Hi David

> Betreff: Re: [Zope-dev] Dependencies and future of zope 3
> 
> Hey Roger. Sounds reasonable to me. Can we also discuss the 
> potential of only including testing setup for dev eggs and 
> removing testing as part of a release when the eggs are 
> packaged to pypi or other repository for consumption.

I guess we do not have tets eggs. What do you mean with
test eggs. 

I think extras_require test is a pattern which let's you
use the extras or not if you use an egg. By default
an egg has only dependencies the defined packages
in install_requires. Or are I'm wrong?

> Besides loosing the dependency, this makes for happier folks 
> external to zope that consume our eggs.
> 
> While I personally do not like the contributor agreement, I 
> am willing to sign to help out to work with you and others to 
> get this settled. I am busy just like anyone else, but this 
> stuff with the dependencies has to end now. Weve been with 
> eggs for more than a couple years, progress has been made but 
> it has been slow. Seriously, let's see what we can do to.

Cool any help is welcome.

> The browser packages are a good place to start. Testing 
> another. Third would be seriously examining dependencies of 
> core again once this is done. Fourth might be tackling some 
> of the zope.xxx zope.app.xxx relationships. Some of the stale 
> packages in the main repository and placing them at another 
> location if they are unmaintained might also be in order.

I think we should start with identify the hard core dependencies
and list them in a proposal or another document in the zope wiki.
Anybody can list their ideas of what should be done and list
ideas how we can solve the problems. We also can use that 
paper for vote about the different refactorings.

Such a proposal/paper could also be usefull for others which 
don't read each mail.

We have different kind of refactorings which all solve some 
problems. I think we should not start with the browser views.
There are some core dependencies we need to cleanup first.

Right now I'm working forward with small refactorings 
which solve some dependencies to zope.app.form (ITerms) and 
zope.app.authentication (IPaswordManager).

After that, my goal is to work on the testing framework,
offering a clean testing (skin) layer, which should make it
possible to write functional tests without to use the basic,
default or rotterdam skin and the zope.app.authentication
package.

I guess that's what the repoze people need to have too.

Your help is defently very welcome. Go ahead with the
contributor agreement sing up and let Jim know that 
I volunteer for you.


> If we want to folks to use zope we need to be friendly to 
> wsgi with or without a zodb and show both sides of the coin - 
> that CA + choice of backend + zope security + choice of 
> traversal method (with publisher) == interesting, productive, 
> mature, dynamic and efficient.

Sounds interesting but let's put that on the todo later list.

Regards
Roger Ineichen
_____________________________
END OF MESSAGE

> On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 3:06 PM, Roger Ineichen 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi
> >
> >> Betreff: Re: [Zope-dev] Dependencies and future of zope 3
> >>
> >> On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 11:41 AM, Stephan Richter 
> >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >> > For several packages we took the following approach. 
> Most packages 
> >> > that have browser packages are in zope.app; for example, 
> >> > zope.app.folder (we did not convert this package yet). We
> >> then took the API and moved it to zope.folder.
> >>
> >> Maybe we should create a new namespace package for "browser" code.
> >>
> >> How about "zope.browser"?
> >
> > Most packages which are interesting for reuse provide more or less 
> > only ZMI related views.
> >
> > What about zope.zmi if they provide views for the ZMI. This 
> views are 
> > allmost unuseable outside the ZMI (know as Rotterdam skin)
> >
> > Regards
> > Roger Ineichen
> >
> >> --
> >> Benji York
> >> Senior Software Engineer
> >> Zope Corporation
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