I apologize for going off topic, but has anyone experienced delays when sending with gmane? My sent messages show up almost instantly on commons-dev and commons-user, but on the maven lists it takes 15 minutes or so, and on the ant lists it sometimes takes up to 12 hours. Is there a known reason for the delay?
Craig R. McClanahan wrote:
Emmanuel Bourg wrote:
It seems some prefer to keep the commit messages in the list, and others prefer a clean list with just the discussions. So what about this :-1. Doing things this way (and it's been this way for several years now on nearly every Jakarta project) is a critical success factor in assuring the quality and popularity of the software created here.
- commons-dev : discussions + cvs messages - commons-cvs : only the cvs messages - commons-talk: only the discussions
or maybe easier to set up :
- commons-dev : only the discussions
- commons-cvs : only the cvs messages
- commons-commiters : discussions + cvs messages (this list is subscribed to commons-dev and commons-cvs with a Reply-To header set to commons-dev)
This would suit to everyone.
Emmanuel
Developer lists are for the people developing the packages, and those folks need to see the commits at all times in order to understand what is changing, in addition to their responsibility to review commits at all times. Because it's open source, we're perfectly happy for non-developers to listen in, offer suggestions, and do their own reviews as well -- but a dev list is the fundamental working tool for the people actually developing the code. It therefore needs to be set up to meet *their* needs.
If you want discussions and conversations about packages, without the commit messages, that's what the user list is for. On most user lists, the developers hang out as well, and will answer questions about what's coming up in addition to how to use the package.
If you want to see isolated discussions for a particular commons package, encourage the developers for that package to create their own specialized -dev and -user lists, like the httpclient folks did. (I personally wouldn't mind if the [math] folks did that, but it's totally up to them -- I've got a filter for their traffic, which includes a whole lot more discussion than it does CVS commits, by the way :-).
If you just want to lurk on the developer lists, but still reduce the message count, subscribe in digest mode instead. Then, you'll get all the messages for each day in one single message instead of individually.
If you've got NNTP access, consider reading the groups through a newsgroup interface. For example, the news server at <http://gmane.org> mirrors many mailing lists, including this one (news host is news.gmane.org, newsgroup is "gmane.comp.jakarta.commons.devel").
But, at the end of the day, if you are using a mail reader that can't filter, get a new mail reader. I'm sorry, but it's hard to be sympathetic with that argument in this day and age.
Craig
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