EV Digest 5635
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Burned Motor
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: String equalization and lifetime, was: Taurus EV
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) RE: Protecting the zilla
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Protecting the zilla
by Martin Klingensmith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) E-Meter serial isolator
by "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Protecting the zilla
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Evaporative cooling media
by "Steven Potter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Tire Info Link
by Patrick Maston <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Evaporative cooling media
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Install a DC-DC converter or keep as is?
by nikki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Install a DC-DC converter or keep as is?
by nikki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by "Michael Perry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) RE: Tire Info Link
by "Jody Dewey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) RE: Automatic transmission viable for drag racing
by "Jody Dewey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: EV for a different customer.
by "Jonathan Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: E-Meter serial isolator
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: Burned Motor
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- Begin Message ---
Hey John
I posted this same message to Bob's update on Tony's nightmare. I wanted to
copy it here so you didn't miss it. How hard was that for you to have to film
it while it happened, OMG! Anyway here's what I posted back to Bob about fire
damaged motors. I'm sure all our hearts go out to you guys and we're all
hoping and wishing you both new starts.
Hey Bob, Tony, (now John) All
As far as the motor goes it is hard to say. They do burn armatures in bake
out ovens to get the left over copper and insulation out before rewinding them,
but it's a controlled thing. I had an interesting talk with an armature guy a
while back who started talking about heat damaging the laminations on the
armature body. He stated if super heated they lost thier ability to function
properly. I wasn't totally convinced and it ended up sounding like tech (BS)
to keep from having to warranty it on top of getting more money for a new core,
lmao! Now if we are talking a super heated shaft, then I'd say there is a good
chance that the temper of the metal could be in fact compromized. These shafts
are not that hard to begin with but...
With that said it's hard to generalize and say yes or no as to whether a
motor is still rebuildable after a fire. Like Bob said you're looking at an
armature wind with comm probably for sure (on top of replacing all the soft
brush assy guts), Hmmm, might be a good test subject for my Kevlar comm
banding. Band that charcoaled marshmellow and rev it up for some interesting
data on the Kevlar, hehehe. Sorry to joke, but it's that or cry right?? If
in fact the field coils survived, and the motor isn't a pile of goo so to speak
there actually might be hope to save some money on rebuilding it. On a worst
case, I'd keep any end plates and such that might be still whole as I've heard
of people damaging thiers and at least something would live on. I'm truely
sorry to hear about your loss. I hope all goes well for you soon, and you'll
be announcing the births of new EV's soon.
I see there's been another fire (what a bitch!) and I will copy this posting
to the "burned motor" thread rather than hoping John L.will see this here.
Best wishes
Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
---------------------------------
How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cor van de Water wrote:
>
> Lee,
>
> I have the UniversalPowerGroup UB121100 AGMs, 12V 110Ah (80 Ah at
> 1 hour discharge rate)...
Ok. Little is known about how this battery will work. Take good records;
you're doing an experiment!
> battery needs to lie on its side (allowed according the manufacturer)...
That should work. There may be minor differences in performance. The
main problem would be if they gas; they might vent liquid instead of
gas!
> Having one string iso 2 keeps one of the major headaches
Yes, that's a big improvement over the USE 2-string system.
> BTW: voltages that I mentioned are all at room temp, higher temps
> will get lower voltages.
That's normal.
> I am charging below 10A. I have an AC drive so the occasional
> hard braking puts over 100A back in the pack when they are below
> 80% SOC, so that wakes them up nicely if necessary.
Some AGMs benefit from high initial charge rates; others don't seem to
care. Hawkers seem to die early without high charge currents, but my
Concordes don't seem to care. I don't know what is different about their
construction that causes this.
> I know floodeds need to be charged with a good current and vigorously
> gassed from time to time, to break the stratification of the
> electrolyte in the cells.
Not really. That applies more to stationary batteries. Vehicle batteries
get shaken up just from normal travel. Mainly, you need to charge enough
to gas freely, just to reach full charge. The gassing should be done at
low current, to reduce heating and excessive gassing and the mess it
produces.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
David asked:
Is there something special about these GM products that I'm ignorant of?
