Neil,
In some ways they may be even more harmful. Network outages have their own fixes, hardware failures have replacements, deleted data (should) have backups.
Solutions for bad process and policy due to architecture decisions? Not as cut and dry, and could be most costly in the long run as the problems compound. I know we just did an analysis of the cost of directory remediation due to cleaning up bad data stemming from bad processes. It is easily in the 6 digits when you factor in manpower, systems, delaying of applications due to bad data, etc.
A root domain may not be the cause of such things, but how the environment will be managed and the pitfalls should be thought of.
Jef
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justification
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 15:20:45 +0100
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
I doubt a root domain would represent 'harm' in your terms, but then again, harm may mean different things to different people.From an architectural stance, harm means a whole lot more. What about added admin overhead; additional hardware costs, support and maintenance; additional complexities which are the result of deploying extra domains; etc etc. These are 'harmful' to the firm in the same way as a network outage is, IMHO.my 2 penneth,neil
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rocky Habeeb
Sent: 28 April 2006 14:51
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justificationGil,I hear that all the time, plus "Hey Rocky, where's Bullwinkle?" Hee hee hee.Anyway, for people like me who couldn't see Dean and joe and all the rest of youse guys even if I had the Hubble telescope, because you're so far out there, and who go to bed each night praying, "Dear God, thank you for not putting me into Disaster Recovery Mode today!" harm means the network is down. Period. Case closed. End of story. That's harm in my book. Forget the actual reason, it's not important.In that situation, I don't care about economics or the fact that I have a couple extra servers in a root domain that technically I could have lived without.I need concrete, specific reasons why it is detrimental to have a root domain.Where am I gonna get hurt, in such a fashion that I won't have to worry about praying at night because I'll be spending all night at work rebuilding a Forest with a phone glued to my ear and some guy from Zimbabwe who claims to be working for PSS trying to help me?RH__________________________________________-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gil Kirkpatrick
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 6:27 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justificationHey Rocky,Watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat!Sorry, just had to get that out of my system. Most people on the list won't have a clue as to what I'm talking about anyway...In any case, how do increased operational costs and overhead not qualify as "harm"? I'm confused by your question...-gil
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rocky Habeeb
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 12:03 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justification"Where's the harm?"Don't tell me about economics or overhead or other things.Tell me where the "harm" is.Please.RH_________________________________-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 2:49 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justificationJef,
We don’t have a root domain because somebody smarter than I made that decision before I took over. I was convinced at the time we had made a mistake, but like you have come to the opposite conclusion.
J
AL
Al Maurer
Service Manager, Naming and Authentication Services
IT | Information Technology
Agilent Technologies
(719) 590-2639; Telnet 590-2639
http://activedirectory.it.agilent.com
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jef Kazimer
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 9:51 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justification
Al,
If you had asked me in the year 2000, I could see issues that would drive a root domain to anchor multiple domains. I would caution against it now. I believe MS had the same stance, and now thinks it may not make as much sense as it once did.
Maybe they should re-evaluate their service offerings. :) I admit I was wrong :)
Jef
> Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justification
> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2006 08:03:19 -0600
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
>
> Mark,
>
> I'm in the same place you are: single forest, single domain, but 30 DCs in a global deployment with 45k users and 37k computers. Ran that way for 6 years.
>
> Now we've sold off a business unit of a couple thousand users and they outsourced to a big 3rd party service provider who insisted they go with an empty root. I recommended against it, but the sourcer (whose initials are E.D.S.) claimed the configuration was supported by Microsoft and they that had run it by Microsoft for "approval."
>
> I think what it boils down to is that this is their standard service and that's that. The guys I'm working with are quite knowledgeable and good at what they do, but they're the front line people and not the deep-thinking architects we find at DEC.
>
> AL
>
> Al Maurer
> Service Manager, Naming and Authentication Services
> IT | Information Technology
> Agilent Technologies
> (719) 590-2639; Telnet 590-2639
> http://activedirectory.it.agilent.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Parris
> Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 7:37 AM
> To: ActiveDir.org
> Subject: [ActiveDir] Root Place Holder justification
>
> Does anyone have any official documentation as to the justification for a root place holder, pro's and con's ?
>
> Where I am - I have started at one domain and can see no reason to expand on that - they only have 6 DC's now in a single domain - yet the partner they have chosen is recomending a root place holder with 5 DC's and then 8 in the child domain (they are NOT even supplying the tin) and I wanted some decent amo - a little bit stronger than schema and Ent admin separation.
>
> I know at DEC the concensus was the desire to eliminate and I believe Guido and Wook have stated this for the past two DEC's
>
> I have searched this list and can find no relevant articles.
>
> Many thanks
>
> Regards
>
> Mark
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