Dear Mike, You have already done those prostrations. They are a gesture of the heart, the form body only echoes.
As for Alex, he knows what he's doing. It's up to us to know what we are doing. It's not like he's the last of his kind we'll ever meet. Might as well practice arising in the Buddha field. I've tried the other since beginningless time, and frankly it sucks. You know the definition of insanity don't you? LOL Blessings, Ryunen PS There are dust devils dancing outside, spinning, twirling, kicking up dust. The trees stay put. =)< --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], mike brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Ryunen, > > I just wish Alex could look at what he says from outside himself. Exactly why a teacher is so essential. Mike. > ps throw in a couple of prostrations to Fudo for me will you. > > jayryunen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Mike, > Great story. > > Yes, exactly. And trying to put that pass through experience into words is our > continuing, laughable trial. =) Especially for one such as Alex, who has a lot of words > and cleverness, a little understanding, and is still half a bubble off plumb. Been there, > done that, 100,000 prostrations to my teacher for helping me. > > Blessings, > Ryunen > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], mike brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Dear Ryunen, > > > > Yes, very helpful. "Intellectual chatter" is very > > subtle when it's masquerading as the all-knowing, wise > > old man! > > > > I read an interesting story a while back of a lecturer > > (may have been Wittgenstein or Derrida) who would > > throw a matchbox at a student and say: > > > > "What's this?". > > > > Taking the bait the student would reply, "A matchbox!" > > to which the lecturer holding the matchbox would > > reply, > > > > "No! 'matchbox' is a sound - what's *this*?". > > > > Sometimes I feel like the student (of course it's just > > a bloody matchbox!), and other times I feel like the > > lecturer (when I 'see' the thing in front of me > > stripped of labels/concepts/abstractions and standing > > there empty and not at all separate - a bit like the > > "10,000 things" realising me). In this 'state' there > > is no self; no path; no suffering; no ears, no nose > > etc (you get my drift?). It's not an intellectual > > understanding. Mike. > > > > > > > > --- jayryunen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > --------------------------------- > > >can 'things' ever be > > > "right" or "wrong"? To my mind, 'no-thing' can ever > > be > > > inherently right or wrong (or for that matter, > > > sometimes right.. sometimes wrong) just as things > > can > > > never be inherently long/short; beautiful/ugly; > > > big/small etc. Isn't to perceive things as right or > > > wrong to presuppose a subject to which these > > 'things' > > > (object) happen - (and hence the subjects' labeling > > of > > > these 'not-I' things as "right", "wrong" etc?). > > > > Yes, these terms are used relatively. > > > > > > Of course, by greeting you the way I did I > > immediately > > > created a subject/object duality, but doesn't this > > > just illustrate how strong the urge to symbolise > > > concepts is rather than deal with the reality that > > > there is no subject/object? "You"/"I" then (no > > matter > > > how real the duality seems), is only a useful > > > convention and is no more inherent in reality than > > the > > > labels "right/wrong"; "long/short"; "good/bad" etc. > > > > Here things get murky in your statement. As you > > addressed Genryu, what was your > > experience? If there was a sense of an "I" am doing > > this, then duality is the > > experience, regardless of the intellectual chatter. At > > this moment "I" and my > > aggregates are sitting here typing to "you". Thus, > > there is delusion, karma being > > experienced. > > > > If the experience was one of emptiness, then the use > > of "I" would be the bodhisattva's > > use of the conventional "I" that is merely a label. > > > > One must practice strong mindfulness to be aware of > > the subtle "I" that accompanies > > us, even when we have purified gross levels of > > attachment. > > > > Any help? > > Ryunen > > > > > > > > Noble Eightfold Path: Right View, Right Intention, > > Right Speech, Right Action, Right Effort, Right > > Mindfulness, Right Concentration, Right Livelihood > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZenForum/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Your use of Yahoo! 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