Nor do I recall seeing any EV conversions of Vegas ...
never a Vega. Heck, here in the midwest, most of the Vegas rusted out so
fast that nobody would have had time to convert one!
Darin wrote:
David,
Chevy Vegas, and to a lesser extent, the Monza, are quite popular in ICE
drag racing. Simple really. You take a 70's car that GM thought was an
econo, high mileage, import fighter...
Ah yes, Chevy's wonderful Vega! When it was introduced in '71 as an
import fighter (Datsun was the #1 import then), those of us who had
already chosen to drive sensibly sized well made cars got quite a laugh
at GM's feeble attempt. Let's see....Chevy Vega got 25 mpg on average,
Datsun 510 got 31 on average...Chevy Vega was cramped inside due to over
zealous styling, Datsun 510 was very roomy inside with great head
room...Chevy Vega had poor driver's visibility due to over zealous
styling, Datsun 510 had great driver's visibility...Chevy Vega had a
monster sized (for back then) 2.3 liter 4 banger, an ugly odd shaped
motor that made a paltry 70 hp with its stock 1 barrel carb. and 85 hp
with the 'you have to pay extra for it' optional 2 barrel carb., Datsun
510's smaller but feisty 1600 cc engine (L16) was a gorgeous looking
engine that made a strong 96 hp, and all 510s came with this great
motor...Chevy Vega ran 0-60 in around 16 seconds, Datsun 510 did it in
13.5 (yeah, I know, cars are a lot faster today with 4 banger econo cars
with automatics running 0-60 in an average of 9 seconds)....Datsun 510
out cornered, out braked, and had a higher top speed than the Vega, too.
In an accident, you had better cross your fingers in a Vega, but the
Datsun 510 was legendary for its 'roll cage construction'. In the 2.5
Trans Am racing challenge, Vegas and Pintos were required to have roll
cages due to their questionable crash worthiness, Datsun 510 did
not....oh yeah, Datsun 510 dominated the series three years in a row,
beating Alfa Romeo, BMW, Vega, and Pinto. Side bar...Datsun's smaller
1200 dominated the C Production racing class series as well. Today, the
510 has collector status with clubs world wide, and you can still find
clean 510s in great shape, especially out west where we we do not use
salt on the roads....the Vega has a small following, but most are
recycled. The Vega was allowed to die in '78, replaced by the Chevy
Monza, also an ill fated not-so-great car.
So....what do ya do with a Vega who's horrible motor blew up at around
65,000 miles? You through out everything (none of it was worth much
anyhow) and save the cute looking body, stuff in go fast parts, and go
racing! What's of particular humor to me though, is to find a V8 Vega at
the track usually driven by a 'noth'in beats a V8' muscle car dude, and
watch get it's doors get blown off by a 600 hp 4 cylinder import. There
'are' some well prepared V8 Vegas that run 8 second 1/4 mile times, just
to keep the record straight.
Note: Near the end of its tortured life, a special limited edition Vega
was offered, the Cosworth Vega. Finally, the Vega had a real engine! The
dual overhead cam European made Cosworth 4 cylinder engine produced 110
hp, but by the time this engine was offered (for a hefty price tag) in
this sportiest model of Vega, Datsun's 1600 cc 4 cylinder motor had been
enlarged to 2 liters (L20B) which made 110 hp stock and it came as the
base engine in Datsuns. Imagine that, Datsun's 'base' engine made the
same power as GM's 'exotic' optional engine. GM just didn't get
it....sound familiar?
Though I'm certainly not a Vega fan, I do think a well set up electric
Vega that kicked butt at the track would be way cool...bring it on, Darin!
See Ya......John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff,
It looks as if the one buss bar contacts the case (Or is WAY too close)
Would you not prefer to have it isolated from the vehicle chassis?
Pedroman
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dave Cover
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 9:57 AM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Protecting the zilla
Jeff
Looks great. I'll be doing the same thing soon, so it's great to see others
examples. Needless to say, I've got lot's of questions. Here are just the
first few that come to mind. No complaints, it's all good.
