Re-reading my email I kinda put the emphasis in the wrong area. If we need more design then I would like to get it right of couse the existing isn't too bad so maybe we don't need it so much just a little bit for differiantion purposes.

The main thing is the content. I would be keen to do some demos/simulations as well as getting together the existing howtos and making sure they are up to date.

The 4 items sum it up and the content behind those is the main thing.


Peter Simmons wrote:

Hi Andrew,

Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks to Christian T also for the idea in the first place.

Do you help keep up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area)

I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. I truly do believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much better. I know from experience that have the site (the front page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I think we could do the same for Zope 3.

The items

1) What is Zope 3?
2) Why use Zope 3?
3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks?
4) How do I get started?

Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple to begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I believe we need to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going on just on these basic items. We should really only expand if these are completely up to date and we have spare resource.


Andrew Sawyers wrote:

That's excellent Peter!  I don't want any money, but would be cool to
find the best use for it....
Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day,
he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available
funds:  hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and
bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for
their site. I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds
and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets
established. Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'.

Andrew Sawyers

On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote:
Hi All,

I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3.

I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off.

I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help with this when it gets up and running.

I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site to help people organise funding for projects similar to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this kinda thing.

Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding into place and get this thing going?


As I see it, Zope 3's central marketing issue is the lack of a
coherent online identity.  There needs to be a single place that
answers the following questions:

1) What is Zope 3?
2) Why use Zope 3?
3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks?
4) How do I get started?

Largely, this is assembly of the Zope 3 FrontPage, philikon's first
two chapters, and the "appetizer" quick start guides on worldcookery. However, I would also love to see a section on the lead developers
answering Q1-Q3.  And this would be in conjunction with conveying...

Zope3's shtick:  Zope3 is not flashy.  Zope3 does not put pastel
colors on its website. Zope3 is the no-nonsense, industrial strength
platform.  It's where you come when you want to do it right.  It was
coded with the most rigorous standards by a bunch of hard-nosed sons
of bitches who don't have time for froofy marketing :) . And so forth.
This would come across in lead dev's answering Q1-Q3.

And finally, the site should demonstrate the "industrial strength"
quality with examples.  Little snippets from developers of SchoolTool,
corporate users, and so forth should demonstrate "hey, we're for real,
and we don't mess around -- you give me an animated screenshots, I
raise you a XYZ transaction per day uber site".  In a sense, we'd want
to portray ourselves as the Chuck Norris[1] of web platforms  :)
Bottom line, a coherent online identity would go a long way.  Instead
of doing some snazzy marketings, let's communicate the character that
Zope3 does have.  It sounds like under ZF might be the ideal
way to do this,

As for codenames, this is just one way we could help create a coherent
online identity.  I certainly think release names would be fun (and
not distracting to the central "Zope 3" brand we'd want).  Overall, I
think the time has come for communication of Zope 3 identity to move
hand in hand with development.


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