ED: Why forget about pride and the Self?
MEL: That is what they teach(without specifics) in Zen which the general population can accept, or reject. Each and everything in this world we live in is never a 'self' as such because it's identity and environment constantly goes through changes over time...and so there's no Self to hold onto. How can you have pride when there's no Self to own? ED: No, but most of us are not aware of what these values are, as they are mostly hidden from ourselves. MEL: It all depends on what values and/or objectives anyone speaks of. If it's a belief in the One and Holy Father where everyone and everything(nourishment, teachings, resources, etc) comes from, then yes, not everyone will know of this. Zen resources on the other hand, had never spoken of such ED: So, articulating them to oneself can be a form of awareness practice. MEL: Yes, of course. Conservative Buddhists chant sutras and the like, and it helps them remember their teachings as well as follow correct breathing methods. Basic Zen practise however, may play a different tune especially in solitary practise Articulating it to oneself is often something that just happens automatically with many an individual out of habit before, during, or after the act, but it's necessity or not is for the individual to decide. Whilst this may be part of this dualistic Semitic culture one may speak of, Zen on the other hand persuades against it...because there is no permanence anywhere ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/