Looks like you're using aluminum, are you riveting the box together, or
welding? Where will you put the hairball? Have you got you're contactors in
there? Did you make the fuse holder or buy it? Are you going to move some
air for cooling through the box? Whqat are you using to liquid cool the
Vicor, i.e. the backing plate (home made or bought?)
Thanks
Dave Cover
--- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I had allowed water to get to my Zila and Otmar had to fix it. SO, I
> am trying to rearrange under the hood and get the electronics into a
> box.
>
> I made lots of progress today and took some pictures. Hopefully there
> is enough of good ideas to offset the "why did he do that" ?.
>
> cvevs.jfs-tech.com under heading "putting the zilla in a box" are
> these 5 pictures
>
> http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00144.jpg titled Mmmm, bussbars
> http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00145.jpg Pump and resivoir
> http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00146.jpg Closeup of pump, this is a
> swiftech MCP 350, may be too small
> http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00147.jpg Water cooled vicor
> http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00148.jpg on to the radiator
>
> I was getting worried, things just weren't going right, but they
> started to come togather today.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It appears to be resting on a fiberglass board.
--
Martin K
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Jeff,
>It looks as if the one buss bar contacts the case (Or is WAY too close)
>Would you not prefer to have it isolated from the vehicle chassis?
>
>Pedroman
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>Behalf Of Dave Cover
>Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 9:57 AM
>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>Subject: Re: Protecting the zilla
>
>
>Jeff
>
>Looks great. I'll be doing the same thing soon, so it's great to see others
>examples. Needless to say, I've got lot's of questions. Here are just the
>first few that come to mind. No complaints, it's all good.
>
>Looks like you're using aluminum, are you riveting the box together, or
>welding? Where will you put the hairball? Have you got you're contactors in
>there? Did you make the fuse holder or buy it? Are you going to move some
>air for cooling through the box? Whqat are you using to liquid cool the
>Vicor, i.e. the backing plate (home made or bought?)
>
>Thanks
>
>Dave Cover
>
>--- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
>>I had allowed water to get to my Zila and Otmar had to fix it. SO, I
>>am trying to rearrange under the hood and get the electronics into a
>>box.
>>
>>I made lots of progress today and took some pictures. Hopefully there
>>is enough of good ideas to offset the "why did he do that" ?.
>>
>>cvevs.jfs-tech.com under heading "putting the zilla in a box" are
>>these 5 pictures
>>
>>http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00144.jpg titled Mmmm, bussbars
>>http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00145.jpg Pump and resivoir
>>http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00146.jpg Closeup of pump, this is a
>>swiftech MCP 350, may be too small
>>http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00147.jpg Water cooled vicor
>>http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00148.jpg on to the radiator
>>
>>I was getting worried, things just weren't going right, but they
>>started to come togather today.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello:
I am about to connect my laptop to the e-meter to get some data I need.
However, they suggest using an serial isolator because serial ground is
connected to (-) battery pack.
Most isolators I found 'just' isolate the data lines. I guess that is ok,
however, they need power from the connected units to run the opto
isolators. Is the E-meter supplying that voltages? Or what kind of
isolators are YOU using to play it safe?
Thanks.
Michaela
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In answer to daves questions.
Cut,bent and rivoted togather aluminum, a disaster, the bender wasn't
up to the task and I had to keep cutting things smaller and amaller and
pop-rivoting them in anyway. The welder at work never had a breaker
good enough to weld aluminum and I therfore have no seat time on
welding. I have lost acces to 90% of the shop, moved to another building
at work and I am probably changeing jobs so I loose the other 10% .
The hairball goes on the back wall behind the zilla, I can use a 4"
cable to the zilla. I will have more photos, the stuff is really
crammed in there.
The main contactor, is all I have and it is right there at the end of
that first copper bus-bar, an EV250A
The next busbar transitions up to the 1/4 fiberglass board they use in
motors. The fuse holder is just a 3/8 stainless bolt thru the fiberboard.
There is a nut on this side the board so when tightened up the board is
not in the electrical crush, this is critical.
