Ideally that would be the way to do it. I think the original rationale with the zip code reporting was that it did not require any broadband provider to map out their whole network with complex mapping tools. Just sending a zip code list was easier. Now that it has morphed in to a reporting requirement that you have to map or do complex queries against mapping data, they might as well ask that question. The mobile cellular carriers report tracts covered with signal not necessarily where the customers live.
I wonder what they would do if you reported tracts with zero customers? Or maybe you could list yourself as a mobile broadband provider and report under those guidelines? Thank You, Brian Webster -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]on Behalf Of Stuart Pierce Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 9:05 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] [WISPA Members] WISP's are killingthemselves!!!!- NewFCC form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed Wireless One thing I've always wondered is why they only want to know what areas you have customers in, not what areas you can service. ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Edward Spoon <[email protected]> Reply-To: WISPA General List <[email protected]> Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2010 21:28:30 -0600 >Which is probably why my state just started their own required bi-annual >broadband filing report. The preferred method was census BLOCK, luckily that >was optional and tract was acceptable. Hopefully it stays that way! I spent >over 30 man hours (much of it after hours, and with Brian's help) getting >the tract data / correct format the first time, but since we are now >maintaining it I have already completed the March 1 FCC filing - took less >than 1 hour! > >I refuse to let my brain contemplate starting from scratch again to get >block level data. Nope. Not happening. Forget it. No way, (You know we're >gonna have to eventually!!) > >Ed > > >On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 11:40 AM, Brian Webster < >[email protected]> wrote: > >> Yes there is a check box, that has been the problem with sharing the data. >> The FCC was even sued for a FOIA release of the From 477 data by The Center >> for Public Integrity in 2007. They were not required to release the >> information. >> >> >> >> Thank You, >> Brian Webster >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ken Hohhof [mailto:[email protected]] >> Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2010 12:33 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [WISPA Members] [Motorola II] WISP's are killing >> themselves!!!!- New FCC form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed >> Wireless >> >> >> Well, I can see how that's a problem. >> Is there actually a checkbox where you choose to protect or not protect >> your data? I don't remember that. But I haven't done the March 1 >> submission yet. >> If that's the case, and they are prohibited from sharing the data with >> other government entities doing broadband mapping, I don't have a solution >> for that. >> >> >> From: Brian Webster >> Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2010 11:22 AM >> To: Ken Hohhof ; [email protected] >> Subject: RE: [WISPA Members] [Motorola II] WISP's are killing >> themselves!!!!- New FCC form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed >> Wireless >> >> >> The biggest problem with not providing the 477 data to the state or making >> it available to those seeking grants, is the fact that people who file the >> data have checked the box that requires the FCC to protect it under NDA >> (Marlon do you remember this issue? As I recall you were one of the >> cheerleaders on that topic). The WISP's were the ones insisting that that >> option be available before they would file. Now the same industry it >> bitching about the fact that the data is not being distributed...can't have >> it both ways. The FCC has shared the data with NTIA and RUS and those >> agencies are protecting that same NDA. Those agencies are using the data >> to >> cross reference grant applications and challenges. >> >> >> >> >> >> Thank You, >> Brian Webster >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ken Hohhof [mailto:[email protected]] >> Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2010 12:03 PM >> To: [email protected]; [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [WISPA Members] [Motorola II] WISP's are killing >> themselves!!!!- New FCC form 477 report is out,not looking good for Fixed >> Wireless >> >> >> Brian, this thread leaves me puzzled about a few things. >> >> 1) Why are we so worried about the US "falling behind" the rest of the >> world in broadband, while the fact that China is leaving us in the dust in >> high speed rail generates a mere yawn? (same with solar and wind power ... >> technology, manufacturing, and deployment) >> >> 2) Does anyone really believe this is about high speed pipes for >> telemedicine, or kids doing their homework? What is the national security >> issue with making sure every house is wired for 4 simultaneous streams of >> on-demand high definition 3D entertainment? Are we afraid of falling >> behind >> the Chinese in the couch potato race? >> >> 3) This is a census year. Why is the census not being used to get this >> data directly from end