>Hopefully, people hold
themselves to higher standards than that. .. Don't you think?
-:)
*** What would INDIANS know about that :-)?
At 8:26 PM -0600 2/20/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
Dear Umesh,
>Finally I had to tell him that now laws are strict agianst fraud marraige and that I might have to pay up >$250,000 and upto five years in jail and then be thrown back to India. then he quieted down.
......
>You take advantage of the laws. Since it has become more difficult ot come to US or UK many students are >going to Australia , Canada etc -0taking advantage of their laws.
I am surprised - but may be I am naive. Laws are man made, and there will be loop holes.
That, I hope certainly does not mean one should take advantage of.
But just because one is aware of a loop hole ( and is able to take advantage of), I hope it doesn't mean that one would want to take that "advantage", simply because they can get away with it.
Hopefully, people hold themselves to higher standards than that. .. Don't you think? -:)
--Ram da
On 2/20/06, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram-da,You do know a lot about the system :)Incidently a well meaning uncle had been trying to pursuade me vigorously recently that I get a lawyer to get me "married" on paper and later divorce on paper after 2 years. He said why spend so much trying to go for H-1B visa and then for Green Card. Go straight for Green Card thru marraige.Finally I had to tell him that now laws are strict agianst fraud marraige and that I might have to pay up $250,000 and upto five years in jail and then be thrown back to India. then he quieted down. You might recall the case of a brother-sister marriage last year (from Gujarat) to help the brother get to US .It is also true that the system exists - just like the tax system -whereby one can take advantage of the various exemptions available -and work to your best advantage. Thats what these CPAs etc are for (in tax) and others for other stuff. It is upto the govt (india or US etc) to decide whether they want to give those exemptions or not and whom they want to benefit. For instance, US allows for citizenship by birth and after Green Card -- most of Europe and japan do not.You take advantage of the laws. Since it has become more difficult ot come to US or UK many students are going to Australia , Canada etc -0taking advantage of their laws.Umesh
Ram Sarangapani <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Umesh,>but I recollected doing an assignment doing my program at Harvard on quantitative analysis of Welfare >payments in different states in USA -- and trying to see if racism and political ideologies caused them to vary so >much the data was from US Gov sources:I hope Harvard isn't 'doling' out them A's like the 'welfare system' -:)>That US or European poor can and do go to poor nations like India or Thailand and live well - on welfare>dolesFaulty assumption and theories again. The 'poor' in the US do get welfare 'doles', but it is not as easy to get those. You not only have to be poor, but also to prove every week (I think) to welfare officials that you are really poor and fill out all sorts of paperwork.I don believe one can get welfare checks while you are globe-trotting.Welfare checks too are limited to a short period. They are expected to attend classes to learn better skills so that they can get out of it.But social welfare is just that - the moral responsibility for a society (like the US) to take care of the least fortunate amonst us. That I think, we should not begrudge nor should we attach a stigma to it. But the system needs reforms - so that only those who need to get it, get it. In fact, there are many (Indians among them too) who live pay check to pay check and are a stone's throw from welfare.Now, it may be possible to live in a country like Mexico and come here to get them checks, but thats about it.I don't where you got this, but its all humbug to say the least.But there are some 'business' people who come from India, who do take complete and absolute advantage of the system. But most of the time its illegal or they found some loophole and are scams.Here are some I have heard over the years:-Worldwide Life insurance bought on an uncle while the uncle is here. Uncle ofcourse dies while in India - the poor nephew collects -as they get the death certificate from India.JC Penny was scammed a number of times - this scam is well-known now.- Insurance on a grocery store (desi). Of course the store burns down, and the all distraught desi has lost everything, collects. Also well-known now.-Desi businesses also played around a lot with bankruptcy laws. Borrow to the hilt- declare bankruptcy, collect later from relative... The laws are now tougher.All this only show the desi view of life (albiet a small section). Pakistanis/B'deshis also included in the list. Often they think they are too damn smart for their own good.It is some these enterprising souls who when they visit the desh tell the natives how 'great life is in the United States', and how best to beat the syshtem.You are far more intelligent than that, and I hope you don't fall for these tall stories.--Ram da
On 2/20/06, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:
C-da and Ram-da,I am not so conversant with US welfare system but I recollected doing an assignment doing my program at Harvard on quantitative analysis of Welfare payments in different states in USA -- and trying to see if racism and political ideologies caused them to vary so much the data was from US Gov sources:However, since last year the course S:30 has changed a lot -for the better (many of us had also suggested that it be overhauled) and that assignment is no longer there.But that assignment goes to show that US govt has a system of welfare payments to poor. Thats exactly what I was driving at. That US or European poor can and do go to poor nations like India or Thailand and live well - on welfare doles. Maybe Europeans constitute more of the Hippies who have made India their home since they get more dole.more info: http://post.economics.harvard.edu/hier/2001papers/HIER1933.pdf (Harvard study: Why USA does not have a Europe styled welfare state)http://www.city-journal.org/html/5_2_californias.htmlhttp://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-212.htmlhttp://www.acf.hhs.gov/news/press/1999/welsum30.htmUmeshPS: my intro from the assignment discussing the issue of welfare paymentshttp://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k3677&pageid=icb.page17081
S 030
INTRODUCTION: The PredictorVariables
1.In the last assignment we found that nearly one third of the variation in welfare grants ( outcome variable GRANT) across states was associated with the cost of living (predictor Log2Col) in the states. But cost of living does not tell the whole story . Now we analyze the contention by two researchers (Mr Primus and Ms Lav.)
