I certainly agree that zazen can have the benefits that you state, having done quite a bit of sitting myself. However my point is that there are other ways which in my case at least are now more effective in keeping me on the path. Basically just constantly remembering to look at reality....

Now please pardon me, I have to do my laundry!


On Sep 19, 2008, at 2:19 AM, mike brown wrote:

Hi Edgar,

In terms of talking about what happens after satori, I like the title of the book 'After the Ecstasy - the Laundry' (forgot the author). To my mind, this does kind of imply the ordinariness of our true, natural state. I think that people here are getting to hung up about what satori is and once experienced is enlightenment forever. As you know, enlightenment is a moment to moment experience and one can slip from one ox-herding stage to another in an instance. I think this is the main difference between our way of thinking. I believe that Zen and the practice of zazen helps to keep a person mindful of their emotions day to day and moment to moment and so helps them recognise the desires and aversions that lead towards unhappiness. A person who has a spontaneous kensho or who loses their sense of self in a sporting activity/nature/ listening to music etc. will rarely achieve this a second time and will almost certainly never intergrate this into a daily practice designed to 'bring the ox home'. Mike.

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