EV Digest 7069
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: article: Sonex unveils electric-powered sport plane
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Old eceltric sub featured on scince channel
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) ETA on Electro Auto adapters
by "Brian Pikkula" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: ETA on Electro Auto adapters
by "Tehben Dean" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: ETA on Electro Auto adapters
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie
by "Tehben Dean" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Help! Zilla problems
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by Brian Jackson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: diode across contactors
by "T. Marshall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: ZILLA HEPI SIGNAL GROUND
by Mike Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Speed controller project
by Ian Hooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge
by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge
by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: ZILLA HEPI SIGNAL GROUND
by Mark Dutko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Help! Zilla problems
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Shock Jocks
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Speed controller project
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: interesting electric bike design
by James Drysdale <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Heater Relay Dropout Issue
by Mark Dutko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor?
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) A123 chemistry
by Dan Frederiksen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: Heater Relay Dropout Issue
by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Heater Relay Dropout Issue
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I saw that to.
Really interesting that all the batteries fit in the engine
compartment.
Has 1 hr flight time or 16 minutes if in all out acrobatic mode.
Interesting that an electirc motor would NOT loose power at altitude
like a gas motor. Exception might be cold batteries but the engine
intself would retain full power at any altitude.
On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 7:42 pm, Paul Wujek wrote:
Now, for a completely different vehicle:
http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/26/sonex-unveils-electric-powered-sport-plane/
--
Paul Wujek ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On the very day man first landed on the moon an exceptional one of a
kind electric sub (designed by the designer of the deepest diving
vehicle the trieste) set out on a 30 day mission with occupants sealed
inside drifting with the gulf stream. It was an experement by nasa in
isolated living and underwater exploration.
The kicker - it was designed for depths of 2000 ft ( military subs of
the time usually did only 1000ft)
AND all the lead acid battteries were carried in EXTERNAL racks outside
the pressure compartment. All leads and batteires survived through the
whole 30 days after numerous mends were made to pin hole leaks in the
coating neoprene which let the current leak into the surrounding
SALTWATER.
Think about that nest time you think you can't water proof your
batteries :-) .
900 lbs per sq inch at 200ft. THAT's a battery!
The name of the sub was the Ben Franklin (because he first studied the
gulf stream.)
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I asked Electro Auto several times before I ordered and once after I
ordered what the lead time was for their adapters. No answer from
them.
What should I expect for an ETA? I ordered my adapter about a month ago.
--
Brian in TX
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960
http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/
It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm
really quite busy.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was looking into getting one from them (which turned out not to be
practical in my situation) and *I think* they estimated 12 weeks but I
can't find the email. This was last month.
On 7/26/07, Brian Pikkula <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I asked Electro Auto several times before I ordered and once after I
> ordered what the lead time was for their adapters. No answer from
> them.
>
> What should I expect for an ETA? I ordered my adapter about a month ago.
>
>
> --
> Brian in TX
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960
> http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/
> It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm
> really quite busy.
>
>
--
Tehben
'90 Toyota 4x4 Pickup
'hElix EV'
evalbum: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1225
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Jul 26, 2007, at 10:58 PM, Brian Pikkula wrote:
I asked Electro Auto several times before I ordered and once after I
ordered what the lead time was for their adapters. No answer from
them.
What should I expect for an ETA? I ordered my adapter about a month
ago.
I ordered my adapter in early November of 2003. They quoted me a 2-3
week delivery time. I received it in late January.
My conversion journal is online at
<http://www.gdunge.com/cgi-bin/blosxom.cgi/ghia/index.html> if you want
the whole story.
Bottom line: I love the adapter and think it's worth the wait. I
wasn't in a hurry (the car's STILL not finished) so the delay wasn't a
big deal for me. And remember this was nearly four years ago.
--
Brian in TX
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960
http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/
It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm
really quite busy.