Mr Primus says that racism is responsible for the remaining variation, so he has gathered data of the racial composition of each state and tried to explain how the proportion of whites to non whites in the population of a state (predictor variable RATIO) might be responsible for the remaining variation in GRANT values.The data does show that there is a lot of variation in the racial composition among states. Mississippi has the lowest ratio of (RATIO = 1.7 ) whites to non whites and also has the lowest welfare ( GRANT = 120,) whereas Vermont, which has the highest GRANT values (GRANT = 650) among all states, also has the highest ratio (RATIO = 80.6) of whites to non-whites.
Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Exactly Ram.
First off, retirement benefits are NOT 'dole' -- handouts -- or charity. We ought to know what these words mean before we throw them around. More so when we do that in condescension. Similarly, retirement benefits are NOT unemployment insurance benefits.
Anyway, unemployment insurance premiums are paid for by the EMPLOYER. It is required by state law.
401 K is a retirement savings plan, that an employee contributes towards. The savings are invested by the trustees in different instruments, like the stock-market. The income is re-invested, and it grows tax free. Sometimes an employer would ADD a percentage of the employee's contribution to the amount. It is like a bonus, or an incentive, to save. But it is the employee's money. NOT a DOLE.
At 2:37 PM -0600 2/20/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
Umesh,
However, as I read somewhere, some become citizens in the West and return in old age to their poor countires and survive very nicely on the generous unemployment dole (as do Hippies)
I don't know about other countries, US Citizens who retire in India at old age, don't get unemployment benefits. What they get is retirement benefits from Social Security (which they paid into all their working lives), 401 K/457 K retirement (which they also contributed, 100% or part contributions), or other retirement saving's plans.
Even "unemployment doles" are NOT freebees as some would like to assume. Unemployement insurance is paid to the govt. by employers and it lasts only for a short period.
Often, employers' rates rise when ex-employees claim unemployement benefits. So many employers make it look like those who make such claimaints are dead-beats and a drag on society.
I would argue, that its the cost of doing business, and everyone who is unemployed (laid off) is entitled to it and no stigma be attached to it.
Am not sure if employees somehow also pay into the unemp. insurance scheme. Maybe someelse can enlighten us.
--Ram da
On 2/20/06, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
My note: In 2004 summer Olympics at Athens the basketball Gold went to obscure and poor Peurto Rico -who beat longstanding champions - USA. How? -- by watching the videos of games played by Michael "Air" Jordan and Chicago Bulls --and playing accrodingly. Modern communication means knowledge can be trasferred easily across the globe. The secrets are out. Countries, companies across the world are quick to adopt tactics and strategies being currently used by Western ones.
Umesh
PS: However, for poor countries like India there are millions who would love to work in the West -for the one who opts to go back. However, as I read somewhere, some become citizens in the West and return in old age to their poor countires and survive very nicely on the generous unemployment dole (as do Hippies)
---------------------------------
article's Best quote:
In his book Thomas Friedman puts it another way: "In China today, Bill Gates is Britney Spears. In America today, Britney Spears is Britney Spears--and that is our problem."
..."That is especially true in China, where the government has put its muscle behind an all-out effort to transform homegrown science. "Ten years ago in China, it was virtually all derivative stuff," says Chu. "Students would sit and listen and try to capture every word. Now they're asking lots of questions." During a 100th-anniversary celebration for Peking University a few years ago, Chu found himself seated next to China's Minister for Education. "She was asking for my autograph," he says, shaking his head. "It was totally topsy-turvy. Can you imagine in the U.S. the Secretary of Education fawning on a Nobel prizewinner? It just won't happen."
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Cover
http://www.time.com/time/archive/preview/0,10987,1156575,00.htmlAre We Losing Our Edge?
The U.S. still leads the world in scientific innovation. But years of declining investment and fresh competition from abroad threaten to end our supremacy
By MICHAEL D. LEMONICK
Feb. 13, 2006
Gabriel Aeppli was born in Switzerland, but when he was 1 year old, his father came to the U.S. to pursue a career as a mathematician. Back then, America was a scientific "city on the hill," a place where enormous resources, academic freedom, a tradition of skepticism and a history of excellence lured everyone from astronomers to zoologists from all over the world, and like Aeppli's father, many of them never had any interest in leaving.
Aeppli, now 48, attended M.I.T., where he got a Ph.D. in electrical engineering, and went on to work at Bell Labs, the legendary research arm of AT&T. Then he moved on to the NEC research laboratory, outside Princeton, N.J., as a senior research scientist. But while industrial labs used to be well-funded havens for freewheeling scientific inquiry, says Aeppli, "my career was limited because opportunities to lead were very few." So he left for an academic job in Britain. He now holds a chair in physics at University College London and also directs the London Center for Nanotechnology. "I've been able to start with a clean sheet of paper and create something unique in a world-class city," he says. "We doubt that could be done anywhere else."
Umesh Sharma
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Umesh Sharma
5121 Lackawanna ST
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1-202-215-4328 [Cell Phone]
Ed.M. - International Education Policy
Harvard Graduate School of Education,
Harvard University,
Class of 2005
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