We don't have to pinpoint exactly what is intermediate versus what we advanced. What I'm suggesting is one comprehensive TOC page (for topics which could be either, or even basic) that non-beginners could use to drill down. We can, and I think should, have such a page in a prominent location which just doesn't happen to be the main page.
Doug On Aug 26, 2011, at 12:19 PM, Mika A Epstein <[email protected]> wrote: > How would we define what is and isn't intermediate? I'm not being facetious! > I still think of FTP (or some file management tool) as being a bog standard > "you need to know this to run your own website." but as I'm sure Esmi will > back me up, the number of people who blanch when you tell them to FTP in and > rename the plugins folder is not insignificant :/ > > On Aug 26, 2011, at 2:02 PM, Doug <[email protected]> wrote: > >> What's striking me is that we also could use a separate Table of Contents >> page for the whole Codex, for intermediate to advanced users, including >> developers, to bookmark. They (we) also use the Codex as well as Google. >> >> The sidebar has categories like Advanced Topics but one has to click through >> many times and noodle around to find out what is where. I'd thinking more of >> a comprehensive page that one can skim or grok to get some precision on >> where to click. >> >> Doug >> >> On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:31 AM, Mika A Epstein <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> There's only so much you can do to make certain things "simple enough". >>> >>> My concern with your changes was how MUCH data we had up there. People >>> don't read. They just don't, not for WordPress, and not for their jobs (if >>> I go postal, it will probably be over people telling me that they didn't >>> read the documentation because at 6 short sentences, it was too long). >>> Even right now, we do have too much going on. >>> >>> So in my eyes, the question we need to answer is: Why do people go to the >>> FRONT page of the codex? >>> >>> I would say it's because they've heard about WP and they either want to see >>> what sort of documentation there is at all before installing, or they have >>> their first question about it. So the first section should be how to >>> install, how to add themes/plugins, how to get help. >>> >>> Next we have the 'how do I use this?' set. So we need a section on how to >>> make posts and pages and links. Also how to use widgets in themes. In >>> fact, something for a basic "this is how a theme works, this is how you can >>> edit it." WITHOUT touching any code. >>> >>> Finally you have the creationists (not those, the ones who wanna write >>> stuff). >>> >>> People who make plugins and themes already know how to Google. People who >>> want to learn to do that, though, should have a quick "this is how you make >>> A theme. This is a child theme." and a plugin one. >>> >>> But after that, we're getting into heavy lifting, and there's really not a >>> perfect way to avoid learning code and how to read technical docs to learn >>> things. We shouldn't lower the bar, but we should build some stepladders so >>> they can climb up and join us :) >>> >>> On Aug 26, 2011, at 1:14 PM, Spencer Hill <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hey everyone. This is Spencer Hill, the person who made the edits to the >>>> front page. >>>> >>>> I apologize for the late introduction and for any inconveniences I may >>>> have caused. Thanks to mrmist I realized my post on the "Discussions" >>>> section of the "Main Page" wasn't the correct place to hold discussions... >>>> about the main page. Heh. >>>> >>>> I've had the opportunity, now, to read through all of the threads and, if >>>> my opinion is valued here, I agree with most of the feedback. Before I >>>> note anything else though I thought I would include the note I put on the >>>> discussion for the main page as I assume only mrmist was able to review it >>>> before the constructive criticism of the changes: >>>> >>>> "I've spent several hours today revising the Main Page and a few of a >>>> subsequent pages and I wanted to make some notes, comments and requests to >>>> the community. >>>> >>>> First, I've reorganized the Main Page to include descriptions for each >>>> section. This will allow future users and contributors greater ease while >>>> navigating this codex. >>>> >>>> Secondly, there are many similar articles and landing pages throughout the >>>> codex that leave users and contributors confused or following links in >>>> circles and down rabbit holes. I want to encourage and plead with fellow >>>> contributors to focus on condensing and organizing all subsequent landing >>>> pages and articles according to the Main Page. That way we don't have >>>> three "Getting Started" sections and information that's geared towards >>>> developers mixed with information that's geared towards absolute beginners >>>> who have no interest in programming WordPress. >>>> >>>> Lastly, I'd like to suggest the following structure improvements for the >>>> codex: >>>> >>>> Main Page displays a title and description, as well as a few popular quick >>>> links to all of the primary areas of the codex. By selecting section >>>> title, the user should be redirected to a dedicated page for that section. >>>> This will help prevent the Main Page from becoming a confusing >>>> conglomerate of links. >>>> Each section's dedicated landing page should include a more thorough >>>> description and a list of links beneath each of the following section >>>> titles "Resources", "FAQ", "Popular Topics" and "Training & >>>> Documentation". These sections should not cross pollinate by sharing links >>>> among each other. >>>> For example: If a link to a PAGE under FAQ happens to contain information >>>> that is related to some of the other sections, fine, users can certainly >>>> include links to these others sections when it's within content on a page. >>>> But users shouldn't put these links in the links list beneath each of >>>> those sections. >>>> Well, those are my thoughts. Hopefully they all make sense and are on the >>>> same track as the rest of the community. Though I suppose some may object, >>>> but let's get the conversation rolling. I've got clients who want to learn >>>> how to use WordPress and I'm tired of rewriting training materials and >>>> reshooting screen casts for every client! ;)" >>>> >>>> Now that I know the proper place to hold discussions about changes to the >>>> wiki you guys can count on me sharing ideas and joining the discussion >>>> here before making any serious changes to the front page. >>>> >>>> That being said, I hope you guys weren't too rattled by my changes but >>>> rather that it sparked an important conversation so developers and >>>> non-developers alike can find the codex useful and helpful. >>>> >>>> One last note, regardless of the content or structure of ESMI's layout, >>>> it's lacking clarity for people who are not developers. We have to provide >>>> a safe location for people who don't know, understand or care about >>>> WordPress' functions, installation, etc... to get their information >>>> without being slammed with loads of technical terms, FAQ's and links. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> wp-docs mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-docs >>> _______________________________________________ >>> wp-docs mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-docs >> _______________________________________________ >> wp-docs mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-docs > _______________________________________________ > wp-docs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-docs
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