On Sep 16, 2005, at 6:15 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:

On Friday, September 16, 2005 3:58 PM, Gary Poster wrote:

You could also be asking about the pipeline ideas, but that's not my
first guess. :-)

Yes, I suspect this is what I'm missing.

Maybe so.  Maybe you just disagree.  :-)

In a later email, you and Benji discuss how this might be used for dynamic JavaScript. Benji made the point that that is not what we are talking about. I agree with him, but I think I see your confusion.

We expect that the pipelining ideas will lead to a reasonable way to transform output. We hope to leverage that for the resourcelibrary. You could certainly leverage the method yourself, for your own means. The resourcelibrary use case is one of the simple stories that is pushing pipelining--a much larger and more exciting development, I think--along right now.

To explore your use case further, though, I'm not sure why you would need something like resourcelibrary for dynamically generated insertions--that is, JavaScript code that the server writes differently for each request. You can just include that inline. The resourcelibrary makes sure that you only include a single instance of the necessary libraries, makes sure that CSS is at the top, as it has to be, and so on. These combined requirements led us to the current approach.

There was an earlier post about Ajax. It seems an entirely new approach would be needed to solidly support Ajax. I.e. we would need an architecture that let components interact independently of the browser view, or at least could be accessed in isolation of a full page rendering. Is this the sort of thing the 'pipeline' approach is getting at?

No. Pipelining is about taking what the Zope publisher spits out, and then transforming it before returning it to the user. For instance, views might spit out an XHTML snippet, and pipelines would wrap it. Or views might spit out XML of data only, and pipelines would make transform it into a UI. Or views might spit out non- string objects, which would be transformed. And so on.

I don't think Ajax needs an entirely new approach--at least what I would mean by "an entirely new approach". :-) I'm working out some proposals for that in the new widget code that was started in the sprint. I'll hope to talk about that soonish (though I have a number of other projects I have to wrap up before I get to that :-/ ).

The use of ajax libraries will benefit from something like resourcelibrary. Other than that the two are not that related.

To get back to your concerns about the resourcelibrary (and conclude), it is currently a drop-in component (from which you can easily opt out) and the pipeline plans should make that even more the case. You'll just be opting out of any shared rich widgets and shared composite page projects that use it. Since you've forked the widget code, it sounds like that sort of thing might not phase you. :-)

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