I am not part of this conversation and don't understand why I received this
e-mail.
Ted Knoy

On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 11:11 PM, Julie Romanowski <
julie.romanowski.l...@statefarm.com> wrote:

> Mike, maybe you should have worded your question a little differently. At
> my company, we don't approach accessibility as "catering to users with
> disabilities", but we work toward making applications accessible to the
> greatest number of users possible. No application will ever be 100%
> accessible, but following standards and WCAG 2.0 guidelines helps us to get
> as close to 100% as possible.
>
> To answer your question - Sticking to standards is not enough.
> Accessibility and usability testing are critical. At my company, we have
> both an accessibility lab and a usability lab. We have accessibility and
> assistive technology (AT) experts onsite who test using various AT, and who
> work with actual AT users to identify issues with applications. We also
> train designers and developers to identify accessibility issues early in the
> design and development lifecycle. There are several other companies I know
> of that are doing the same and so much more, such as Adobe, IBM, Microsoft
> and Yahoo.
>
> As for developers not caring about people with disabilities, I disagree.
> There is a large community of developers who take accessibility seriously
> and are striving to make applications accessible to people with
> disabilities.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Kear
> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2011 2:54 AM
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: RE: [WSG] How do you cater to users with disabilities?
>
> The conclusion I am coming to, with 5 days since I asked this and no-one
> actually saying they do ANYTHING to cater for people with disabilities,  is
> that even after all this time, no one really spends much time thinking about
> users with special needs, other than to code to standards and hope that does
> the trick.
>
> No one either agreed or disagreed with the proposition that sticking to
> standards IS in fact enough.
>
> I asked this question, wondering if someone would say 'yes we have a
> usability lab' or 'we have a consultant who runs our sites through his
> screen reader for us' or 'we have meetings before launch specifically to
> discuss' or something.   But no one has said they do anything at all for
> users with disability.
>
> The only responses I've had to this question are people referring me to
> documents on line that I found long ago with google.   I was interested that
> none of the people who gave me those URLS (except Josh Street) said they
> actually used the advice in the documents themselves. Josh wasn't specific
> about how he caters to people with special needs, but seems to speak with
> some knowledge so I'm assuming he caters to Dyslexics in his designs.
>
> I guess it's going to take another law suit like that one against the
> Olympics2000 site to get anyone to take users with special needs seriously
> and actually lift a finger to cater to their needs.
>
> The conclusion I'm being forced towards is that developers are basically
> saying that users with special needs will have to swim for themselves and
> it's up to them to find some software of their own to get around all the
> obstacles the A/Bs put in their way. I'm glad at least property developers
> have been forced to change that attitude.
>
>
> Cheers
> Mike Kear
> Windsor, NSW, Australia
> Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer AFP Webworks
> http://afpwebworks.com ColdFusion 9 Enterprise, PHP, ASP, 
> ASP.NET<http://asp.net/>hosting from AUD$15/month
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Kear
> Sent: Thursday, 18 August 2011 11:12 PM
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: [WSG] How do you cater to users with disabilities?
>
> How to the rest of you a/b people (i.e. able bodied) cater to users with
> various forms of disability?
>
> Up until recently, I've tended to rely on keeping my code to standards,
> eliminating tables except for their proper purpose of tabulating data, and
> hoping that will give the accessibility level required.  Do you go to the
> step of accessing your sites with JAWS or something similar to see how the
> site works for users with screen readers?
>
> I remember in the 1990s when I was working at Australian Consumers
> Association (choice.com.au) we had someone come and bring his PC with
> JAWS. The web team all sat in the boardroom getting ever more glum looks on
> our faces as we saw to our horror how terrible our new design was for this
> poor guy. We thought we'd got a terrific new design, and were about to
> launch it, when he did this demo for us. We had to go back and recode
> everything.
> This was before anyone was talking about standards though - it was back
> when the normally accepted method of laying out pages was to use tables, and
> buttons were nearly always images.  I remember being astounded at how fast
> he was moving around the page, even though we'd unwittingly designed an
> obstacle course of humungous proportions for him.
>
> Our anguish at the time resulted in a far better web site, and convinced me
> to pay attention to standards and accessibility ever since.
>
> But now I'm wondering if simply sticking to standards is enough?
>
> What do you all think?  Do you include JAWS in your site testing?
>
> Cheers
> Mike Kear
> Windsor, NSW, Australia
> Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer AFP Webworks
> http://afpwebworks.com ColdFusion 9 Enterprise, PHP, ASP, 
> ASP.NET<http://asp.net/>hosting from AUD$15/month
>
>
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