You are actually saying that aspects of the objective world are not illusory! I'm amazed. That is not Buddhism, Buddhism states that everything, that is all forms, are illusory. I think you just shot your own Buddha nature in the foot!

Care to clarify?

That being said I certainly agree that there are different 'levels' of illusion since the veils of illusion are multiple and overlapping.


On Jan 13, 2009, at 8:09 AM, <> wrote:


If you have a problem with the idea that 'everything is illusory', then you have a problem with most of Buddhism and certainly with zen.

Actually, EVERYTHING is not illusory - but everything that comes about through intellectualization is. Certainly Newton's Laws are illusory. They're the product of his intellect. Your understanding of them is the product of your intellect. Intellectualizations are illusory.

Pain is not illusory. Starving and dying are not illusory. SUFFERING from pain or starving or dying is illusory.

The idea that all suffering is illusion is the basic tenant of Buddhism. What books have you been reading lately?


From: [] On Behalf Of Anthony Wu
Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 6:08 PM
Subject: RE: [Zen] Re: The Reason For God


Yes, I think accountability is a more appropriate word.

However, I still have problems with your idea that everything is illusory.

Do you also think Newton's law is illusory.

I suggest you try pricking your thigh with a needle. Is the pain also illusory?

So many people starve, die, and suffer from all kinds of pain. Are they illusory?


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