Martijn Faassen wrote:
> So how can we have better discussions?
> We can have better discussions by helping me.
> How can you help me? Of course it helps if you agree with me. I realize
> that's frequently infeasible, but I certainly wouldn't mind. :)
> If you disagree with me, I'd like you to try to understand my concerns
> as much as you possibly can. In addition, try acknowledge my concerns as
> much as you possibly can without feeling you're lying. This works beter
> than just rejecting them.
Chris McDonough pointed out to me that I didn't help in that discussion
by not making my own individual concerns clear. I contributed to the
problem by talking about abstract responsibilities instead of focusing
on concrete needs of myself and people I know about.
So: I actually *need* the zope.app information (and a well-tested
zope.app) in transitioning applications (in Zope 3 or Grok) I work on
the ZTK. As a Grok developer I also need that info to help transition
Grok and Grok users to the ZTK. This way we can port Grok and our
applications to ZTK and zope.app.* first, and then when the tests run,
slowly change the imports to strip away zope.app.* dependencies. Like
what we did with the ZTK itself, in fact.
I'd like to share the burden of maintaining zope.app* with others. I
hope those of you who want to improve the ZTK also will help in making
sure zope.app.* doesn't suddenly break.
I wasn't very successful in explaining all that before, so perhaps it's
clearer in the personal.
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