I was thinking of a fan and a filter, mostly to keep it pressureized to
avoid water ingress and to clear out condensation if that is possible,
but I havent decided, The water cooling should cool the whole thing.
I made the heatsink for the vicor after work one night. This is one of
the parts I am thinking of offering when I get a little cnc shop going
in my garage next year, just for EV stuff. :-) It can be bolted on the
bottom and accept a vicor on each side.
http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00078.jpg
http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00079.jpg
http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00080.jpg
I post pictures and links with no attention to a web page yet on
http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
While pondering options for how to cool a battery pack with (relatively
hot) ambient air flow I came across some interesting material at:
http://www.kuulpads.com/main.html
http://www.portacool.com shows how the stuff is used with fans in
industrial scale coolers.
The material looks like a craft paper honeycomb held together with some
kind of resin; specifically designed for evaporative cooling
applications.
I'm thinking of a design that would incorporate a large air scoop in
front of my battery box (with a variable damper) that would force air
through a frame that holds this kind of material. Provide a small water
pump to wet the media when extra cooling is required; take it out for
winter driving.
Anyone ever tried something like this?
Steven Potter, Toronto
'98 Ranger
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.10/383 - Release Date: 7/7/2006
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cor and Steven,
Here is a link to info on some LRR tires:
http://www.greenseal.org/resources/reports/CGR_tire_rollingresistance.pdf.
I purchased my Sumitomo HTR200s from Discount Tire. Although they don't
carry them in stock, I just called them on the phone and asked them to order
them for me. Took 3 days to get them shipped in.
Or, you can purchase them here:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Sumitomo&model=HTR+200 , have them
shipped to you, then have a local tire shop install them for you.
The Sumitomos aren't the lowest RR tires you can get, but they are priced
right.The Bridgestone B381 cost a lot more and are only available in a limited
size selection.
Good luck,
Patrick
From: Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Tire info link / weight of wheels question
Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 18:05:35 -0700
Steven,
You have a Ranger.
Wheel weight is quite irrelevant for a truck, unless you drag-race it.
My truck has Tigerpaws, I inflated them to 50 PSI to reduce the
rolling resistance.
See http://evalbum.com/694
I am currently shopping around for decently priced LRR tires for
my classic Prius.
It came OEM with Bridgestone Potenza RE92 XL but those are
shockingly expensive in most shops.
Alternatives are the Sumitomo HTR 200 and Walmarts Goodyear Viva 2
which are both very reasonably priced, around $50 and are both LRR.
Walmart cannot ship even though they show the tire in stock and I have
not found a local place that can get me the Sumitomo.
I'll keep looking.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Steven Potter
Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 8:18 AM
To: 'EV List'
Subject: Tire info link / weight of wheels question
I came across the Tire Bible while doing some research for my EV
project:
http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html
Its a very interesting read and covers just about everything youd want
to know about tires. The one exception being it makes no reference
whatsoever to LRR tires
my main concern at the moment.
Today Ill crawl down under and try to decipher the codes on the inside
of my alloy wheels. My truck came with huge, fat low profile radials. I
need to see if I can re-use the same wheels with LRR tires.
If I end up needing to get new wheels Id be interested in seeing any
info about the weights of various steel and aluminum wheels. Anyone seen
this info anywhere?
Steven Potter, Toronto
98 Ranger
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 7/9/06 1:11:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Evaporative cooling media
Date: 7/9/06 1:11:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steven Potter)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu ('EV List')
While pondering options for how to cool a battery pack with (relatively
hot) ambient air flow I came across some interesting material at:
http://www.kuulpads.com/main.html
http://www.portacool.com shows how the stuff is used with fans in
industrial scale coolers.
The material looks like a craft paper honeycomb held together with some
kind of resin; specifically designed for evaporative cooling
applications.
I'm thinking of a design that would incorporate a large air scoop in
front of my battery box (with a variable damper) that would force air
through a frame that holds this kind of material. Provide a small water
pump to wet the media when extra cooling is required; take it out for
winter driving.
Anyone ever tried something like this?
Steven Potter, Toronto
'98 Ranger >>
I do have this type of material in my solar home evap cooler.It works well in
low humid conditions.It takes 14 amps of 12 volts to cool 1800sf in dry
summer conditions. Dennis Berube
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I remember the Vega. I owned some of them.
