Also take a look at the article I have on Scott's site: 

"Persistent login from anywhere on a web site"
http://xml-extra.net/webpage.xmlx?node=95

This approach uses the userreferencecookie to obviate the problem with 
userreferenceargument,  and is for a login system.  But it has similar 
checks and instead of using the client side browser to re-direct, its 
done on the server with http header.


>ok i think i have a solution to the problem.
>
>If you go into this taf with a non-valid user reference, it will assign you
>a new one.  If you keep clicking the link w/ the non-valid user reference,
>you get a new user ref each time.
>
>If you go into this taf with a VALID user ref (by clicking the link on the
>"Page" part for instance) you keep your user ref as youd expect.
>
>best part is, it doesnt have to store a domain scope table of valid user
>references or anything, it just relies on a user scope variable being set
>for valid users (:
>
>basicly how this would work is this construct would go at the top of all of
>your tafs with the if and else if and all your code going in the else
>statement.
>
>you an also do something cool like changing where it redirects invalid users
>so you could make them go to your main page or a timeout page or whatever
>you want.
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ben Johansen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:53 PM
>Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key
>
>
>> Ok, some more here.
>>
>> I took the copied address into a text editor and changed the
>> userreference value manually. I opened a new browser pasted the address
>> with the changed key (to simulate user vars timed out)
>>
>> And the user variable was blank and no session cookie was created.
>>
>> Interesting :-b
>>
>> Ben Johansen - http://www.pcforge.com
>> Authorized Witango Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/WitangoGoodies.htm
>> Authorized MDaemon Mail Server Reseller
>> http://www.pcforge.com/AltN.htm
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ben Johansen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:28 PM
>> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key
>>
>> Ok, Now I am confused myself :-)
>> Ok attached is a new TestAutoCookie.taf
>>
>> From page 1 -> page 2 a session cookies is created
>>
>> On page 2 there is a new bottom form enter a value and press "to page 3"
>> Highlight the address
>> Close the browser window
>> Open a new browser window and paste the address
>>
>> Your user variable will be there but no session cookie.
>>
>> Hmmm...
>>
>> Ben Johansen - http://www.pcforge.com
>> Authorized Witango Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/WitangoGoodies.htm
>> Authorized MDaemon Mail Server Reseller
>> http://www.pcforge.com/AltN.htm
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Scott Cadillac [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:10 PM
>> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key
>>
>> Hi Atrix,
>>
>> Just another follow-up on your testing. And sorry, I haven't taken a
>> look at
>> Ben's code yet.
>>
>> But maybe if a _UserReference value is passed to the Server on the first
>> request - Witango isn't bothering to issue the "Set-Cookie" header,
>> which
>> would explain why you don't see the cookies in HTTPLook.
>>
>> Just another thought from my rambling brain. And I guess I should just
>> stop
>> rambling and do more actual work, eh :-P
>>
>> I'm going to get myself in trouble here...I can just feel it....
>>
>>
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Atrix Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:40 PM
>> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > Subject: Re: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key
>> >
>> >
>> > I tested w/ R:Tango 5 (not sure what build or version number
>> > but I know it
>> > is pre- the latest secuirty patch), Apache 1.3.24 and windows 2000.
>> >
>> > As far as i can see there is no user ref cookie.  Im not sure
>> > the name of
>> > the cookie so i dumped <@varnames scope='cookie'> and it was
>> > empty, also
>> > using HTTPLook i see no cookies (:
>> >
>> > Single work station, working localy across 127.0.0.0
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Scott Cadillac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:19 AM
>> > Subject: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key
>> >
>> >
>> > > Thank you Atrix,
>> > >
>> > > Could you also include what version of Witango you tested
>> > with, OS and
>> > > Webserver brand?
>> > >
>> > > In a serious test environment, it would also be good to see what the
>> > > session-cookie value is in this scenario (should be the same as the
>> > > UserReference key).
>> > >
>> > > I'm sure this has been discussed on the list in the past,
>> > but just can't
>> > > remember the results.
>> > >
>> > > Did you use more than one workstation? Just wondering....
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > From: Atrix Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:09 PM
>> > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > Subject: Re: Reusing the UserReference key (was:
>> > > > Witango-Talk: what happens with expired userReference?)
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Well i just tested it.
>> > > >
>> > > > I have a .taf with a results html with this in it:
>> > > >
>> > > > <a href="<@cgi><@appfile>?<@userreferenceargument>">test!</a><br>
>> > > >
>> > > > what i did was create some links to this with edited user
>> > > > refs (to simulate
>> > > > expired user refs since they arent currently valid) and yeah,
>> > > > each one used
>> > > > the linked user ref as its own...meaning if there was a
>> > > > search engine or
>> > > > something that included the user reference argument in the
>> > > > link, they would
>> > > > all be using the same session which is no bueno!
>> > > >
>> > > > there might be a way to force the client to a new user
>> > > > reference number.
>> > > >
>> > > > if so, at every page you can check to see if
>> > user$validuser=1.  If it
>> > > > doesnt, force a new user reference number and set
>> > > > user$validuser to 1 so the
>> > > > first time someone visits your pages, they are forced to get
>> > > > a new user ref
>> > > > number, which would solve this issue.
>> > > >
>> > > > One of many solutions people will present, im sure :P
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > > From: "Scott Cadillac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:46 AM
>> > > > Subject: Reusing the UserReference key (was: Witango-Talk:
>> > > > what happens with
