I can't decide if this is a hoax or not :-S Can anyone comment?
Chris Clark O'Brien wrote: > > Thanks Andrew for a heartfelt description of what is > happening here. > > It is clear that unlike the other freeware products > like Lenux, JBoss.., Zope has lost all of the > advantages of being a freeware product. > > What I find sad is that the extreme commercialization > of Zope is hurting Zope- this discussion list is > censored in a way that would not be allowed for most > commercial products. > > I posted a serious bug- Zope throws an exception after > trying to resolve a transaction conflict three times. > The discussion was quickly moved line and I was told > this is not a problem- Not a problem? Give me a > break!! > This nearly killed my application and cost me several > weeks of work. > > Those who know of these problems can write clean > applications but these issues are kept strictly > confidential. > > To the *TRUE* open source community I would just say > let us reclaim Zope-even if it means branching. > Clark > > --- Andrew Kenneth Milton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > Since I seem to be the cause of all hell breaking > > loose over here, I thought > > take the opportunity to respond, since I haven't > > really been given an > > opportunity to do that. Since this probably going to > > be my only ever > > posting to zope-dev, I don't feel constrained to be > > brief in exercising my > > right of reply. > > > > I'm not going to apologise for the comments I made, > > or the manner in which I > > made them. Those comments were made on a list run by > > me, basically for my own > > amusement. If I had posted either of those emails to > > someone else's list, I'd > > quite rightly deserve to be fried. > > > > I don't make money from Zope Development (I don't > > make money), I don't > > run a website, in fact, I don't actually use any of > > the products I have > > released. So it's not like I have a vested interest > > in Zope. My fortunes don't > > rest on the success or failure of Zope or any one of > > its components. I live > > in a country the size of the USA that has the > > approximate population of > > New York State. Even if I stood on a busy street > > corner with a loud hailer, > > the number of people I could actually influence > > would be small. This makes > > me one of the people in the trenches. > > > > It is the people who are in the trenches who are > > increasingly being > > disaffected by Zope Corp, it seems as if you're not > > subscribed to zope-dev, > > you have no voice, and for most people zope-dev is > > not an appropriate forum > > for them to be subscribed to. As some of you know, I > > was hounded off of the > > zope@ mailing list for suggesting that there be some > > other mailing list > > for more technical discussion. People were very > > upset, because, they > > already have a hard time getting any support. Noone > > from Zope Corp seems > > to monitor the list to help out. The zope list was > > manned by people like > > me volunteering expertise and time to help more of > > the little people. > > > > A lot of those people come to the irc channel, which > > is also rarely if > > ever visited by anyone from Zope Corp. Most people > > know that #zope is the > > place to go when all else fails. The major irony of > > this is, that most > > of the people seeking help on #zope are working with > > it, or consulting with > > it, and are supported by me and others for free. We > > are the ones that > > deal with the 'general zope public.' We are the > > defenders of the faith. > > > > The Zope Weekly News, which turned into Zope Monthly > > News, which now > > has not been updated since October is a joke. It > > shows Zope Corporation's > > attitude towards their community. It says "We don't > > care about our community." > > I'm sure that's not the feeling of the *individuals* > > inside Zope Corp, I'm > > sure it is (or I hope it is) a source of great > > embarassment to those > > individuals that work for Zope Corp. > > > > Letting your community showpiece atrophy doesn't > > show any great passion > > towards us, it certainly doesn't endear new users to > > Zope. New users are > > the only way Zope Corp is going to make more money, > > unless of course > > zope.org is just for us non-revenue generating > > little fish, an inconvenience > > associated with having Open Source software, not > > something that promotes > > and supports the non-paying community. > > > > Noone wants a standardised User Management API more > > than me. I *want* to > > have confidence that someone can replace any User > > Folder with XUF, and it > > will just work. So when I come across something that > > says there is a > > New User Management API, I get excited. I prepare to > > roll up my sleeves and > > make the necessary changes to make software I > > contributed to the community > > continue to work. I think we all know by now my > > opinion on what I found, > > the harshness of the expression of that opinion is > > directly related to > > the way that these days Zope Corp seems to be an > > Ivory Tower and the way > > they seem to treat the community at large. > > > > There are approximately 450 products released by > > just over 200 people on > > Zope.org. There are approximately 1000 'entities' > > subscribed to this list > > (more to the main list), I represent 0.1% of this > > community, but, am > > responsible (but, not soley) for 3% of the total > > product space available. > > > > If people want to form an opinion of me based on one > > email, that's your > > right. You don't have the right to tell me, that *I* > > don't have the right > > to say the things I'm saying. I have earned the > > right to make these comments, > > I have contributed time, effort, and code, and I put > > my money where my > > mouth is. I'm not some backseat political observer, > > I am in the trenches > > I deal with the disaffected, the confused, and the > > generally pissed off > > every day. In my efforts, I try to help to make Zope > > a better product. > > > > You would be hard pressed to find a more stalwart > > supporter of Zope than me. > > This doesn't mean that I have to think that > > everything that leaves the > > holy temple of Zope Corp is the panacea of web > > development. My opinions > > might be wrong, but, they're not wrong simply > > because something was released > > by Zope Corp, or written by some person you have > > attached some god like > > status to. > > > > I will continue to do my thing, but, the way Zope > > Corp deals with us, > > the little fish had better change, or there's not > > going to be much of a > > community left. Those of you who subscribe to > > zope-dev who think that your > > time is too valuable to be spent helping others, > > well, words fail me. > > > > -- > > Totally Holistic Enterprises Internet| > > | Andrew Milton > > The Internet (Aust) Pty Ltd | > > | > > ACN: 082 081 472 ABN: 83 082 081 472 | M:+61 416 > > 022 411 | Carpe Daemon > > PO Box 837 Indooroopilly QLD 4068 > > |[EMAIL PROTECTED]| > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > > (Related lists - > > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. > http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 > > _______________________________________________ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) _______________________________________________ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )