EV Digest 6603
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Phoenix motorcars featured on Kokam site (was: Electric Imp featured
in Kokam product info)
by "Peter Gabrielsson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Making PV panels
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: [EV] Re: [EV] Re: EV Funding.
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Jed's Top Ten Muscle Car Favorites
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: [EV] Re: EV Funding.
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Li-Ion This and Li-Ion THAT
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Anyone consider converting a Pinto
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Squirreling through the boneyard
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) May C&D Article on White Zombie
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Mike's Pinto Project
by "Randy Burleson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: More EV Media Coverage
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Cheap EV Alternatives
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Anyone consider converting a Pinto
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Hybrid question
by "Mike Harvey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Making PV panels
by Mike Sandman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Electric bike video
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Anyone consider converting a Pinto
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Jed's Top Ten Muscle Car Favorites
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: KillaCycle Update
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Quick PFC20 question
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Jed's Top Ten Muscle Car Favorites
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Chevy Volt in Design News Magazine
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Converting a mini classic
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: May C&D Article on White Zombie
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Hybrid question
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Kokam produced the initial cells for Altair using Altairs titanate material.
My understanding is that Altair now has their own production line and
has produced cells on their own.
On 3/26/07, Osmo S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...and I was surprised to see Phoenix motorcars mentioned on the
Kokam site. They claim the car "is powered by batteries from
Altairnano/Kokam". As far as I know Phoenix uses only Altairnano´s. I
´ve seen the same news article elsewhere, but no Kokam mentioned.
Is this some news service´s or Kokam´s PR-people´s mistake, or
intentionally misleading?
terveisin, Osmo
http://www.kokam.com/custom/notice_view.php?
page=1&I_idx=6&sch=&key=&no=4
Ryan Stotts kirjoitti 27.3.2007 kello 5.39:
> I was surprised to see it featured in this:
>
> http://press.team-orion.com/press/avionics/kokam_quality.pdf
>
> http://www.proev.com/
>
--
www.electric-lemon.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Lee and all,
You will find a youtube video about making solar panels(company methode
demonstration) here with great details:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYeynLy6pj8
Cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait du volant, quel carburant choisiriez-vous
?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 4:15 AM
Subject: Making PV panels
This is a bit off-topic, but some of you may have worked on solar raycers,
so I'll ask.
I bought some surplus PV cells, and would like to build a PV panel that
conforms to the car's body. What I envision is soldering flat metal strips
to the cells to interconnect them, laying them on a glass panel, and
encapsulating them with something that is clear, waterproof, and UV
resistant. But I'm having problems.
- The cells are amazingly difficult to solder to. What type of solder
and flux is needed?
- What do you use to encapsulate the cells?
- Are there any "tricks of the trade" that are needed to ensure that
they don't break or quickly turn into junk?
--
"Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the one who is
doing it." -- Chinese proverb
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> What do ya pay for a gallon of gas in Chile? THAT makes a big difference,
> too. If gas were 23 sence a gal in USA there wouldn't be much interest in
> Electrics.
gas hovers around US$1 to US$1.2 a liter, so thats about US$4 a galon.
its always a bit more than in the US.
>
> Would be fun to go to the Electric Races in Chile!Would be a fun NEDRA
> EVent in our winters?
>
They are sloooooooow races... most of them use Briggs and Stratton 24volt
motors.
--
Eduardo K. |
http://www.carfun.cl | I'm white and nerdy
http://ev.nn.cl | Weird Al
|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I ran across this site today after posting something on You Tube and I was
researching Hemi Cuda times. This chart will put some perspective on just how
quick John's "White Zombie" is. I thought this might help some of the people on
the list who are not familiar with drag racing ETs and performance but may have
heard of several cars on this list. Reading the horsepower figures is also
enlightening. Here is a quote from Jed: "The ultimate thing about a Muscle Car
Is how it does at the quarter mile time."
http://www.howard-winn.k12.ia.us/projects/ind_study/ac7ind/musclecars/site%20pages/Q.T.%20mile%20page/QuarterMileTimes.html
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: Eduardo Kaftanski
> there is no EV movement as in 'converting normal cars' and
> there is only 4 other converted EVs in the country, all in
> universities and all done with research funds.
That's too bad. It often leads to very complex, very expensive vehicles that
are totally impractical.
Bob, I described the CitiCar/ComutaCar/ComutaVan vehicles to Eduardo. They are
something that should be easy and inexpensive to build, yet usable as "real"
vehicles.
> There is however an EV racing crowd that every year have a
> 'formula-e' race. Rules are strict: Budget is US$2000 and they
> have to build everything except the motor.
...and batteries, I assume.
> they are not allowed a commercially avaliable controller,
> so most are contactor controlled.
Bob Rice replied:
> Wow! That's a novel approach, a tough budget. Batteries must
> eat up THAT 2k budget pretty quick?
We give our BEST kids a US $100 budget, and they have always managed to build
working EVs even with that! They build everything except the motor and
batteries. These are 4th-6th graders (10-12 year old kids)!
This year's cars are using a 120v treadmill motor (donated by Rod Hower) and
two used Hawker G12v38Ah batteried (donated by Joel Silverman, and pre-murdered
by US Electricar). :-)
We found that 24v on these treadmill motors is just about right for a 15-20 mph
vehicle. We put a 15 amp circuit breaker on each battery, since their actual
capacity is everything from 15-35 amphours. Our races are 1 hour maximum, so
this puts every team on an equal basis (all batteries can deliver 15 amps for 1
hour).
The great thing about making really cheap EVs is that you can get large numbers
of people to try them out!
--
"Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the one who is
doing it." -- Chinese proverb
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
typo:
please read 300$/kw>H<
Cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait du volant, quel carburant choisiriez-vous
?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: Li-Ion This and Li-Ion THAT
For sure but at 20$/cell (little margin for paying business fees) there is
not a lot of people to pay such...
Calendar life is a problem with 18650 but at 300$/Kw, now i accept 5 years
life until 1/2C :^)
Cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait du volant, quel carburant
choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Lough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 5:56 PM
Subject: Li-Ion This and Li-Ion THAT
Geezzz,, I thought that with all the Band Width on Li-Ion
that Bill Dube's anouncement that they were going to actually offer FOR
SALE a little Cube-Like 12V Battery, made up of A123 cells, would have
set the EVDL ON FIRE.....
Bill Quotes...
" Well, we finally built a half-way-decent-looking prototype.
http://www.killacycle.dreamhosters.com/photos/index.php?album=12-volt-racing-battery
So a few paralell strings of these puppies would work.
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The 1978-1980 models actually implemented the infamous bladder that Ford
decided not to put in initially although they knew the potential was high for
the fuel tank failure. Kinda like deleting 1 olive from all the salads on the
airline's meal menu :-O
They also added the bumper impact extensions which was to give extra protection
before actually impactin gthe fuel tank and forcing it into the rear-end. The
'78 - '80 models did not exhibit catastrophic explosions as did the earlier
models.
But I do like the idea about getting rid of the cars biggest liability, in more
than 1 way :-)
----- Original Message -----
From: Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 10:07 am
Subject: Re: Anyone consider converting a Pinto
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> I'm a little late commenting on this thread. Was the 1980 model
> as
> prone to explosion as the mid-70's models? Am I the only one who
> thinks
> it's hilarious to make a Pinto safer by converting it?
>
> Mike Willmon wrote:
> > Found a 1980 Pinto in town with a perfect body and blown engine
> for $100. Curb weight 2556# minus the typical stuff of 712# equals
> > an 1844# glider. Its probably got the 6-3/4" rear end so I could
> probably easily swap it for an 8". If I look at pictures right
> > there should be lots of battery room under the back seat and in
> place of that explosive gas tank behind the axle. Anyone got any
> > comments on the Pinto as a conversion? Do they handle OK, is
> the steering dependable (aren't they rack & pinion)? I never drove
> > one. Any chance of fitting dual motors under the hood with
> direct drive to the rear-end?
> >
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I haven't spoke much about it yet, but I have a new EV project in hand.
With my son turning 16 in two weeks, we decided to take on a little
father/son EV adventure. I am now the proud owner of of a fairly straight
1970 Datsun pickup, and the plan is to convert it this summer so the boy has
something cool to drive to school next year.
You may recall Jim Husted gave me a hard time (is there anyone he hasn't
yet) after a couple of his "Baby's" were sold and I mentioned that they may
be a little overpriced for anyone who was not planning on racing with them.
Jim tried to mock me by claiming that he was going to paint my name on one
of his cores and come into the shop each morning and cuddle it and talk to
it until I made a trip there and rebuilt it myself just so I had some
perspective on the work he does.
What you don't know, and what I think might have surprised Jim, was that I
immediately shot him back a private email that I would love to come work
with him for a day or two, but I was thinking of doing a small truck for my
son, and would he mind if we both came and got our hands dirty. Of course,
I didn't want some little dinky play thing motor, I wanted something big
enough to push a light weight EV around.
Since then Jim and I have been making arraingements, and today is the day
that we met up at the Forklift boneyard to look through motor cores.
I don't know how much cofee Jim starts his day off with, but he reminded me
of a squirrel looking for nuts. He was all over the place. He went over,
he went under, he squeezed through, he climbed up, he hefted, he pushed, he
pulled and finally he found just the right cores, one for me and one for
him. The ones we ended up with were up on the third rack, and the guy at
the shop told Jim with a quiver in his voice, "We can get a lift truck in
there" as he was afraid Jim would try climbing down with one tucked under
his arm.
It was fun though watching him weed through stuff. He used a flashlight to
look inside of them, he checked out the brushes, turned them by hand, and
either dismissed them as not worth the effort or set them aside as possible
candidates. I knew ours were good, because he didn't take anytime at all on
them. He just went straight to getting us a good price, and we were on our
way. He kept a pretty good poker face during negotiations, but afterwords
he let me know that these babies are practically brand new. So rather than
spending our time rebuilding them, we will be doing things like pressing in
a new shaft, and adding a cooling port for forcing air through since they
are on the smallish size for EV use.
I don't know if Jim wants me to mention this one or not, because for now it
is the one that got away. Or perhaps he needs to ignore it on a few more
trips so he get's a better price later, but there was one gem that we passed
over as it was a bit large for what I am doing. Still, if you are
considering something in the 12" range, you might want to contact Jim and
see what he can do for you. There was a beauty still in one of the "Parts
Lifts". I could see from the look in his eye that Jim fell in love with
this one right away and would love to make it one of his...
damon
_________________________________________________________________
Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from Microsoft Office
Live! http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Got the May Car & Driver today - congratulations John - awesome article!
Excellent photos of Rod and Father Time's rides also. Lots of great EV
publicity lately!
____________________________________________________________________________________
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta.
http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_tools.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Can anyone tell me if if $85 a pair to shorten and
> respline a set of axles is a good deal.
That's a pretty good deal. I assume that's cut splines?
Shipping is gonna eat you alive... you may be dollars up in the long run
to go with new axles and just pay shipping one way. Definitely check the
net price to your door.
A buddy runs this business...
http://www.drivetrainoutlet.com/
Check there for alloy axles in stock or custom applications. Upgrading
to warranteed alloy axles may not be overly expensive, again considering
net price to your door.
> With my luck it won't be as easy as taking exactly
> 4.25" off each side.
No luck involved -- work the specs and place the driveshaft where you
need it FOR YOUR car, and then order accordingly. Some extra length on
the splines can give peace of mind in custom applications.
> But I wonder if anyone knows what O.D. a shaft is for
> 35 spline count?
35 splines has 1.5" major diameter. You're looking at a 28- or 31-spline
application unless you want to redo the axle ends. This also depends on
what you want to do in the differential -- I'm a *BIG* fan of ARB
lockers (I own three) but they aren't cheap. There's no better
compromise for street AND strip, IMHO.
FWIW, my primary usage is 4x4, with 211:1 final gearing behind a
small-block Ford that I'd estimate at about 300ft-lbs of torque. With
large tires and high-traction environments, that's a pretty sizable load
on the axles. :p
Randii
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Congrats Mike! very cool.
Victor
Mike Harvey wrote:
Thought I'd share a short 2 1/2 minute video on my conversion that aired on the local
NBC station this past Friday. Very positive, and they even got <most> of the
facts right! Overall, goodness...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfmBoCK55As
Mike Harvey
Harvey Coachworks and EV
(877) 841-9730
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 12:46 PM 27/03/07 -0400, Paul wrote:
Hey,
Is there any alternative to an expensive new setup. In other words, if I
just wanted to get something to work, and since its my first go at it,
didn't want to pile a ton of money into it, are there any motors or
parts that I can experiment with? Maybe a used system or parts
interchange? But something with still enough power to get down the road.
This would be for an early Datsun Z. How about an industrial ac motor?
Can I use a bunch of 12v batteries with low Ah's to get the higher
current, even if I loose a lot of range?
G'day Paul
Firstly, how cheap do you consider cheap? If you consider cheap as less
than $1000 then you won't get on the road unless you can find a miracle.
$5k will be enough budget and you may get away significantly under, but
maybe not.
Cheapest source for a set of used parts is someone elses' failed or died
conversion. If you have a friend who imports machines fom Japan, they have
systems there for warehouses that is a forklift on a track, you could get
one of those for about $1500 with a lower power 120 volt system, AC motor,
inverter, DC/DC converter, etc. If you don't have a friend then you could
pay $5k or more (depends on the markup they place on it).
Industrial AC motor is cheap, but quite expensive to get going in an EV
(think: Buy a Zilla instead and go DC).
Ex-forklift (towmotor, etc) DC motors give plenty of scope to find the
electric equivalent of a 'big ol' lazy V8'. A larger motor that won't rev
hard but has lots of torque. The problem with putting them in a cheap
system is that you can't hear them so risk over-revving them and not being
able to find its' twin brother. Forklifts are direct drive and low voltage
to make them inherantly hard to over-rev.
A bunch of low amp-hour 12V batteries in series/parallel combination is a
recepie for battricide. You have no idea of the state of any battery in the
block of parallel ones and the weak ones kill the strong ones. Better to
use large batteries and have a low-performance system at low voltage that
you can add to later. How much range do you think is "just enough" for your
get-going first attempt? 1 mile? 4? 10? 20? 40?
Used batteries from the golf-cart service shop (if they have one in your
area) is a cheap sorce of enough-to-get-going batteries.
The biggest problem with cheap systems is having a bunch of miss-fit bits
that you need to keep an eye on:
battery voltages, current, motor current, motor temperature, motor revs,
fusing, contactor ratings, disconnects, etc.,.. an "expensive new setup"
doesn't mean that those things are not needed to be looked at, but as an
example if you buy an EV contactor that has a spec, you know what it is
capable of. If you use an ex-forklift contactor you have to consider where
it came from. If you put a 48 volt rated contactor into a 120 volt system,
you fon't know if it will clear the current if it has to open under load.
If you use a pair of 72 volt contactors wired together in a 120 volt
system, you can be a lot more confident that they will open safely.
It is possible to buy a big old electric forklift or similar. I bought the
electric bits from an airport conveyor truck and got two 72V motors,
contactors, a controller rated up to 84 volts, a DC/DC converter, and a lot
of cables. Cheap is do-able, if you have time, patience and a willingness
to go visit the industrial junk dealers in your area. Beer is a good way to
encourage them to keep a look out for suitable things for you.
Hope this helps
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'd be more concerned about the weight capacity than the available
volume. I don't think the stock springs and shocks would hold a great
deal of weight, and even if that were ok there's still a handling
question. But then again I don't know anything about the Pinto
specifically.
Danny
Eric Poulsen wrote:
I'm a little late commenting on this thread. Was the 1980 model as
prone to explosion as the mid-70's models? Am I the only one who
thinks it's hilarious to make a Pinto safer by converting it?
Mike Willmon wrote:
Found a 1980 Pinto in town with a perfect body and blown engine for
$100. Curb weight 2556# minus the typical stuff of 712# equals
an 1844# glider. Its probably got the 6-3/4" rear end so I could
probably easily swap it for an 8". If I look at pictures right
there should be lots of battery room under the back seat and in place
of that explosive gas tank behind the axle. Anyone got any
comments on the Pinto as a conversion? Do they handle OK, is the
steering dependable (aren't they rack & pinion)? I never drove
one. Any chance of fitting dual motors under the hood with direct
drive to the rear-end?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Quoted 0-60 times was for an 07 from Car and Driver independent testing.
Just as I see em. In any case slower than the other two by over 2 secs.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cor van de Water" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 3:29 AM
Subject: RE: Hybrid question
Wooops,
It was Mike who mis-quoted the Prius take-off time.
The Prius styling qualification was James'
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Cor van de Water
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 10:27 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Hybrid question
James,
Your quoted Prius 0 to 60 time is the Classic (2001-2003) time.
The 2004 - 2007 Prius does 0-60 in 10 sec.
See:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=43877
http://john1701a.com/prius/prius-specs.htm
BTW,
"puke on wheels"?
Apparently it is a matter of taste how you classify this car, as I (and
many
others) absolutely love it's styling.
Now take the Navigator or any other coffin on wheels, that's a whole
nother
story...
Hope you enjoy your Hybrid just as much as my wife enjoys ours (my vehicle
of choice is the EV)
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of James Allgood
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 8:45 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
I have a Civic and it was a tough descision, but here are the +/- of both
of
them.
Prius
Hatchback is so useful.
Looks like puke on wheels.
Centralized instrument cluster takes getting used to.
Bluetooth integration.
It is more expensive and there was a waiting list.
If the battery pack goes out you are dead in the water.
Only has an automatic transmission.
It is a Toyota.
Civic
Looks like a real car
Instruments are where they are supposed to be.
No learning curve.
If the battery pack dies, it still drives.
Back seat does not fold down.
Smaller size (wheelbase) is better for parking downtown.
Manual transmission so you can have better contol over RPMs and economy.
Price was better.
It is a Honda.
Four years since I bought the Civic and no complaints. There was a rattle
in
the A pillar but they fixed it. I only use it to drive up the hill to the
dog park and back, up to 24% grade for 5 miles, and I average 38 mpg. I
drove to Salt Lake City from San Francisco and averaged 55 mpg.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Harvey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
I haven't seen the Altima but my parents have two ICE Altimas and they
are nicely built nice looking and roomier than the Prius or civic. But
if you look at fuel economy, you are certainly paying for the added
pickup. Best all-around for both performance and fuel economy looks
like the Civic based
on the numbers I could gather. Granted, the numbers came from various
sources I could whip up quickly but cant be too far off to tell the story.
Most of the numbers below are from Car and Driver...
2007 Nissan Altima Hybrid
Curb weight: 3564 lb.
Zero to 60 mph: 7.4 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 20.7 sec
Fuel Economy (city/hwy): 36/42 mpg.
2004-2007 Toyota Prius Hybrid
Curb Weight 2932 lb.
Zero to 60 mph: 12.7 sec.
Zero to 100 mph: 39.6 sec.
Fuel Economy (city/hwy): 60/51 mpg.
2007 Honda Civic Hybrid
Curb Weight 2875 lbs.
Zero to 60 mph: 7.99
Zero to 100 mph: N/A (0-90 in 18.17 secs) Fuel Economy (city/hwy):
48/47 mpg.