>> > > > expired userReference?)
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > After sending my post, and thinking about it....
>> > > >
>> > > > I suppose my answer is probably not right, that the old
>> > > > UserReference is
>> > > > reused for a new session.
>> > > >
>> > > > In theory, if 10 different people all clicked on the same
>> > > > Search page links,
>> > > > which all had the same UserReference key value - and the old
>> > > > key IS reused
>> > > > for the new session(s) - then 10 people could be sharing
>> > the same User
>> > > > variables. Not good.
>> > > >
>> > > > Does somebody have a better answer than me?
>> > > >
>> > > > Like I mentioned, I don't personally use
>> > > > <@USERREFERENCEARGUMENT> in my apps
>> > > > and strictly rely on the session-cookie. So the above
>> > > > wouldn't happen to me,
>> > > > and I don't have an opportunity to test my own answer.
>> > > >
>> > > > Any feedback anyone???
>> > > >
>> > > > Scott Cadillac,
>> > > > Witango.org - http://witango.org
>> > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > --
>> > > > Information for the Witango Developer Community
>> > > > ---------------------
>> > > >
>> > > > XML-Extranet - http://xml-extra.net
>> > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > --
>> > > > Well-formed Development (for hire)
>> > > > ---------------------
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > From: Scott Cadillac [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:34 AM
>> > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: what happens with expired
>> > userReference?
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Hi Roland,
>> > > > >
>> > > > > As long as the VariableTimeout has expired by the time of
>> > > > the new page
>> > > > > visitor (with the old link), then the old User Variables are
>> > > > > gone - and new
>> > > > > ones are assigned as needed.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I think, but not 100% sure, that the old UserReference key
>> > > > > value in the old
>> > > > > link is actually reused. This particular question is tough to
>> > > > > answer because
>> > > > > for myself, I don't use <@USERREFERENCEARGUMENT> and
>> > just rely on
>> > > > > session-cookies, which means your scenario would never
>> > > > present itself.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > It is when the VariableTimeout period has not expired yet
>> > > > (default 30
>> > > > > minutes), that a Security issue is introduced where the new
>> > > > > visitor can be
>> > > > > given access to someone else's User Variables. This is known
>> > > > > as Session
>> > > > > Hijacking.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > But, with all that said, your scenario I think is less
>> > problematic.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Your concern is about when a SearchBot hits your site, and is
>> > > > > automatically
>> > > > > granted a <@USERREFERENCE> key. This key value is then stored
>> > > > > as part of
>> > > > > your site links for a search engine - which is then exposed
>> > > > > to anonymous
>> > > > > users.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > In theory the SearchBot is not logging in to secure pages
>> > > > > with a password,
>> > > > > and is typically not trying to do on-line purchases - so I
>> > > > > would think there
>> > > > > is very little to hijack. Especially given the fact
>> > that a case for
>> > > > > hijacking is very remote here.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > In theory, in your code, any User Variables you assign to
>> > > > > anonymous visitors
>> > > > > on the public side of your pages are relatively non-critical
>> > > > > - which is all
>> > > > > a SearchBot would be granted, or any other public visitor who
>> > > > > has not logged
>> > > > > in yet.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Of course that is just theory because I don't really know
>> > > > what you're
>> > > > > assigning your public anonymous visitors, with respect to
>> > > > > Variables or your
>> > > > > VariableTimeout setting.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Hope this helps. Cheers....
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Scott Cadillac,
>> > > > > Witango.org - http://witango.org
>> > > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > --
>> > > > > Information for the Witango Developer Community
>> > > > > ---------------------
>> > > > >
>> > > > > XML-Extranet - http://xml-extra.net
>> > > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > --
>> > > > > Well-formed Development (for hire)
>> > > > > ---------------------
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > From: Stefan Gonick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:05 AM
>> > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > > Subject: Re: Witango-Talk: what happens with expired
>> > > > userReference?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > I'm pretty sure that the Witango server starts a new
>> > > > > > user session if the user reference has expired.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Stefan
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > At 09:47 AM 8/6/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>> > > > > > >when you have a project and the company's IT manager
>> > > > > > personally refuses
>> > > > > > >cookies, he writes it into the job spec that the site work
>> > > > > > for people who
>> > > > > > >hate cookies. ain't that nice?
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >On Wednesday, August 6, 2003, at 09:36 AM, Bill Conlon wrote:
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >>Yet another reason to use <@USERREFERENCECOOKIE>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>>when a bot cruises through a site and each link has a
>> > > > > > userReference=xxx
>> > > > > > >>>URL argument, it stores those along with the stable URL.
>> > > > > > What happens
>> > > > > > >>>when someone comes back to that exact URL, userreference
>> > > > > > and all, after
>> > > > > > >>>the session variables have expired?
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >_____________________________________________________________
>> > > > > > ___________
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>> > > > > > ========================================================
>> > > > > > Database WebWorks: Dynamic web sites through database
>> > integration
>> > > > > > http://www.DatabaseWebWorks.com
>> > > > > >
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