Right, and I don't believe Mikrotik supports them all, but upon introduction 
they did support many of them and I've more popping up as time goes on.

When is IS going to have MPLS?


----------
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jeff Broadwick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 9:03 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points


> MPLS isn't one thing, it's a set of over 50 RFCs.  Most implementations
> don't have all of them at this point.  When you look to implement MPLS, 
> you
> need to know which parts you need and then make sure that your provider
> supports them.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 8:46 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points
>
> Mikrotik supports MPLS.
>
>
> ----------
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom DeReggi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 18, 2008 7:44 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points
>
>
>> Ok.....
>>
>> When someone designs an end to end  transport network they are committing
>> to
>> being a layer3 or a layer2 network by design.
>> Sure you can have bridged components on a routed network, and you can 
>> have
>> routed end devices on a bridged network, and you can do it differently on
>> your WAN, MAN, Last mile Relays.  But functionally all-in-all, your city
>> transport that transposts the VPN is either are layer2 or layer3 network.
>> This is what defines what VPN alternative you have to offer.
>>
>> One of the benefits I sell is Office to Office connectivity, BYPASSING 
>> the
>> Public Internet, with a controlled On-Net path across my LAyer3 network.
>> Adding the benefit of one connection to accomplish both Internet and
>> private
>> network functionality.  This is both a QOS and Cost advantage, but all in
>> all, I price it like Internet access, because its functionally routed 
>> like
>> Internet traffic using Layer3.
>>
>> Its important to under stand the difference between Layer2 and Layer3
>> VLANs.
>> LAyer3 generally offers shortest path, via the same rules that apply to
>> all
>> customer's traffic.  Layer2 VLANs offer something different.  Layer2
>> generally provides a static path (not necessarilly shortest path)
>> engineered
>> between two points.  When at Layer2, a defines capacity can be
>> provisioned,
>> without concern for distance and quality that might come into play to
>> effect
>> real world throughput if had done at layer3 w/ native re-transmission and
>> Congestion avoidence mechanisms.  There are many efficiency benefits of
>> LAyer3, that will never be achieved at Layer2, and Layer2 offers many
>> things
>> Layer 3 will never deliver.
>>
>> The point I'm making is, the provider needs to determine the factors that
>> are most beneficial to them as a provider and their prospective market.
>> Those decissions are so much more important than the type of VPN or VLAN
>> used.  And that is what you are really comparing when comparing two
>> providers' VPN Connectivity offerings.
>>
>> To offer basic VLAN redundancy it requires all paths to be connected at
>> layer2 so the Spanning tree protocols talk and work.  But layer2
>> redundancy
>> protocols can fuinctionally break LAyer3 redundancy (such as OSPF and
>> IBGP).
>> So its really choosing one or the other.
>>
>> MPLS solves all this, by adding VPN, Layer2, QOS, preferred path, all in 
>> a
>> single platform of protocols.  Sorta the best of both worlds (LAyer2 and
>> LAyer3).
>> The problem is MPLS is not cost effective to deploy in most cases, 
>> because
>> the MPLS manufacturers charge to high an inflated markup on MPLS enabled
>> gear. There is no technical reason why MPLS gear needs to cost more. But
>> it
>> still does.  Its the difference between buying a new $20,000 MPLS router
>> and
>> a used $500 thirdparty or used non-MPLS router. Sure there are exceptions
>> all over the place to get a deal, but the whole network needs to talk 
>> MPLS
>> for it to really be beneficial, so if you can't find 100% of it cheap, 
>> the
>> reast you pay top dollar.
>>
>> Many of the MPLS open source products are developing, but its scary
>> endorsing a platform, that is not widely supported yet by several open
>> source router systems.
>> It locks you into a platform that may or may not ever get complete or 
>> work
>> 100% correctly.  I think OPENSOURCE MPLS is exciting to watch, but its 
>> not
>> quite there yet.
>>
>> Layer3 VPN is a great way to get your IP space to securly end up from one
>> side of your network to the other. This is benefical when someone has
>> chosen
>> a LAyer3 transport design, because itworks voer layer3 :-)
>>
>> If you chose a LAyer2 VLAN as a replacement for VPN that is also OK, but
>> its
>> a complete change of network design.
>>
>> We use VLAN all the time, but we route between VLANs, apposed to use the
>> VLAN to cross our entire network as a VPN.
>>
>> Personally, if everything cost the same, my whole network would be MPLS
>> based, but it doesn't cost the same.  And I can undercut my competitors 
>> on
>> price by atleast a factor of 10x, because I'm not using MPLS.  So to do 
>> it
>> with MPLS, you really have to be focused on marketing to the segment of
>> the
>> population that udnerstands the difference and will pay for it.
>>
>> Hope that helps.
>>
>> Tom DeReggi
>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Patrick Nix Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
>> Sent: Monday, August 18, 2008 9:05 AM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points
>>
>>
>>> We already run some VPNs across our network but I am under the
>>> impression that VLans may be a little more efficient way of transporting
>>> data where the points all reside within our network.  Is this true?
>>>
>>> __________________________________________
>>>
>>> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>>> csweb.net
>>> (918) 235-0414
>>> http://www.csweb.net
>>> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>
>>> ====================================================================
>>> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
>>> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
>>> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>>> ====================================================================
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>>> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 6:35 PM
>>> To: WISPA General List
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points
>>>
>>> This is MPLS's bread and butter.
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> Mike Hammett
>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>>> http://www.ics-il.com
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Patrick Nix Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
>>> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 11:09 AM
>>> Subject: [WISPA] VLan or VPN to multiple points
>>>
>>>
>>>> Is anyone capitalizing on offering VLan services to companies with
>>>> multiple sites within your network.  We have a couple of opportunities
>>>> to provide this type of service and wondering the best way to approach
>>>> it and charge for it
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>> __________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>>>> csweb.net
>>>> (918) 235-0414
>>>> http://www.csweb.net
>>>> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>
>>>> ====================================================================
>>>> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
>>>> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this
>>> e-mail
>>>> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>>>> ====================================================================
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
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