1000 CPE 
>>> and more
>>> on the way. (I realize there are many people bigger than us.)
>>>
>>> We use a mix of MTI Omni's, MTI or Tiltek 120deg Sectors (MTI for 
>>> Horizontal
>>> and Tiltek for Vertical) and integrated 60deg sectors (I really wish 
>>> someone
>>> would come out with a descent H-pol as I don't like the integrated 
>>> antenna)
>>> with 900. Cyclone Omni's or 120deg sectors on 2.4.
>>>
>>> Here is what I have found with GPS Sourced Sync vs. Generate Sync:
>>>
>>> If you want channel reuse you need GPS sourced sync.
>>> If you have a tower more than 8 miles away, you need to use different
>>> channels no matter what, even with GPS sourced sync you still have 
>>> speed of
>>> light issues from tower to tower.
>>>
>>> Can you Generate sync and deploy multiple AP's in a given area, yes. 
>>> You
>>> just need to make sure you have Frequency separation. Does this mean I
>>> recommend it, NO.
>>>
>>> Also even with every site GPS Synced, you still can only put so many 
>>> AP's in
>>> a given area be for you need to go to a different polarity. At least 
>>> we know
>>> there will never be another 900Mhz based ISP in one of our towns.....
>>>
>>> Also on a side note, I have never found a problem with 2.4, it is 
>>> 900 that
>>> will give you problems, it just carries so far. If the noise floor was
>>> lower, and Canopy could run at -90 we would have coverage for a long 
>>> ways.
>>> It seems like we can always pick up a AP at -80.
>>>
>>> YMMV.
>>>
>>> Mike Bushard, Jr
>>> Wisper Wireless Solutions, LLC
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>>> Behalf Of Matt Liotta
>>> Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 5:07 PM
>>> To: WISPA General List
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] vendor specs -- Jon
>>>
>>> Patrick Leary wrote:
>>>  
>>>
>>>> I'm speaking about multipoint matt, not ptp. The dedicated ptp you are
>>>> doing is by far the exception. Canopy is designed, built, and sold 
>>>> to be
>>>> primarily a pmp system. I've never met or heard of a Canopy pmp 
>>>> network
>>>> of any scale that did not require GPS.
>>>>
>>>>       
>>>
>>> I'd be interested in further explanation on this topic. We have some 
>>> Canopy pmp and haven't found the lack of GPS a problem. Granted we 
>>> don't have a large amount of pmp, but I would certainly like to 
>>> understand any future pain before we experience it.
>>>
>>> -Matt
>>>
>>>   
>>
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