IIRC under official Japanese rules at the end of the game all groups with liberties shared between opposing colours are by definition in seki. Therefore eventually (before counting) all dame have to be filled.
Further, playing dame points is almost equally bad under Chinese rules as it is under Japanese rules. So, if you have a strong 'Chinese' engine no special tricks are needed at least until you reach the endgame. The only thing that is severely penalized under Japanese rules is playing needless defensive moves inside your own territory while the opponent is passing. Erik On Thu, Nov 6, 2008 at 4:44 PM, Jason House <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think simplistic handling of Japanese rules should play dame points that > connect chains. This avoids some problems that can arise where ownership > probability drops after the opponent plays the dame, and a point of > territory must get filled. > > Even if not technically required, I can imagine bots acting like beginners > and get nervous over imagined vulnerabilites. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Nov 6, 2008, at 9:12 AM, Don Dailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> On Thu, 2008-11-06 at 09:19 +0100, "Ingo Althöfer" wrote: >>> >>> Hello all, two questions. >>> >>> (i) Do there exist strong 9x9-go programs on Monte-Carlo base >>> for Japanese rules? >>> >>> (ii) Having available only programs for Chinese rules, but playing >>> in a tournament with Japanese rules, which special tricks and >>> settings should be used to maximise winning chances? (This is meant >>> especially in the light of MC's tendency to win games by 0.5 >>> points according to the rules implemented.) >> >> I've thought about those questions myself from time to time. Let me >> think out loud concerning this. I am by know means an expert in >> Japanese scoring or even GO in general, so I'm just giving some thoughts >> here and a plan for building a Japanese "simple" bot that you can be >> free to criticize: >> >> It seems to me the primary difference between the two is knowing when to >> stop playing and of course scoring dead groups. The Chinese style bots >> do not technically need to know about scoring. >> >> You can look at the combined statistics at the end of the games for a >> given point to get a sense of whether that point is still in play or >> whether it's a forgone conclusion. You can do the same to determine >> dead groups. I don't know how well that works in all cases, but I have >> used it and it works pretty well. >> >> But we also want to recognize dame, and not play to dame points early >> in the game even if it doesn't affect the final Chinese outcome. So >> here is my idea: >> >> 1. If ALL the stones of a particular group belong to the opponent with >> high certainty, they are dead. >> >> 2. If there are open spaces that belong to you or the opponent with >> high certainty don't move to them. >> >> 3. If an uncertain point is touching stones of both colors and both >> colors have high certainty for the color they belong to, it is probably >> dame and you shouldn't move to them. >> >> example: White has a stone on d4 that is clearly alive. >> Black has a stone on f4 that is clearly alive. >> An empty point on e4 is highly uncertain. >> Do not play to e4 - it is probably dame. >> >> question: Is that a reasonably good rule or does it need some work? >> >> >> 4. If you have no moves other than these cases, you should pass. >> >> You can test this idea by playing a bot on KGS under Japanese rules. >> You may have to tweak what you consider your uncertainty margin. Also, >> I'm not considering seki here but we would want to find a way to cope >> with that. >> >> - Don >> >> >> >>> Ingo. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> computer-go mailing list >> computer-go@computer-go.org >> http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ > > _______________________________________________ > computer-go mailing list > computer-go@computer-go.org > http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ > _______________________________________________ computer-go mailing list computer-go@computer-go.org http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/