users? Think of the questions you could ask, not >> just about what speeds people have, but why they don't have higher speeds. >> (unavailable? too expensive? not needed? don't even have a computer? >> only use the Internet for texting and tweeting from their cellphone?) >> >> 4) Any other statistical survey would correct for known measurement >> errors. For example, by checking a sample of the data against >> independently >> obtained data known to be accurate. Or correcting for known measurement >> inaccuracies. Like if you know that only 10% of Amish households have >> phones while 90% of the general population does, you might want to multiply >> the Amish responses in a phone survey by 9. So if they know only 50% of >> WISPs are submitting Form 477, wouldn't it make sense to multiply the >> numbers by 2? It wouldn't be perfect, but it would be more accurate than >> making decisions based on clearly wrong data. >> >> 5) Why is a fortune in stimulus money being handed out in state mapping >> grants, for a one-time measurement, and for results that won't be available >> in time for the broadband plan next month? >> >> 6) Why is no one cross referencing Form 477 data to state mapping >> projects? I look at the Connect Illinois map, and it clearly does not >> include some of the biggest WISPs in my area, for example T6 Broadband. >> Yet >> those WISPs are in the dropdown box for Form 477, so evidently they >> submitted Form 477 data. If they have a bunch of customers in a certain >> census tract, apparently they have coverage in that census tract. Would it >> not make sense for the state map to include this data, even if the WISPs >> chose not to give Connected Nation a spreadsheet of all their APs to >> independently generate a coverage map? I mean, come on guys, decisions are >> being made on the basis of data that someone can easily demonstrate is very >> wrong. It's like saying my sister doesn't exist and making decisions based >> on her non-existence, just because she didn't send me a Christmas card. >> >> 7) If insufficient broadband speed is such a monumental problem, why is >> it proving so difficult to obtain the data to back it up? >> >> I think maybe we're obsessing too much about the people who can only get >> 3M DSL or 6M WiMAX or 10M cable, but to prove whose dick is bigger we want >> them to get 100M or 1000M because we heard on TV that everybody in Hong >> Kong >> has that. So far the free market has done a pretty good job of getting >> those people faster and faster speeds. And if we're trying to determine >> who >> CAN'T get broadband, we're going about it backwards by having providers >> tell >> us everyone who CAN and then seeing who got left out. >> >> I'll tell you how to quickly identify all the unserved areas in the >> country. Get a list of street addresses from Hughesnet of all their >> customers. Anywhere you have a concentration of Hughesnet dishes, clearly >> those people have no other choice. It's like someone announced, hey >> everybody who can't get high speed Internet, stick a big ugly dish on your >> roof so we can identify you easily from space. >> >> >> From: Brian Webster >> Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 2:37 PM >> To: [email protected] ; WISPA List ; WISPA Board ; memb...@wispa. org >> Subject: Re: [WISPA Members] [Motorola II] WISP's are killing >> themselves!!!!- New FCC form 477 report is out,not looking good for Fixed >> Wireless >> >> >> As many of you know I participated on a panel last week with 2 FCC >> staffers. Here is the text of an email I just sent to them: >> >> Paul and John; >> I just reviewed the latest form 477 report. I am dismayed by the >> results for the fixed wireless industry. I cannot believe, and I am sure >> you >> don't either that there was a 39.6% decline in subscribers over 6 months >> when there were 112 more operators reporting. The only conclusion I can >> draw >> is that fixed wireless operators who reported in the past using the zip >> code >> method, did not file when they were required to report by census tract. >> Many >> of those operators must have had a large customer base. >> As I mentioned on the panel, I have assisted some WISP's file their >> 477 reports by mapping their customer databases and assigning the proper >> tract data to each record. In talking with most of them, it became apparent >> that the FCC did not provide an adequate tool to help those people file. >> While it is possible to look up a single address and get the tract data, >> there were no provisions to allow for a bulk upload and query to assign >> this >> information. Many of the 20 or so WISP's I helped had databases of 1,200 to >> 1,400 records. That would be a very time consuming process to do one at a >> time. >> Most small WISP's do not have the GIS skills or tools to deal with >> this issue that major carriers already have on staff. Zip codes were easy >> because it was already part of the information they had on hand. If >> possible >> there should be a tool to address this issue which should increase the >> reporting numbers from those who had participated in the past. >> >> >> >> Thank You, >> Brian Webster >> 214 Eggleston Hill Rd. >> Cooperstown, NY 13326 >> (607) 643-4055 Office >> (607) 435-3988 Mobile >> (208) 692-1898 Fax >> Skype: Radiowebst >> www.wirelessmapping.com >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]on