Without any prejudice as to whether anybody is altogether "independent" or not, please Cde Lwazi would you mind quoting where Friedman in particular predicted that Jacob Zuma would not emerge as President from Polokwane?
Because the way I remember it, the only people who did not know that Jacob Zuma was going to win were the Thabo Mbeki supporters. I don't think sweeping statements help. What would help would be one or two well-referenced quotations that would show whether you are correct or not. Remember that you are referring to the period when Jon Perlman, Karima Brown and others were banned from the SABC. So, if you can make your charges against Friedman stick, by all means do so. If not, then consider yourself challenged. VC On 20 May 2010 12:04, Lwazi Nkolonzi <[email protected]> wrote: > Greetings > > The so called independent analysts, how independent are they? I mean > what do you base your reasoning on as to say that Prof Friedman is an > independent analyst. > > One will remember what Prof Friedman and many other so called > independent political analysts said to the run-up to the watershed > conference in Polokwane as to say that Jacob Zuma will not emerge as > the President of the organization due to their various reasons they > mentioned from their independent political analysis. > > Instead the opposite happened and were wrong, that goes to tell you > that we ought to differ with their analysis and also now there are > Comrades differing with what Friedman is saying in the article. > > On May 19, 3:57 pm, sive gumenge <[email protected]> wrote: > > Greetings, > > > > The rejection of independent analysts within the South African political > > landscape with kill the importance and significance of democracy in > > politics. These institutions of independency were wanted us by us to > > demonstrate our capacity to lead a democratic state unlike the apartheid > > regime. > > > > Regardless of what they say, we must appreciate their role. It grows to > have > > an independent view in any aspect. So we must not view comments as > attacks, > > etc. > > > > For the record, Malema is not immune from being analysed or criticzed by > > whom so ever. So this unnecessary protection of Malema is > > anti-revolutionary. We must always be able to engage with objectivity at > all > > times. Malema's rise to power and protection of authority, reminds me of > the > > Military dictator and President Uganda, Idi Amin and the movie called > Black > > Diamonds. I am worried worse now that Lindiwe Sisulu wants Cde Malema to > go > > for military training. > > > > The worrying factor as well, is the abuse of young comrades by old > comrades > > for their own selfish interests. To me, the problem is not the > opportunism > > of the young comrades alone, but the lack of interest for movement by the > > senior comrades of our movement. > > > > Let's defend our movement together. There are no special defenders of > > democracy over the other, here. > > > > Forward to Socialism, > > > > On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:55 PM, Aphiwe Bewana <[email protected] > >wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Friedman remains one of the most important intellectuals within the > South > > > African society, and this analysis is both necessary and in time. > Because, > > > it reveals what many of believe, but do not want to share or declare > > > publicly. > > > > > Thanks Domza > > > > > On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:12 AM, Dominic.Tweedie < > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> [image: Business Day] > > > > >> *Malema just a pawn in the battle for ANC’s soul* > > > > >> *Steven Friedman, Business Day, Johannesburg, 19 May 2010* > > > > >> JULIUS Malema is not nearly as important as some of us think he is. > And > > >> the more important he is believed to be, the more likely are we to > miss the > > >> real story. > > > > >> Malema’s importance has been exaggerated yet again in the wake of his > > >> disciplinary hearing, which parts of the media hailed as yet another > triumph > > >> for the African National Congress (ANC) Youth League president: > “Malema > > >> Trumps Zuma”, one billboard proclaimed. > > > > >> Yet a cursory understanding of current ANC politics would show just > how > > >> out of touch that judgment is. > > > > >> Much seems to be made of the fact that Malema was not suspended or > thrown > > >> out of the ANC. But that was never going to happen. The reason is not > — as > > >> much reportage would have us believe — that he represents millions of > > >> alienated youth. It is, rather, that he is a pawn in an important > contest > > >> for the soul of the ANC. > > > > >> Many divisions within the ANC have become more visible since > Polokwane. > > >> But the most important of these is the clash between an antidemocratic > form > > >> of politics and its opponents. Those who practise this politics are > hostile > > >> to the ANC’s left. But that is where their appeal to business > hopefully > > >> ends. > > > > >> A key tactic of this group is the use of strident nationalist rhetoric > to > > >> justify a patronage politics that hopes to use money to gain position > and > > >> position to gain more money. It is antidemocratic because patronage > politics > > >> is a vehicle for elites seeking to advance their own interests and is > > >> indifferent or hostile to the needs of most