The engines were oil burners because they had valve guide stem seals that
were
prone to leak and aluminum engine blocks without iron liners which became
scored. Engine performance and fuel economy were dismal because the engines
were designed to meet emission requirements with a minimum of external
equipment rather than for performance or economy.
The front supension was weak and could be ruined by an encounter with a deep
chuckhole or a curb. Bodies rusted badly. Body headroom was cramped.
The good thing about Vegas was that after their reputation was established,
they could be bought for nearly nothing. The oil burning problem could be
resolved by an engine block with iron sleeves and good valve stem seals.
I did measure my Vegas to determine if they had much EV conversion
potential.
They didn't. Space for batteries was limited even if the back seat space
was
used. The weak front suspension ruled out putting batteries up front.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All,
Please ignore the last quote about the bulbs.
It's late int he night. I've just seen that it actually says 40v 10W
- which makes a whole lot more sense.
I'm just suffering an attack of the brain worm. Still, 40v 10w bulbs
don't seem that easy to get hold of. Suggestions?
On 9 Jul 2006, at 22:35, nikki wrote:
Hi Guys and girls :)
I've just suffered the first blown light on the Sakura. I took the
headlight bulb out to find out that it is rated 40v10v, which I
presume means it's rated to work between 10v and 40v. There's no
other marking on the bulb.
Since the system is entirely based around an operating voltage of
between 32 and 42 volts would it be best to keep the system as is
(and use weird, hard-to replace bulbs) or just install a DC-DC
converter to enable me to use the far more common 12 volt bulbs
(which can come in a variety of power ratings and presumably would
work just as well as the higher voltage low current bulbs)
All comments welcomed!
Nikki
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Guys and girls :)
I've just suffered the first blown light on the Sakura. I took the
headlight bulb out to find out that it is rated 40v10v, which I
presume means it's rated to work between 10v and 40v. There's no
other marking on the bulb.
Since the system is entirely based around an operating voltage of
between 32 and 42 volts would it be best to keep the system as is
(and use weird, hard-to replace bulbs) or just install a DC-DC
converter to enable me to use the far more common 12 volt bulbs
(which can come in a variety of power ratings and presumably would
work just as well as the higher voltage low current bulbs)
All comments welcomed!
Nikki
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm trying to recall what they renamed the Vega after they changed out the
engine. I recall seeing one on the showroom in the latter 70's, but with a
different name. The PA dealer said they'd renamed the car because of its bad
rep w/ the engine & had replaced it w/ a cast iron engine. (Later I was told
they'd sleeved the original design... but wasn't interested enough to find
out.)
I do recall one on a local car lot in the 80's... a well done V8
modification. Too bad you could hardly see around the hood scoop.
W/ their unibody it seems that other bodies could be better for EV use. What
do ya'll do to strengthen the bodies on unibody cars so batts won't go
flying around in an accident? For the Beetle conversions, you can add the
convertible sub frame for extra strength... do you do the same?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
> I remember the Vega. I owned some of them.
>
> The engines were oil burners because they had valve guide stem seals that
> were
> prone to leak and aluminum engine blocks without iron liners which became
> scored.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Vega was replaced by the Monza, with the V8 conversions so popular
on the vega, and Ford put a v8 back in the MustangII, the Monza was
available with a v8. I had a couple V8 vega wagons, my '73 was a drag
car, the '74 was my everyday car for many years with 283 v8, it was fast
yet good mileage. ah the old days.
For a drag car, it's all bracket racing, so consistency is the number 1
factor in building a car. Is an electric going to be better in that
regard? It seems like it might, air temp, humidity, pressure would not
effect engine performance like an ICE, but can batteries perform
consistently especially given the abuse? Can you go fast rounds as you
move towards the finals? And lighter is always better for racing, will a
battery car weigh less?
I'm going with my 506ci stroker 460 into my '63 Falcon..
