Gary Poster wrote: > FWIW, we're trying to reduce the "frightening" and "magical" aspect > of the glue. :-) That said, glue still has its place, and I think > zcml is actually working out pretty well overall.
I take no small amount of comfort in strange frequency of finding Shane Hathaway's "Zope 3 Frustration" blog entry showing up in my various google search results ... and the term "frustration" isn't even in my search terms, honest! (-; I say to myself... if Shane is frustrated... how can I *not* be at least a little confused? Anyhow, more specifically, his mention of not being able to find any debugging tools for ZCML I think is fairly a strong indictment. But that's another topic. > http://www.benjiyork.com/quick_start.txt Ah thanks for this pointer. Can't have too many beginner tutorials. I've read a few already and considered maybe writing one from a slightly different perspective than those i've yet seen, if I survive... I don't think my problem is so much the code, or even the alien ZCML api actually... mine seems to me is a conceptual problem (if i may say... and I believe all of my correspondants on this thread have also have been not shy at pointing out in their own ways). I understand the theory of the Zope 3 approach... small adaptors rather than big classes/inheritance. I understand also that this is an approach designed to scale for large projects, while it may be a bit cumbersome for small things. I think i'd have a lot less problem with Zope 3 actually I was coming at it as a beginner. I'd just accept what I read without reading more into it and trying to refocus it through the prism of my existing code bases and experiences. So I wonder if my difficulties aren't in large part due to all the past coding and structural baggage, so to speak. I just can't seem (yet) to make the clean divisions the way Zope 3 wants, or see how Zope 3 fits those parts together, despite all of the simple examples I've so far been exposed to. All of the tutorials and books I've seen so far hit things from a code/test driven perspective... maybe if i read enough of them though one day (as was the case with me *finally* for Zope 2) the whole puzzle will suddenly start to click together. I find it interesting though that while the object oriented paradigm seemed pretty immediately intuitive and practical when I learnt it so many years ago, for some reason the adaptor paradigm doesn't sink in... but rolls around in my brain like so many beads of mercury. Again, I understand the concepts, but the practical usage just doesn't seem to click. (This despite having read the Shaver/Plug example in the Zope documentation many times (and the other metaphors in various other documents and docstrings), which makes perfect sense in the abstract, and perfect sense in the little examples... yet... when i go to try to use it somehow it slips utility of it slips away from me...) Perhaps it's just me. But, perhaps not... But I ramble again. > if IRequest.providedBy(p): Ha! Something's got to provide an IRequest in there eh. That's wicked. (-; I fear Andreas Jung may be planning on hunting you down and killing you for publishing this to the list. Or even worse... he may suggest you doing something to yourself that involves... PHP. Thanks, though. _______________________________________________ Zope3-users mailing list Zope3email@example.com http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope3-users