Hi Martijn,

* are we going to target Zope 3 only with this site, or Zope 2 as well? I wrote text to cover both, as Zope 2 is currently the breadwinner of most of us. I think we can get enthusiasm more easily for Zope 3 however; nobody is going to write Zope 2 tutorials. What do we do?

I would say, let's not bite off more than we can chew. Getting a punch web-site is not easy. The hard part is reducing the amount of content, not creating it. I'd say focus on Zope 3 for now - it's what we want to promote as the next big thing, it's what realistically holds a candle to e.g. Rails and it's more "pythonic" in the sense that the rest of the python world may take more of an interest in it.

* we need to answer the question whether we want a famous low-amounts-of-minutes "how do you build app Foo in Zope 3" screencast. If so, someone will need to design it.

I think Paul Everitt has done some screen casts before. You should talk to him about his experiences and what software he uses.

* are we going to do a newsletter or not? I worry about having it be up to date, but if we get some volunteers I'm not against it. If this turns out to be hard, then we'd better focus on the website, not a newsletter, as this gives us far more marketing pay-off. (zope.org is currently anti-marketing zope)

Who subscribes to a newsletter? :-)

Again, let's do the big-wins first. Newsletters can be added if the traffic and volunteers warrant it.


* we need inspired writers to improve the texts and organize it further. We need a good marketing message.

I don't think I'm far enough into zope 3 to come up with much of this, but I'm quite good with reviewing text and making sure it's clear, concise and punchy. I'd certainly like to help with that.

* we need screencasts! Besides the how to make a CMS in 5 minutes screencast mentioned above, we can build tutorials on how to set up things, install things, make first steps.

Yep. Paul may be able to offer some advice (or even help) here.

* we need start collecting Zope 3 documentation we can put online. We need to mine what's there online right now, approach the creators with a proposal for a new home (we could even have a mockup of it all in the grand new design, see next point), and process the documents so we can
include it.

I would caution against throwing everything in there that is vaguely good. Quality must be the first priority, and seriously - no wikis. This would need review and control, not the potential to grow into another zope.org. Existing documents would probably need to be reformatted for style and layout, and we'd have to think carefully about providing a good picture.

I actually quite like the Django tutorial (http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/tutorial1) because it's easy to follow, bite-sized, and I could get a pretty good idea of how it works by skimming the code + screenhots and skipping most of the text.

As a visitor, I need to have a single place to start, and a clear path through the information, not just a dump of information that I have to wade through myself. And most importantly, all the documentation (and I mean all of it) needs to be consistent, not only in style and message, but in the development patterns presented. I know zope 3 is powerful and great, but don't throw every combination out there all at once. People who want to invest in the framework will have plenty of time to discover all that. What we need to do is make it feasible for them to take that plunge.

* does anyone know a good web designer who can design a solid looking, serious, but still exciting website for zope?

We need one. Coders make poor visual designers. :)

Who is volunteering for some of this? I'm going to help out with the writing and will try to keep up my general nagging so we can push this forward, but we need more people.

I'd like to be nagged, more than anything. Kick me enough times, and I'll help :)

It's been very quiet on this list lately, and we need more noise. :)

/me shouts a little



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