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
<http://www.gdunge.com/>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 7/26/07, Joseph T. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It's like the iphone, but for EVs.
sweet :D
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Did they store the tires outside in the sun?
How old would you think that a tire gets when it has a
80,000 mile warranty and the owners does close to average
driving and makes 10,000 miles a year?
And what about someone that has this same set on a second
car and drives it half as much?
As long as the car is garaged or normally stored out of
the sun, tires can live a long time.
I have a spare tire for my truck that has always been
stored inside - it has a little dry cracks in the rubber
but does look perfect otherwise - I believe it is genuine
OEM Tigerpaw that came with the US Electricar S10 in 1994.
I can see the tire chain protecting their good name by not
selling tires over a certain date, because you want to give
them a certain life warranty AFTER putting them on.
But they are not necessarily dangerous if they are a few
years old, then there would be many cars in acute danger
right now....
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Joseph T.
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 9:13 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
As terribly ridiculous it sounds, it's true unfortunately. Tires that are
over 6 years old have aged, believe it or not from just sitting there. The
tires, despite little/no use, have deteriated enough to make them dangerous.
This article talks all about it:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/05/27/eveningnews/consumer/main698335.sh
tml
I'm sorry to hear that, and I kind of doubt that any EV tires have been
produced in the last six years or so. Well, there are the Tesla Roadster
tires. I've heard that the Roadster's tires have a "good" RR number.
On 7/26/07, Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well I had one in my hand today and then it was taken away. I received
> a call late last week saying they found a set of them hidden in a
> warehouse in California, cool! I received a call this morning
> informing me they had arrived. Having been caught off guard without
> wheels I said I'd just come by and pay for them and take them so they
> wouldn't be taking up space in their store after all I had gone
> through to get them.
>
> I was on my way to get them and I received another call, they started
> looking closely at them and they discovered the date code on two of
> them was for 2000 and the other two were for 2001. I'm not sure if it
> was a legal thing, or just corporate policy but they wouldn't sell me
> a tire that was that old. I asked if I could at least come look at
> them after all that, they said yes. I held one in my hand and examined
> the sidewall. Sure enough molded in to the side wall were the words
> "For Electric Vehicle Use Only" I'm sure they had some extra load
> capacity built in, they were 51psi tires. The tread looked all sorts
> of funky, this is the tire efficient EV wet dreams are made out of.
> It was in my hand and I couldn't take it.
>
> So we're back to the drawing board, but I'm assured I will eventually
> get a good set of them... I just have the feeling they are going to
> have to come from Japan now for real. I really really want to put a
> set on a car and see how they compare, I have high expectations.
>
> Later,
> Rick
> 92 Saturn SC conversion
> AZ Alt Fuel Plates "ZEROGAS"
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> ______________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and
> hotels with Yahoo! FareChase.
> http://farechase.yahoo.com/
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Matt,
If you connect directly to a main contactor, that may have a large inductive
kick when the contactor is turn off. This is what my did and the hairball
and it took out the driver circuit for the contactor.
It is recommended by Otmar of Café of Electric, to install a snubber across
the main contactor coil. This diode is a Zener Overvoltage Transient
Bidirectional type. I use a NTE-4933 or equal type.
The inductive kick in some contactors is too large for the hairball and can
damage it.
I use both the NTE-4933 suppression on the contactor coil, plus I have the
hairball contactor circuit, drive a small 12 volt relay that only draws
about .1 amp and have this relay turn on the main contactor. I took off
directly off the ignition key circuit, because my large contactor draws
about 5 amps.
The 56 volt is not a short in the way you think. When the batteries are
charge, they vent and these causes a conductive path from any one of the
battery terminals to the chassis ground of the EV. After charging, you may
read a voltage from one of battery terminals to ground. You can even read a
conductive voltage from the post to the plastic case of the battery. This
is normal for a venting battery.
Now when you have this conductive path from you battery pack to vehicle
ground, the other path may be through your motor to ground. This current
path is from the negative of the battery to the negative of the Zilla
controller directly tie to the negative M- to the motor.
When a DC motor is ran for a period of time, there is brush dust that forms
a conductive path from the brushes, down the face of the commentator and to
the motor shaft and frame of the motor which also makes contact to the
vehicle frame.
This is your conductive path, one battery feed line from the battery to
frame and the other battery feed line that goes directly to the Zilla, to
the motor and then to ground. This is your current circuit.
To current path is induce by a higher voltage when you batteries are
charging. If this conductive path is not broken, more brush dust will
increase this current path, and the voltage could get up to the full battery
voltage.
When charging your batteries, it is best to disconnect both the positive and
negative battery leads to your controller. I use two more contactors, which
is the same size of the main contactor, which disconnects the batteries from
the controller and motor when the ignition key is off. I use another small
12 volt relay control by the ignition circuit to control these two battery
contactors, which normally are call safety contactors.
Safety contactors are also control by a on dash or on console kill switch,
just in case the main contactor or controller fails.
Also, if you have a on board battery charger, it is best to have a two pole
50 to 75 amp contactor which is used to connected the battery charger to the
batteries. If I leave my PFC-50 battery charger connected to the batteries
at all time, the battery circuit will arc every time the battery circuit is
disconnected some where in the circuit.
Always disconnect the battery charger from the batteries, which should be
some distance from the batteries them selfs, if you disconnect a link off a
battery. With my battery charger connected and even not plug in to the AC,
the links will arc when I disconnected. This could blow up your batteries
if you have battery fumes present.
A 2 pole battery contactor on the DC side of the battery charger will
prevent this arcing, plus cut out another conductive ground path, if you
battery charger is grounded to the vehicle.
I install my battery charger inside a epoxy coated fiberglass enclosure, the
main battery pack in a epoxy coated fiberglass enclosure, plus two
contactors to isolated from the controller and another set of contactors to
isolated from the battery charger while the EV is running.
I now have only .1 to .7 volt conductive current path to ground now.
When installing a new DC motor that has brushes, I take a ohm reading of the
motor terminals, (disconnected from the controller), to give me a reference
of the conduction to ground. When motor is new it will read over 20 meg
ohms from any one of the battery terminals to the motor frame. As time goes
on, it is normal for this to get to 30 to 50 K ohms which is cause by the
brush dust and its time to clean the motor.
When I did maintenance on the motor, which means breaking it down, clean it,
replacing the brushes, megger the motor circuits, and had the commentator
turn and all the windings re-enamel and a weak spot in one of the field
windings repair, I also had the motor shop apply insulating enamel on the
face of the commentator down to the motor shaft and on the motor shaft up to
the bearing surfaces. Also I had them spray a insulating enamel you can
also get in a spray can from the motor shop, which I use to spray all the
inside metal surfaces of the motor after the field coils are install. The
field coils shoes must have a metal to metal contact with the motor housing.
It is best to call or Email Otmar on your hairball. I had to send my back
to him, he replace the driver circuit for the main contactor and got it back
in about a week which he included some Zener Overvoltage Diodes to be
install across the contactor coils. The controller has been working good for
about 5 years now.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "R. Matt Milliron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 9:42 PM
Subject: Help! Zilla problems
>
> I do not want to send My Zilla 1k-LV back to the shop. I am hoping
> that the EV-Brain trust can help me.
>
> Short story. I got my Zilla. Hooked it up and it ran. Drove my
> car for 2 miles. Parked it, turned everything off. Started chargers
> and went to bed. Next day she won't run. Hairball will not talk to
> the power unit. Also there is a 56 volt short too ground/body of the
> car. I figured that it was the motor. Got the motor back from the
> shop, with a clean bill of health and a bill. Hooked it to the Zilla
> (1132 error) hairball will not talk to the power unit. I also have a
> 56 volt short to ground/body of car. If I disconnect Zilla (M+) from
> motor, short goes away. If I move the volt meter one battery farther
> from the Zilla, the short drops 6 volts. Is this something with the
> motor or Zilla? Is it something I can test for.
>
> My feeling is that this is just something that happens. Some
> component in the power unit, stressed itself and failed. I just don't
> want to be wrong.
>
> TIA
>
> R. M. Milliron
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 1981 Jet Electrica
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
>
> This machine has been garaged for 17 years.
> I am upgrading it and getting it running. Tabitha,
> my daughter, named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
> electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
True, old tires are very dangerous. Even if they don't blow out, they get hard
and have poor traction. I am ashamed to admit that I actually caused an
accident this way. I have an old set of tires on my Corvair truck too. They
don't have many miles on them, but they're about 10 years old. One of them blew
out last week while the truck was parked.
I have been looking at these tires for my EV project.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Potenza+RE92&vehicleSearch=false&partnum=665SR4RE92&fromCompare1=yes&place=0
Sorry for the long link. I have been looking at these because they are as
narrow and as low profile as I can find for a 14" tire.
Brian
---- "Joseph T. " <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
=============
As terribly ridiculous it sounds, it's true unfortunately. Tires that
are over 6 years old have aged, believe it or not from just sitting
there. The tires, despite little/no use, have deteriated enough to
make them dangerous. This article talks all about it:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/05/27/eveningnews/consumer/main698335.shtml
I'm sorry to hear that, and I kind of doubt that any EV tires have
been produced in the last six years or so. Well, there are the Tesla
Roadster tires. I've heard that the Roadster's tires have a "good" RR
number.
On 7/26/07, Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well I had one in my hand today and then it was taken
> away. I received a call late last week saying they
> found a set of them hidden in a warehouse in
> California, cool! I received a call this morning
> informing me they had arrived. Having been caught off
> guard without wheels I said I'd just come by and pay
> for them and take them so they wouldn't be taking up
> space in their store after all I had gone through to
> get them.
>
> I was on my way to get them and I received another
> call, they started looking closely at them and they
> discovered the date code on two of them was for 2000
> and the other two were for 2001. I'm not sure if it
> was a legal thing, or just corporate policy but they
> wouldn't sell me a tire that was that old. I asked if
> I could at least come look at them after all that,
> they said yes. I held one in my hand and examined the
> sidewall. Sure enough molded in to the side wall were
> the words "For Electric Vehicle Use Only" I'm sure
> they had some extra load capacity built in, they were
> 51psi tires. The tread looked all sorts of funky, this
> is the tire efficient EV wet dreams are made out of.
> It was in my hand and I couldn't take it.
>
> So we're back to the drawing board, but I'm assured I
> will eventually get a good set of them... I just have
> the feeling they are going to have to come from Japan
> now for real. I really really want to put a set on a
> car and see how they compare, I have high
> expectations.
>
> Later,
> Rick
> 92 Saturn SC conversion
> AZ Alt Fuel Plates "ZEROGAS"
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo!
> FareChase.
> http://farechase.yahoo.com/
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
RE: diode across contactors
Tim,
The coil on a contactor is a big inductor. When you turn off the
contactor, the inductance tries to keep the current flowing in the
same direction. It it's not protected with a diode, you can get large
voltages which cause arcing.
A little arcing across a switch might not be too bad. It might wear
out your switch faster, but switches are cheap. However, if this
contactor is being driven by a transistor, the voltage spike can
easily destroy the transistor. An average transistor can only handle
a couple hundred volts, but contactor or relay coil can spike to
thousands of volts when it's turned off. Hope this helps...
-Tyler
On 7/26/07, Tim Gamber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED--- *
> * This post contains a forbidden message format *
> * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) *
> * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT *
> * If your postings display this message your mail program *
> * is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting *
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In case you don't have a copy of this:
http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/HEPA_Setup.pdf
I did like it said and put the Black wire on the HEPA cable to the terminal
labled Signal GND on the Hairball. The speed sensor
Signal GND goes to the same place.