Jack
Michael Perry wrote:
I'm trying to recall what they renamed the Vega after they changed out the
engine. I recall seeing one on the showroom in the latter 70's, but with a
different name. The PA dealer said they'd renamed the car because of its bad
rep w/ the engine & had replaced it w/ a cast iron engine. (Later I was told
they'd sleeved the original design... but wasn't interested enough to find
out.)
I do recall one on a local car lot in the 80's... a well done V8
modification. Too bad you could hardly see around the hood scoop.
W/ their unibody it seems that other bodies could be better for EV use. What
do ya'll do to strengthen the bodies on unibody cars so batts won't go
flying around in an accident? For the Beetle conversions, you can add the
convertible sub frame for extra strength... do you do the same?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
I remember the Vega. I owned some of them.
The engines were oil burners because they had valve guide stem seals that
were
prone to leak and aluminum engine blocks without iron liners which became
scored.
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As far as I can recall, the Chevrolet Vega and Pontiac Astre had the
aluminum block/silicon sleeve 2.3 engine their whole run. There were a few
Cosworth Vegas produced, however. They had the aluminum block, with iron
sleeves and dual overhead cam heads. They were also de-stroked to 2 liters.
The Chevrolet Monzas, Pontiac Sunbirds, Buick Apollos and Oldsmobile
Starfires were available with a cast iron 4 cylinder ("Iron Duke"), a Buick
231 V6 or even a couple of V8s. The Vega and Monza were so close in specs,
that the wagon "Kammback" and liftback were the same body. They used
conventional steering and suspension components, recirculation ball Saginaw
steering boxes and upper and lower control arm suspension, that looked like
the pieces on Chevelles, Impalas, etc. I personally didn't like them much,
as I am over tall, but I have owned 3 Vegas and one Monza wagon. Since the
chassis was available from the factory with a small block Chevrolet V8, I am
assuming they can handle some weight in the fron.
David C. Wilker Jr.
United States Air Force, Retired
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Perry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 4:04 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
I'm trying to recall what they renamed the Vega after they changed out the
engine. I recall seeing one on the showroom in the latter 70's, but with a
different name. The PA dealer said they'd renamed the car because of its
bad
rep w/ the engine & had replaced it w/ a cast iron engine. (Later I was
told
they'd sleeved the original design... but wasn't interested enough to find
out.)
I do recall one on a local car lot in the 80's... a well done V8
modification. Too bad you could hardly see around the hood scoop.
W/ their unibody it seems that other bodies could be better for EV use.
What
do ya'll do to strengthen the bodies on unibody cars so batts won't go
flying around in an accident? For the Beetle conversions, you can add the
convertible sub frame for extra strength... do you do the same?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
I remember the Vega. I owned some of them.
The engines were oil burners because they had valve guide stem seals that
were
prone to leak and aluminum engine blocks without iron liners which became
scored.
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That article says you can save 30 gallons a year. That is not much of an
incentive in my opinion. The price is right for them though on tirerack.
With a 380 treadware rating they will last forever. THAT is a great
incentive - you would only have to buy new tires every 50,000 miles or so.
Has anyone run these tires and gotten at least 1 mpg better?
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Patrick Maston
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 4:17 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Tire Info Link
Cor and Steven,
Here is a link to info on some LRR tires:
http://www.greenseal.org/resources/reports/CGR_tire_rollingresistance.pdf.
I purchased my Sumitomo HTR200s from Discount Tire. Although they don't
carry them in stock, I just called them on the phone and asked them to order
them for me. Took 3 days to get them shipped in.
Or, you can purchase them here:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Sumitomo&model=HTR+200 , have
them shipped to you, then have a local tire shop install them for you.
The Sumitomos aren't the lowest RR tires you can get, but they are priced
right.The Bridgestone B381 cost a lot more and are only available in a
limited size selection.
Good luck,
Patrick
From: Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Tire info link / weight of wheels question
Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 18:05:35 -0700
Steven,
You have a Ranger.
Wheel weight is quite irrelevant for a truck, unless you drag-race it.
My truck has Tigerpaws, I inflated them to 50 PSI to reduce the
rolling resistance.
See http://evalbum.com/694
I am currently shopping around for decently priced LRR tires for
my classic Prius.