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 10:24 PM
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
I know two Prius owners and both are very happy and routinely get over
50 mpg. If I recall the Pris is a little larger and gets better
mileage than
the civic.
via Treo
David Hrivnak
-----Original Message-----
From: "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subj: Hybrid question
Date: Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:04 pm
Size: 506 bytes
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Hi all one of my friends is planning on buying a hybrid and he seems
to be stuck between three choices.
The nissan altima hybrid
The toyota prius
and the honda civic hybrid
He just like anyone else wants a vehicle that has enough power to
keep up with traffic and gets good gas mileage and it must be a
comfortable ride.
I
was just wondering if anyone had any thoughts?
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/?mkt=en-ca/?v=2&cid=A6D6BDB4586E357F!399
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-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 7:16 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Making PV panels
This is a bit off-topic, but some of you may have worked on solar raycers,
so I'll ask.
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377
hi lee, you might peek around here for items or ideas. there are of
course many other websites like this one :)
http://www.siliconsolar.com/commercial-solar-cells.php
regards,
sandman
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I'd seriously consider one of these for commuting to work if higher
fuel prices/shortage existed (till I got my EV built(~$17,000)).
http://www.electricrider.com/custom/insane_accelerate.mov
http://www.electricrider.com/custom/insane_velocity.mov
http://www.electricrider.com/custom/index.htm
Imagine a Zilla and A123's on it...
And did you see the 160 mph electric RC car?
http://www.castlecreations.com/media/articles/rcca-nic_case.pdf
Video of it doing 134 mph on the radar:
http://www.racers-haven.com/world_record_run.php
I'm really tempted to build a 200mph car like the one that is spec'd
out in that pdf... That RC stuff is cheap. The "big" motor
used(Model: 1509/2Y), list at $195..., controller about the same
price..
http://66.241.195.91/motors/neu1506.asp?path1=motors&path2=neu
Specs from the builder of the record car:
http://forums.radiocontrolzone.com/showthread.php?p=2059660
(User: Hard Case)
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At 2350 lbs right now and my estimate of 2700 lb max it would drive just like a
couple 175 lb persons lying on the floor in th back seat. ( I know this isn't
a pleasant thought). But seriously the weight of the batteries will be as low
as possible and I'm going to have some springs bent to give the proper ride
height with the weight of batteries designed in. I'm thinking ~750 lbs of
batteries will lower the CG quite a bit and may even make the thing handle
nicely. There's lots of kit/aftermarket front end parts that can be had since
the Mustang II running gear is virtually all the same. However for know I just
need it to go in a straight line and will probably leave the front end stock.
Since I've been frequenting the FordPinto.com site and searching pictures and
stories I've see evidence that Pinto will hold A LOT. That might be a fun game
to search pics of what all people have stuffed into the back of a Pinto. I saw
1 guy with half a Pinto in parts inside his other Pinto. LMAO :-)
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 3:00 pm
Subject: Re: Anyone consider converting a Pinto
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> I'd be more concerned about the weight capacity than the available
> volume. I don't think the stock springs and shocks would hold a
> great
> deal of weight, and even if that were ok there's still a handling
> question. But then again I don't know anything about the Pinto
> specifically.
> Danny
>
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Hey Rod, those are some inspiring numbers if you're an EV racer :-) Nice low
targets to shoot at :-O
See if this list don't put it into more perspective though.
http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/0-60 and .25 mile times.xls
I pulled this of a list I found somewhere where the Car & Driver, Motor Trend
and other Car mags etc. test data from featured vehicles were compiled into 1
list. I added a select few EV's for reference. Maybe we can update it with
all known EV times. Notice Electrabishi is nearer the bottom of the list, sad
to say. But hey it gets me to work alright :-)
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 11:50 am
Subject: Jed's Top Ten Muscle Car Favorites
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> I ran across this site today after posting something on You Tube
> and I was researching Hemi Cuda times. This chart will put some
> perspective on just how quick John's "White Zombie" is. I thought
> this might help some of the people on the list who are not
> familiar with drag racing ETs and performance but may have heard
> of several cars on this list. Reading the horsepower figures is
> also enlightening. Here is a quote from Jed: "The ultimate thing
> about a Muscle Car Is how it does at the quarter mile time."
