OK, what is AF09? So I'm just a dumb country boy.

Ron Wallace
Hahnron, Inc.
220 S. Jackson Dt.
Addison, MI 49220

Phone: (517)547-8410
Mobile: (517)270-2410
e-mail: rwall...@newgenet.net
-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Larsen - Lists [mailto:li...@manageisp.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 04:44 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] UBNT Bullet5 review...

Travis,Ok, I'm game.First of all, a plain 802.11g wireless AP should be thrown 
in the junk pile and replaced with StarOS or MT. Depending on the quality of 
signal and modulation rates from the majority of the users, I would have also 
removed some of the higher mods to reduce rate shifts. And then, I would have 
set up bandwidth profiles for each user to something in the 1meg down/512K up 
range. That would pretty much fix the bandwidth and latency problem.When I do 
your upload test, I don't have the same problems. I do bandwidth control in the 
access point, and with upload rates set to half of the download rates, I have 
no problem putting 50 to 75 users on one AP and still provide good download 
speeds (1meg/2meg/4meg packages) with decent latency (20-40ms latency at peaks) 
and no packet loss. That is also with quite a few VOIP users who would be 
howling if the service didn't work.BTW, Canopy radios at $160 are double the 
cost of a NanoStation. Canopy with a reflector is 3x the 
 cost of a Bullet5 and 26db grid. StarOS APs are at least 1/4th the cost of a 
comparable Canopy AP. Matt Larsenvistabeam.comTravis Johnson wrote:> Matt,>> I 
know we have already discussed this several times, and I'm not sure > we need 
to do it again... but maybe you could explain how you could > have setup a 
plain 802.11g wireless AP so that each client (using all > different kinds of 
wireless adapters) could have gotten equal > bandwidth and latency at AF09?>> 
And, once again, I have done test after test after test using 802.11 > stuff... 
and every single time (using Mikrotik without Nstreme, using > StarOS, using 
OSBridge and using Nanostations) if we setup an AP and > we connect two clients 
with laptops and start a continuous upload, the > other client is basically 
dead in the water. Even if we limit the > upload to 2Mbps or 3Mbps, when that 
client starts the upload, the > other client has very high latency, very bad 
download speeds, etc.>> As for price on Canopy vs. 802.1
 1... things are not always as they > seem. I know of a large Canopy operator 
that is buying radios for $160 > each. ;)>> And, we have Trango AP's that only 
deliver 5Mbps total with 128 > clients and we deliver 4ms latency to every 
single client.>> Travis> Microserv>> Matt Larsen - Lists wrote:>> Sorry Travis, 
but you are dead wrong about 802.11 not being able to >> scale beyond 20 users, 
especially with 802.11a. I explained how it can >> be done to you before and I 
have consulting clients with 10,000 plus >> users on their 802.11 based 
networks scaling right up to the same size >> as any Canopy or Trango network. 
You might not be able to get to 150 >> subs per AP, but you can certainly hit 
50-75 per sector and offer >> service that is damn close and a far sight 
cheaper than what Canopy will >> do. I would take a StarOS a/b/g network over a 
Canopy system every day >> of the week.>>>> As far as problems at AF09 - that 
is what you get when Canopy guys are >> running an 802.11 n
 etwork. If I was running it with the proven >> equipment and deployment 
methods that many of us use on 802.11 networks, >> there would not have been 
any such problems. Just because the AF09 >> guys couldn't figure it out (or 
more likely didn't bother to try) >> doesn't mean that it can't be done 
right.>>>> Matt Larsen>> vistabeam.com>>>>>> Travis Johnson wrote:>> >>> The 
problem will be that they are still plain 802.11 technology. There >>> is no 
polling or ARQ or FEC or anything else that makes technology like >>> Trango, 
Canopy and others work so well. We pulled all of our 802.11 >>> stuff down over 
5 years ago. It does NOT scale. You will never get an AP >>> with reliable, 
consistent service with more than 20 users.>>>>>> In fact, I think we witnessed 
this at AF09. Everyone connected to the >>> same AP (48 I think was the count) 
and we continually got disconnected >>> and the speeds and latency were 
terrible. Could there be a better "real >>> world" experience than that? 
 :)>>>>>> Travis>>> Microserv>>>>>> Jerry Richardson wrote:>>> >>> >>>> All I 
can do is shake my head. Ubiquity seems to have acquired some>>>> Area51 
technology..... >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> >>>> __________________________________ >>>> 
Jerry Richardson >>>> airCloud Communications>>>>>>>> -----Original 
Message----->>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On>>>> Behalf Of 
rea...@muddyfrogwater.us>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2009 3:42 PM>>>> To: 
WISPA General List>>>> Subject: [WISPA] UBNT Bullet5 review...>>>>>>>> I 
deployed my first Bullet5 today. Not the high power, but the>>>> 
standard.>>>>>>>> throughput testing showed insignificant difference between 
my>>>> Star-OS/WAR1 >>>> combo and the Bullet. The AP shows that the Bullet has 
active>>>> compression >>>> and fast frames that functions with my star-os 
access point.>>>>>>>> I have not tried the narrower channels to see if they're 
compatible with>>>> my star-os AP's.>>>>>>>> They have been c
 ertified with up to 30 db antennas.>>>>>>>> Summary... 1 bullet5, 1 
pacwireless 25 db grid w/pigtail, 1 universal >>>> mount = very cheap 5 ghz cpe 
- about $130 - 140 complete. Even>>>> nicer???>>>>>>>> The bullet slides down 
INTO the universal mount pipe, becoming invisible>>>> after you mount and aim 
it.>>>>>>>> Just FYI... The Bullet does NAT and has a DHCP server built in. 
No>>>> need >>>> for a router, allows you to have a fully routed 
network.>>>>>>>> Opinion.... I like them.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
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