It came OEM with Bridgestone Potenza RE92 XL but those are
shockingly expensive in most shops.
Alternatives are the Sumitomo HTR 200 and Walmarts Goodyear Viva 2
which are both very reasonably priced, around $50 and are both LRR.
Walmart cannot ship even though they show the tire in stock and I have
not found a local place that can get me the Sumitomo.
I'll keep looking.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Steven Potter
Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 8:18 AM
To: 'EV List'
Subject: Tire info link / weight of wheels question
I came across the Tire Bible while doing some research for my EV
project:
http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html
Its a very interesting read and covers just about everything youd want
to know about tires. The one exception being it makes no reference
whatsoever to LRR tires
my main concern at the moment.
Today Ill crawl down under and try to decipher the codes on the inside
of my alloy wheels. My truck came with huge, fat low profile radials. I
need to see if I can re-use the same wheels with LRR tires.
If I end up needing to get new wheels Id be interested in seeing any
info about the weights of various steel and aluminum wheels. Anyone seen
this info anywhere?
Steven Potter, Toronto
98 Ranger
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
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One thing you are going to have to worry about with a Chevy Monza/vega is
you have to add subframe connectors. Those cars cannot take the torque. I
had a 383 in mine and after cracking the unibody 3 times I finally had to
add a cage. An 11 inch motor will be able to give a huge amount of startup
torque so you will also have to upgrade the rear end. Luckily an 8" ford
rear end out of a maverick fits underneath the monza/vega.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of BFRListmail
Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 11:15 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Automatic transmission viable for drag racing
Hello all,
I'm toying with the idea of stepping out of the low voltage bikes, and into
a drag car. Probably a Chevy Vega, Chevy Monza, Mazda RX7, something along
those lines. Say 11" GE motor. How about a 3 speed automatic. Maybe Chevy
Turbo 350, but probably Chevy Turbo 400 to ensure it can handle the high
torque. Now I know a few guys have used the powerglide. No Torque
Converter. Manual Valve Body. I'm sure there's some out there, maybe
street cars running a 3 speed auto, but I don't believe there's anybody
racing one.
OK, why the 3 speed in a lightweight car? Well I was hoping to get buy on
the cheap without a zilla, maybe some series parallel pack switching. Maybe
some field weakening.
Bottom line, are there going to be tremendous losses in the automatic
transmission? Without the torque converter, the efficiency should increase
a lot. Will the gains of keeping the motor in the powerband longer outweigh
the transmission losses? Any obvious problems with this solution? It might
not be optimal, but I think it would be worth a try.
Darin Gilbert
BadFishRacing
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Hm, the deforming pads on the brake and accelerator pedals solve some
problems. If you are talking friction, then would it be simpler to replace
the starter with a S-M-G conversion kit? No batteries, some ultra capacitors
that capture the kinetic energy for reuse. Modest improvement in gas
mileage, little less brake wear, it probably would take quite a while to
achieve a return on investment.
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Hey Jack, you said: "I'm going with my 506ci stroker 460 into my '63
Falcon.."
Just out of curiosity Jack, what form of sick voyeur fetish do you have
with EVs ? :-)
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Murray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 5:17 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
The Vega was replaced by the Monza, with the V8 conversions so popular on
the vega, and Ford put a v8 back in the MustangII, the Monza was available
with a v8. I had a couple V8 vega wagons, my '73 was a drag car, the '74
was my everyday car for many years with 283 v8, it was fast yet good
mileage. ah the old days.
For a drag car, it's all bracket racing, so consistency is the number 1
factor in building a car. Is an electric going to be better in that
regard? It seems like it might, air temp, humidity, pressure would not
effect engine performance like an ICE, but can batteries perform
consistently especially given the abuse? Can you go fast rounds as you
move towards the finals? And lighter is always better for racing, will a
battery car weigh less?
I'm going with my 506ci stroker 460 into my '63 Falcon..
