Anthony Wu I can agree with all you say except for your statement that 
nothing needs to be justified. Then, kiling, lying, womanizing, 
drinking... do not need to be justified. They are 'just this'.

I think that is "New Age Zen" where everything is OK. I recall reading 
an old zen book that stated that there were some things that were not 
taught, such as moral values because the culture of Japan was such 
that these things were presumed and expected. 


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