citizens. > > > > >> In Mpumalanga , a variant of this politics has descended into > thuggery, > > >> which could yet destroy politics in the province: several councillors > who > > >> seem to stand between some politicians and the tenders they seek have > been > > >> murdered and politicians who oppose misuse of public trust fear for > their > > >> lives. This use of violence may be unusual: but even when it is > peaceful, > > >> patronage politics threatens to turn the ANC in particular, and > politics in > > >> general, into an alliance of the acquisitive, a guild of the greedy. > > > > >> Malema is very much a part of this politics. He clearly has the > support of > > >> some senior ANC figures who practise it and much of what he says is > > >> presumably what they want him to say. This makes him difficult to > dislodge — > > >> not because he has a great following among the wretched and the poor > but > > >> because he is of great use to some of the well-heeled and well- > connected. > > >> He could not have been thrown out of the ANC because that would signal > that > > >> his patrons were so weak that they could allow him to be thrown to the > > >> wolves. They are powerful enough to prevent this. > > > > >> Given this, the sentence that Malema received after entering into a > plea > > >> bargain was deeply humiliating. > > > > >> The man who, not long ago, was reportedly invincible was told to go > back > > >> to school to learn politics and manage his anger. He was forced to > apologise > > >> and was warned that, if he misbehaved again, he would be suspended. He > was > > >> treated not like an unstoppable political force but like a schoolboy. > It is > > >> hard to imagine him receiving rougher treatment in the circumstances > and the > > >> punishment is a defeat, not a triumph. > > > > >> It is also the ANC’s first serious attempt since Polokwane to curb the > > >> unrestrained power battles which threaten in time to tear it apart. > And so > > >> it could yet prove to be the first turning point in an attempt to > ensure > > >> that the politics of personal advancement does not destroy the ruling > party. > > > > >> But, since Malema is purely a creature of those who support his > lifestyle, > > >> the really important issue here is not his future but what the > judgment says > > >> about the battle for the ANC. On the surface, the faction he serves > has > > >> suffered a setback. But it is not clear yet whether they backed Malema > and > > >> lost — in which case they are surely in retreat — or whether they > decided > > >> that he is dispensable and that they would be better able to > strengthen > > >> their hold on the ANC if he was cut down to size. > > > > >> The test will be the extent to which the ANC is now able to roll back > > >> patronage politics. Enacting and enforcing rules that allow political > > >> competition but ensure that contests are won by the candidate with the > most > > >> support, not the most money and muscle, will be crucial. So will the > > >> creation of clear limits on money’s influence on politics. If the > patronage > > >> politicians are losing, both measures should be adopted by the ANC > national > > >> general council this year. > > > > >> Whatever the outcome, Malema will be far less important to it than > much > > >> coverage suggests. He has suffered a setback but the type of politics > he > > >> represents is far from dead. And it remains possible that he will fade > from > > >> the scene but that patronage politics will further entrench itself. > > > > >> The ANC’s immediate future and that of the country will depend not on > what > > >> happens to Malema but on whether the ruling party can rein in those > who have > > >> used him. > > > > >> - Friedman is director of the Centre for the Study of Democracy > > > > >> *From:http://www.businessday.co.za/articles/Content.aspx?id=109337* > > > > >> -- > > >> You are subscribed. This footer can help you. > > >> Please POST your comments to [email protected] or > reply to > > >> this message. > > >> You can visit the group WEB SITE at > > >>http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forumfor different delivery > > >> options, pages, files and membership. > > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email > [email protected]. You don't have to put > anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to > > >> put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an > e-mail to > > >> this address (repeat): [email protected] . > > > > > -- > > > "It is our aspiration and our aim that everyone should become socially > > > conscious and effective; but to achieve this end, it is necessary to > provide > > > all with the means of life and for development". > > > > > -- > > > You are subscribed. This footer can help you. > > > Please POST your comments to [email protected] or reply > to > > > this message. > > > You can visit the group WEB SITE at > > >http://groups.google.com/group/yclsa-eom-forumfor different delivery > > > options, pages, files and membership. > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, please email > [email protected]. You don't have to put > anything in the "Subject:" field. You don't have to > > > put anything in the message part. All you have to do is to send an > e-mail to > > > this address (repeat): [email protected] . > > > > -- > > You are subscribed. 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