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Mark Dutko
> Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2007 5:18 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: ZILLA HEPI SIGNAL GROUND
>
>
> Which terminal on the Hairball does the HEPI SIGNAL ground got to, it
> is not clear if it should go to the same signal ground as the speed
> sensor or someplace else. The remaining grounds on the HEPI go to
> chassis ground.
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Mark
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,
I built a little speed controller for an electric trolley this week,
and since there's often discussion on home-brew speed controllers on
here I thought it might be useful if I documented the design for
others to peruse/critique/copy:
http://zeva.com.au/speedy/
So far it seems to work a treat! Hopefully might be of some use to
others out there working on their own controllers, and I'm always
open to any constructive criticism on the design from the experts :)
-Ian
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dan, I was not speaking in here. It's called typing or writing. That's
how the small little letters do appear in your 386 SX + CRT ... OK..
I have bought over 1 000 000 AH from TS up to this date. So.. yes I have
bought some.
-Jukka
Dan Frederiksen kirjoitti:
Jukka Järvinen wrote:
Guys, Guys.. A123 sells Cobal Phosphate cells to DeWalt. They have not
yet brought out the Iron Phosphate cells. At least so I have heard
from the little birds :) . . . .
that's interesting. their website doesn't actually say cobalt or iron.
but it does say the specs. it could be crystal meth chemistry for all I
care if it works. and apparently it does.
Selling plain cells to "grass root activists" is insane.
you really are a schmuck. haven't you yourself bought lithium batteries
for a homebuilt EV? such elitist crap
Reason A123 still has good fame is that they are not giving the cells
out to wrong persons.
aren't they selling to everyone? just at higher prices. when you learn
to speak english properly we can talk about who's the wrong people.
Dan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich Rudman kirjoitti:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jukka Järvinen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge
Guys, Guys.. A123 sells Cobal Phosphate cells to DeWalt. They have not
yet brought out the Iron Phosphate cells. At least so I have heard from
the little birds :) . . . .
Are the cells on the KillaCycle (Bill?) also Cobalt Phosphate cells ?
(You can't see it from the cell voltage. Need to analyze the insides or
ask from the factory) I think we had a talk about this earlier. I was
wondering the specific energy amount then...
Are you REALLY suggesting that A123 should do the same screw ups as some
Chinese companies have ? Selling plain cells to "grass root activists"
is insane.
It is possible to get even the most safest cells on the earth on fire.
You just need to giive them to stupid enough person and that's it.
I hope A123 can produce vehicle packs to all hobbyists since there is a
real demand.
Reason A123 still has good fame is that they are not giving the cells
out to wrong persons.
But I hope there will be soon some open source BMS out there that you
can do easily with discrete components..... And buy any cells from
anywhere.....
-Jukka
That open source generic BMS is exactly what the Lion Tamer and the Mk3by4
products are going to be.
Is there any data out there already ? Briefly checked your site... could
not find (maybe I was too hasty).
In fact I have them on both A123 cells and Thunder Sky LFP40aha cells at
this very moment.
Nice. Can you send me some data.. even offlist ?
So yea their will be support, and lots of it.
Jukka, I thought the A123 were all Lith Fe Phosphate Graphite , no cobalt at
all.. and never was.
So did I until I was told this "truth". Thou the source is very reliable.
The Thunder Skys LFP are also the .. safe cell designs.
Yeah.. If not misused .. eh...
I have heard the spec E on A123 266550s are 3680 Watts/ Kg, and in the
Killacycle they are actually getting just a tad over 4Kw/Kg.
...but ho much Wh/kg ?