Behalf Of >> Peter >> Kranz >> Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 1:50 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: [Motorola II] WISP's are killing themselves!!!! - New >> FCC >> form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed Wireless >> >> >> Maybe they can keep making this report harder and harder to fill out >> so we all just stop doing it.. >> >> >> >> That report is a huge waste of my staffs time. And based on the >> underlying edits and validations you can tell their system computes the >> census tracks internally to verify it matches the one you provide. The >> system should accept data in a way that is simple for a WISP to provide and >> derive the census tracks, etc.. maybe then more people would provide the >> data. >> >> >> >> Peter Kranz >> Founder/CEO - UnwiredLtd >> www.UnwiredLtd.com >> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 >> Mobile: 510-207-0000 >> [email protected] >> >> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >> Chuck McCown >> Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 10:41 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [Motorola II] WISP's are killing themselves!!!! - New >> FCC >> form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed Wireless >> >> >> >> Brian, >> >> Could you find a list of the fixed wireless companies so we can all >> verify we are on the list? >> >> >> >> From: Brian Webster >> >> Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 11:36 AM >> >> To: WISPA List ; memb...@wispa. org ; WISPA Board ; Motorla List >> Beehive >> >> Subject: [Motorola II] WISP's are killing themselves!!!! - New FCC >> form 477 report is out, not looking good for Fixed Wireless >> >> >> >> The latest FCC report on form 477 broadband data is out >> (http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-296239A1.pdf). >> While >> I don't see a whole lot of useful data in it, I do see where WISP's are >> killing themselves and the industry, why? >> >> >> >> a.. In the periods prior to the December 2008 report, fixed wireless >> has shown a steady increase in subscribers. The last reporting period the >> number of subscribers dropped from 808,000 to 488,000!!! That's a 39.6% >> drop >> in the actual data that had been previously reported. Know I know that most >> of the problem is the fact they now require census tract reporting rather >> than zip codes, but dropping like this does not help the industry as a >> whole. >> b.. Because of the low number of reported subscribers, the reporting >> by technology portions of the report does not even earn fixed wireless a >> spot on the charts in it's own category. It's lumped in with the 1.4% total >> of all other technologies compared to the rest of the broadband industry. >> Hell Satellite has their own category with .9%. >> c.. The total number of fixed wireless providers reporting is 617. >> That means there are a huge number of WISP's not filing form 477 and those >> that didn't report must have a large number of subscribers. The previous >> period where fixed wireless had 808,000 subscribers had only 505 WISP's >> report! Matt Larsen and the WISP directory have around 1,800 WISP's >> registered. I've heard other estimates between 2,000 and over 4,000. Only >> 617 fixed wireless operators reporting is not helping the cause at all. >> d.. The National broadband plan is being formulated as we speak, >> looking at those statistics it appears the WISP industry is in a serious >> decline and that as a total percentage of broadband provided to consumers >> nationally, they make no significant difference. >> If you were a government policy maker, would you even pay attention to >> WISP's. I certainly would not. They have to make decisions based on data >> and >> that benefit the majority of the country. WISP's have thumbed their noses >> at >> providing this data for years. I think it is really going to bite them in >> the butt now. Fiber to the home is coming liking it or not. USF reform is >> coming like it or not. USF reform is going to subsidize broadband to the >> very markets wireless serves more economically today. Removing that >> advantage is going to put the WISP industry in serious trouble. >> >> >> >> The manufacturers are killing themselves as well. In their quest to >> just sell radios, they have missed the importance of keeping the industry >> healthy. If the WISP's cannot compete and/or show that they are a >> significant option to the overall broadband infrastructure in the US, how >> will they continue to sell product. If anyone knows the true number of >> WISP's out there it is the manufacturers. They should be leading the charge >> with groups like WISPA to make sure ALL WISP's stand up and get counted. >> How >> hard would it be to stuff each shipment with educational material on the >> importance of filing form 477? >> >> >> >> The current FCC is very open minded but the results of this type of >> report force them to make decisions that benefit the most people. 488,000 >> is >> a very small portion of over 129 million homes. >> >> >> >> All I can say is ouch........ >> >> >> >> Thank You, >> >> Brian Webster >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> WISPA Membership Mailing List >> >> ----------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- >> WISPA Wants You! 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