> http://www.howard-
> winn.k12.ia.us/projects/ind_study/ac7ind/musclecars/site%20pages/Q.T.%20mile%20page/QuarterMileTimes.html
> Roderick Wilde
> "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> www.suckamps.com
>
>
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Bill wrote:
We have built the new battery pack with 110 more A123 systems cells
Should be impressive!
We're going to put the bike on the dyno at TK Motorsports tomorrow
to see what it really puts out.
Looking forward to the results.
Good times.
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Joe wrote:
Yes.
Grounding the chassis prevents a shock hazard my making sure the chassis is
connected to safety ground.
I know we've been over this before, but it just seems to me that the
charger would be "isolated" if it was only connected to the HV pack
and not to the vehicle. Why involve the chassis in the charge circuit
like that? I don't see any benefit to it.
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Oops, here's a more complete link:
http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/0-60_and_.25_mile_times.xls
----- Original Message -----
From: MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 3:39 pm
Subject: Re: Jed's Top Ten Muscle Car Favorites
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Hey Rod, those are some inspiring numbers if you're an EV racer :-
> ) Nice low targets to shoot at :-O
>
> See if this list don't put it into more perspective though.
> http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/0-60 and .25 mile times.xls
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I think they should pull the ICE and install two or three of their
packs in it and see what type of range they get.
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Dave,
It's possible to convert anything but in general, the bigger and heavier, the
harder. I'd recommend having a look at the photo album (it's searchable) for
inspiration. www.austinev.org/evalbum. I don't know anything at all about the
lumina vehicle you mention. My own conversion is a small pickup which seats 2
or 3 at most.
good luck,
Frank
----- Original Message ----
From: DAVID BARWICK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 12:22:05 PM
Subject: Re: Converting a mini classic
Hi Frank
No this is not the link However could i ask your advise .I have for a long
time wished for an electric car and now am faced with time on hand to make it
happen. I am in a built up area and rarely travel above 45 mph my average
journeys are about 21 miles round trip a day i have a lumina apv 1990 which i
use for shopping and school runs having six girls in school the kerb weight of
this lumina is 3500 lbs could i convert this van to an Ev and still have the
seating arrangement and if so what specifications on components would you
recommend .i am a complete novice and do not know anything yet on Ev your help
or pointer would be greatly appreciated . Am i asking to much as i have
forwarded this to several persons to receive a blank
Yours sincerely DAVE
Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/images/features/16_5_6/batterycharger.pdf
Is this the link?
----- Original Message ----
From: Tom Parker
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 7:23:22 AM
Subject: Re: Converting a mini classic
On Mon, 2007-03-26 at 07:19 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> HI-
> Sometime over the winter there was a post about an electric race car being
> built in the UK. there was a link to an article in "Racecar Engineering":
> magazine. The drive system was twin motors set parallel with drive ends
> opposite each other. A housing on each end held the motors in place.
> Stub shafts similar to the ones I used on "Gone Postal" were located
> on each end mid way between the motors. These shafts were not
> mechanically connected to each other, but to opposite motors.
> With reduction drive between motors and stub shafts along with
> series/parallel switching, this unit replaces the motor and transaxle.
I was unable to find the link you're talking about, but I think I
understand. If you think only about 1 motor, you place it's drive end to
the far right, use a pully to drive a shaft next to it, transfering
power back to the left, to another pulley to a shaft supporting the
inner CV joint? The other motor fits into the mirror image gap but with
a longer belt somewhere?
= motor
- shaft
+ inner CV joint
| belt or chain
=======|
|======= |
|---- ----|
+ +
I've left out the connection between the shafts and the CV joints.
Such a contraption might fit, especially if it was at a shart angle, so
the front motor was quite high up. The front to back room is also quite
limited.
I really want regenerative braking, so I haven't considered clever
packing of two DC motors. It would be interesting to see some pictures
of how gone postal actually works, the pictures at suckamps.com show
some parts but don't give an idea about how it all fits together.
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't pick lemons.
See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast
with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
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I forgot to mention that Otmar's 914 is also shown at the strip. There's also
a picture of someone with a Sparrow or similar vehicle but I didn't see him
identified. I'll have to reread more carefully. You guys/gals are gonna love
this article.
----- Original Message ----
From: Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 5:34:59 PM
Subject: May C&D Article on White Zombie
Got the May Car & Driver today - congratulations John - awesome article!
Excellent photos of Rod and Father Time's rides also. Lots of great EV
publicity lately!
____________________________________________________________________________________
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta.
http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_tools.html
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't pick lemons.
See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html
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If the prius pack dies why are you 'dead in the water' as compared to the
other ones? And how likely is it that the battery will die on you?
From: "James Allgood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 20:45:28 -0700
I have a Civic and it was a tough descision, but here are the +/- of both
of them.
Prius
Hatchback is so useful.
Looks like puke on wheels.
Centralized instrument cluster takes getting used to.
Bluetooth integration.
It is more expensive and there was a waiting list.
If the battery pack goes out you are dead in the water.
Only has an automatic transmission.
It is a Toyota.
Civic
Looks like a real car
Instruments are where they are supposed to be.
No learning curve.
If the battery pack dies, it still drives.
Back seat does not fold down.
Smaller size (wheelbase) is better for parking downtown.
Manual transmission so you can have better contol over RPMs and economy.
Price was better.
It is a Honda.
Four years since I bought the Civic and no complaints. There was a rattle
in the A pillar but they fixed it. I only use it to drive up the hill to
the dog park and back, up to 24% grade for 5 miles, and I average 38 mpg. I
drove to Salt Lake City from San Francisco and averaged 55 mpg.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Harvey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
I haven't seen the Altima but my parents have two ICE Altimas and they are
nicely built nice looking and roomier than the Prius or civic. But if you
look at fuel economy, you are certainly paying for the added pickup. Best
all-around for both performance and fuel economy looks like the Civic
based on the numbers I could gather. Granted, the numbers came from
various sources I could whip up quickly but cant be too far off to tell
the story. Most of the numbers below are from Car and Driver...
2007 Nissan Altima Hybrid
Curb weight: 3564 lb.
Zero to 60 mph: 7.4 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 20.7 sec
Fuel Economy (city/hwy): 36/42 mpg.
2004-2007 Toyota Prius Hybrid
Curb Weight 2932 lb.
Zero to 60 mph: 12.7 sec.
Zero to 100 mph: 39.6 sec.
Fuel Economy (city/hwy): 60/51 mpg.
2007 Honda Civic Hybrid
Curb Weight 2875 lbs.
Zero to 60 mph: 7.99
Zero to 100 mph: N/A (0-90 in 18.17 secs)
Fuel Economy (city/hwy): 48/47 mpg.
----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 10:24 PM
Subject: Re: Hybrid question
I know two Prius owners and both are very happy and routinely get over 50
mpg. If I recall the Pris is a little larger and gets better mileage
than the civic.
via Treo
David Hrivnak
-----Original Message-----
From: "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subj: Hybrid question
Date: Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:04 pm
Size: 506 bytes
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Hi all one of my friends is planning on buying a hybrid and he seems to
be
stuck between three choices.
The nissan altima hybrid
The toyota prius
and the honda civic hybrid
He just like anyone else wants a vehicle that has enough power to keep up
with traffic and gets good gas mileage and it must be a comfortable ride.
I
was just wondering if anyone had any thoughts?
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/?mkt=en-ca/?v=2&cid=A6D6BDB4586E357F!399
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/?mkt=en-ca/?v=2&cid=A6D6BDB4586E357F!420
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