Chiming in here
On 5/7/19 11:18 AM, Behan Webster wrote:
On May 7, 2019, at 2:47 AM, Bas Mevissen <ab...@basmevissen.nl
<mailto:ab...@basmevissen.nl>> wrote:
On 2019-05-07 07:20, Behan Webster wrote:
> On May 6, 2019, at 8:36 AM, Bas Mevissen <b...@emcodev.nl
<mailto:b...@emcodev.nl>> wrote:
> On 5/6/19 12:45 PM, Josef Holzmayr wrote:
> I'd actually word it a little bit differently:
> If there is only *ONE* attendee who did not properly do the
homework, it
> will have a massive impact an the rest of the group. And that somebody
> will show up unpreparedly is absolutely certain in my opinion.
> With sufficient trainers, one can continue for most and provide
some assistance to the one falling behind.
Usually more than one. And this is generally very disruptive to the
class as a whole.
There are always people who are prepared to the T and others who just
casually stroll into the class. We all know that as we all went through
various stages of schooling. :) No matter what you do, there always will
be a glitch. I tried it all from course preparation instructions, shell
scripts setting up systems, USB sticks and network drives with downloads
and shared state cache, virtual machine images, build systems set up in
the cloud, you name it. If it is not somebody who is unprepared it is a
technical issue: lack of disk space, network connectivity, corporate
computers that do not allow USB sticks,... Instructors just have to deal
with it.
>> As someone who actually got started through the YPDD beginner
track (and
>> also often recommends it to new beginners), my opinion is clearly
that
>> we either should have it, be it only for a handful of attendees, or
>> offer a *real* replacement, with face to face training. My
experience is
>> that this personal thing in the very beginning is an absolutely
>> essential part of many YP/OE careers.
>
> I agree. That is how I started, next to a compressed Linux
Foundation Yocto training that was offered just before the event then.
Yes. By me and my colleagues who train for the Linux Foundation.
> So it might be wise to ask LF or get something organised. It would
mostly require a room and a sponsor for some small devkit.
We've run the beginner track for the last few years. The discussion
is precisely that the YP event is proposing to not run the beginner
track this year at all.
But why? There appears to be a constant demand.
An excellent question. I agree with you. I don’t have an answer
however. Not my decision.
I certainly would advocate to have the beginner track. It's a good way
of getting people interested, and eventually excited, for the Yocto
Project. Conferences and dev days are an opportunity to do advertising
and to grow the community. We cannot do that just by catering to people
who are already using YP. We need new folks as we are already running
into issues where things have to be dropped because there is nobody who
is maintaining it.
We're happy to do it again if given the space.
Yes, both for LF and YP it are off-the-shelf trainings that do not
require much preperation.
Speaking as a course maintainer for LF, keeping the YP course updated
is actually a tremendous amount of work (I’m the co-maintainer for the
LF YP course).
However, the beginner slides tend not to need more than a few hours of
updates every 6 months (which again is something I do).
Either may appear off-the-shelf, but they aren’t from my perspective. ;)
I can wholeheartedly second that. I developed the original YP class of
the LF and taught it many times and have since developed my own class
material teaching classes. While the basic concept of course remains the
same it is the little details that change. With every new version of the
YP a course maintainer has to go through every single exercise and
example in the course material and try it out again to see if it still
works. And quite frankly, sometimes it is rather silly things that have
changed and break something.
In particular for a beginner class lasting one day only, every single
disruption sets the class back and there is no opportunity to recover
from it. The day is already packed just to cover the core concepts.
Cheers,
Rudi
Thanks,
Behan
--
-----
Rudolf J Streif
CEO/CTO ibeeto
+1.855.442.3396 x700
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