Martijn Faassen wrote: [snip] > So how can we have better discussions? > > We can have better discussions by helping me. > > How can you help me? Of course it helps if you agree with me. I realize > that's frequently infeasible, but I certainly wouldn't mind. :) > > If you disagree with me, I'd like you to try to understand my concerns > as much as you possibly can. In addition, try acknowledge my concerns as > much as you possibly can without feeling you're lying. This works beter > than just rejecting them.
Chris McDonough pointed out to me that I didn't help in that discussion by not making my own individual concerns clear. I contributed to the problem by talking about abstract responsibilities instead of focusing on concrete needs of myself and people I know about. So: I actually *need* the zope.app information (and a well-tested zope.app) in transitioning applications (in Zope 3 or Grok) I work on the ZTK. As a Grok developer I also need that info to help transition Grok and Grok users to the ZTK. This way we can port Grok and our applications to ZTK and zope.app.* first, and then when the tests run, slowly change the imports to strip away zope.app.* dependencies. Like what we did with the ZTK itself, in fact. I'd like to share the burden of maintaining zope.app* with others. I hope those of you who want to improve the ZTK also will help in making sure zope.app.* doesn't suddenly break. I wasn't very successful in explaining all that before, so perhaps it's clearer in the personal. Regards, Martijn _______________________________________________ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce https://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )