----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, April 02, 2005 9:09 AM
Subject: [Zappa-List] IMPORTANT New Policy; Please Read

Vines, and the Viners who Vine them...

One of the things that kept me from promoting Vines or Trees (or
whateverthefuck) at the List was the fear that we would eventually
become a group of 'traders', with nothing to say except for "who
wants/gets what?"; after all, the List is a DISCUSSION group.
This fear has been put to rest, and vining has become an important
form of community here.
We tried setting up vines with an apointed "Vinemeister" (thank you
Larry, for all that work you did back in those days). This worked
okay, until someone broke the vine. Then, all eyes turned towards the
vinemeister, expecting him to not only set up, coallate, and start the
vine, but now to "fix it" because of some deadbeat.
That wasn't the answer...
Then we adopted the "first come w/ re-offer" method. This has served
pretty well, but flaws still appeared: folks who check the site,
rather than receive individual emails tend to get left out, or respond
too late; newbies have no way of knowing what vines are out there;
vines can 'die' when there's a lapse in interest; etc.
So, that isn't the answer either...
Here is the method of vining that I would like to see become the
Standard for the Zappa-List:
A member that starts a vine, posts to that effect with a "VO" (Vine
Open) in the subject line (ex: VO 841206 Oklahoma, or VO KECT "Token
of His Extreme", or VO DVD "Video From Hell", etc). In the message
body, before any info is listed, the person offering the vine puts
their user name and location/country, followed by 2 arrows: ex.
SOFA-US<<. Then add whatever pertinant info you want, or is available.

Here's what a vine message should look like:

From:   sofa49423fz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   Sat Apr 2, 2005  9:16 am
Subject: VO 741106 Syria Mosque, Pittsburgh

Message: SOFA-US<<
60 min, SBD,
01 Tush Tush Tush
02 Stinkfoot
03 Inca Roads
04 Experiencing Technical Difficulties
05 Yellow Snow (tape break?)
06 St Alphonso's Pancake Breakfast
07 Cosmik Debris
08 Florentine Pogen
09 I'm Not Satisfied.

The message is sent out in this form; the first member interested
posts a response to the group message (DON'T CHANGE the 'Header' or
subject line in ANY way) by adding their user name or ID to the above
message: ex. SOFA-US<<Jim L.-US<<; each interested member does this in
So this vine will build as members express their interest: ex.
SOFA-US<<Jim L.-US<<HotratsL-US<<Cris-UK<<vrnzr-BE<<Gabriel-AR<<Jack
Simpson-US<<, and so on.
Vines should not "close". When a member mails a vine to the next
recipient, the member indicates such with a reply to the message by
removing their name. So with our example, when SOFA mails the vine off
to Jim L., the reply to the message would be Jim
L.-US<<HotratsL-US<<Cris-UK<<vrnzr-BE<<Gabriel-AR<<Jack Simpson-US<<...
Actual snail mail addy's should remain off list. A member's email
always appears in the header of every message sent by that member, so
direct contact should be easy.
Why do it this way?
1) This method allows for everyone to get in on a vine when it's
announced - still first come first served, but the "me next" can be
listed, instead of having to wait for the re-offer.
2) This method allows everyone to 'track' a vines progress - no need
for a vinemeister, the vine will build on it's own, and be tracked by
everyone. A deadbeat, or break in the vine, will be noticed much
sooner, because everyone is watching.
3) This method allows for a consistency in our vining, which will make
it easier for anyone new to the Group since the vine's start to search
all of the vines and participate (simply type VO in the search bar,
and view the status of any vine).
4) This method keeps a vine perpetually open; you only cross YOUR name
off the list, and only AFTER you mail the vine on. The last member
left on the vine is always morally obligated to send a copy on to
whomever requests it, whenever requested.
Barring any sane disagreement with this method, I'd like to institute
it immediately - or ASAP.
Let's give it a try?

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