Jack
Michael Perry wrote:
I'm trying to recall what they renamed the Vega after they changed out
the
engine. I recall seeing one on the showroom in the latter 70's, but with
a
different name. The PA dealer said they'd renamed the car because of its
bad
rep w/ the engine & had replaced it w/ a cast iron engine. (Later I was
told
they'd sleeved the original design... but wasn't interested enough to
find
out.)
I do recall one on a local car lot in the 80's... a well done V8
modification. Too bad you could hardly see around the hood scoop.
W/ their unibody it seems that other bodies could be better for EV use.
What
do ya'll do to strengthen the bodies on unibody cars so batts won't go
flying around in an accident? For the Beetle conversions, you can add the
convertible sub frame for extra strength... do you do the same?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: Chevy Vega for Drag Racing?
I remember the Vega. I owned some of them.
The engines were oil burners because they had valve guide stem seals that
were
prone to leak and aluminum engine blocks without iron liners which became
scored.
--
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Michaela Merz wrote:
>
> Hello:
>
> I am about to connect my laptop to the e-meter to get some data I need.
> However, they suggest using an serial isolator because serial ground is
> connected to (-) battery pack.
>
> Most isolators I found 'just' isolate the data lines. I guess that is ok,
> however, they need power from the connected units to run the opto
> isolators. Is the E-meter supplying that voltages? Or what kind of
> isolators are YOU using to play it safe?
I've published the circuit I use on the EV list before, as have others.
Basically, you need to completely isolate the E-meter's serial output
(data, power, and ground) from the laptop. A commercial isolator will
require a power supply. It's preferable to set it up so this supply is
powering the laptop side of the isolation barrier. You don't need any
power on the E-meter side, as the E-meter never receives any RS-232
data.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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On 8 Jul 2006 at 23:21, John G. Lussmyer wrote:
> Thursday night my shop burned.
I can't see much of it because my browser displays all the photos full size,
not scaled, and I don't seem to have any program that will display the .3gp
items. But what I can see is truly harrowing. The pix of the Sparrows, the
nicads, and the lithium cells are heartbreaking.
Not a good summer so far; first Tony, now John.
You lost a LOT of EV gear, including some that's probably irreplaceable and
even if not will be crushingly expensive. Maybe Myers Motors can supply at
least one new revised Sparrow for you. I sure hope your insurance covers
the loss.
So, so sorry.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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Quoting Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> The Vega was replaced by the Monza, with the V8 conversions so popular
> on the vega, and Ford put a v8 back in the MustangII, the Monza was
> available with a v8. I had a couple V8 vega wagons, my '73 was a drag
> car, the '74 was my everyday car for many years with 283 v8, it was fast
> yet good mileage. ah the old days.
>
> For a drag car, it's all bracket racing, so consistency is the number 1
> factor in building a car. Is an electric going to be better in that
> regard? It seems like it might, air temp, humidity, pressure would not
> effect engine performance like an ICE, but can batteries perform
> consistently especially given the abuse? Can you go fast rounds as you
> move towards the finals? And lighter is always better for racing, will a
> battery car weigh less?
>
> I'm going with my 506ci stroker 460 into my '63 Falcon..
>
> Jack
Jack,
As a long time drag and bracket racer and builder I can confidently assure you
that if you put the money you would spend on the 460 ICE setup into building
an electric drive package for that Falcon that not only would you have a
better and more consistant bracket car but one that in the long run was
cheaper to run, cleaner and easier to maintain. + much more "Wow" factor. And
if you do your homework like Dennis B and have a decent reaction time, you
will consistantly knock em dead in your home area. I remember a while back out
at Speedworld Dennis had just slaughtered a local fellow in his radically
built Vega and I just innocently ("grin") remarked that EVs were the future
and when he got tired of electrics kicking his butt to let us know and we
would help him get started, probably could build a nice ride for 30K or so.
What I failed to realize was that his wife was in the jacked up (ICE) golf
kart with him and she later was giving him heck and wanted to know why they
had 65K in a car that couldntnt beat an electric. That Dennis has offered
(IIRC) to sell turnkey for $25000. LOL. Ouch. I dropped by the ICE guys pit
later and apologized for the little bit of razzing going awry. Good luck in
your racing endeavors. David Chapman.
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