-Jukka
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
--
Jukka Järvinen
R&D Director
Oy Finnish Electric Vehicle Technologies Ltd
Teollisuuskatu 24 A3
11100 RIIHIMÄKI
jukka.jarvinen(at)fevt.com
cell phone +358-440-735705
wired phone +358-19-735705
fax +358-19-735785
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks- I did get it all to work,
M
On Jul 27, 2007, at 1:56 AM, Mike Willmon wrote:
In case you don't have a copy of this:
http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/HEPA_Setup.pdf
I did like it said and put the Black wire on the HEPA cable to the
terminal labled Signal GND on the Hairball. The speed sensor
Signal GND goes to the same place.
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Mark Dutko
Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2007 5:18 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: ZILLA HEPI SIGNAL GROUND
Which terminal on the Hairball does the HEPI SIGNAL ground got to, it
is not clear if it should go to the same signal ground as the speed
sensor or someplace else. The remaining grounds on the HEPI go to
chassis ground.
Thanks,
Mark
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From: Brian Jackson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
CC: "Joseph T. " <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2007 23:45:16 -0700
True, old tires are very dangerous. Even if they don't blow out, they get
hard and have poor traction. I am ashamed to admit that I actually caused
an accident this way. I have an old set of tires on my Corvair truck too.
They don't have many miles on them, but they're about 10 years old. One of
them blew out last week while the truck was parked.
I have been looking at these tires for my EV project.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Potenza+RE92&vehicleSearch=false&partnum=665SR4RE92&fromCompare1=yes&place=0
Sorry for the long link. I have been looking at these because they are as
narrow and as low profile as I can find for a 14" tire.
Brian
Brian - do you know the rolling resistance factor for RE92's ? I don't
think I've ever seen them in a chart of low rolling resistance tires.
If you look at the GreenSeal paper, two of the lowest tires ( the
Bridgestone B381's and the Sumitomo HTR 200's are available in stock at
TireRack in 14 inch sizes - although not as narrow as the RE92 you are
looking at.
Why do you want the narrowest tire? Do you need a tire that small to fit
in your wheel well?
If not, it is more important to have a low rolling resistance tire. This
depends on the material and construction of the tire, not its width.
Phil Marino
_________________________________________________________________
http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_pcmag_0507
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That does sound strange as I thought the high voltage side was
opto-isolated from zilla to hairball.
When you say 56Volt short, do you mean that a meter probe from body
ground to pack ground reads 56V?
The zilla is a high side switcher. if you were getting current thru the
zila on the M+ line you would have rotation.
Do you have a main contactor? If it is not pulled in then removing the
M+ does no good.
The 56 Volts sounds like the typical acid tracking short. I have a 300V
pack of AGMS and still get that occasionally. Just wipeing down the
battery tops has cured that. I even use the voltmeter to find where it
is. My brand new pack had this problem. It turns out that being in close
proximity to all those floodies at the warehouse and in the truck
accross country must of coasted them with a fine mist that dried
conductive. What I thought was dust was dried acid spray? Lesson
learned, wipe them down on install.
I did have a problem with my zilla and although I never got it wet wet,
I had it mounted under the hood without a box and aparently the moisture
crept or aplashed in and damaged the 15V power supply. Otmar fixed it,
turning it around in a week or two. Great Service.
But I wonder about your wireing. It sounds like you used it only once?
You may have gotten something wrong that didn't show up until it pulled
in the main contactor. Did the main contactor drop out when you shut
down? did one of the contactor sense wires get mixed up with one of the
other wires and put 10V on the 12 volt line or some sensor line. Check
your low voltage wireing and make sure it is...low voltage.
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Hello to All,
Here's the first of many articles that will be hitting in the next week
or so, as a result of the the media frenzy at the Wayland Invitational
drag races two weeks ago. This one is a local story from the Portland
Tribune newspaper:
http://www.portlandtribune.com/accelerate/story.php?story_id=118548740512719300
See Ya.....John Wayland
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Thank you very much for posting that and the good documentation. Ill
deffinitely use your page as a reference. I use a contactor for now but
when Im in school Ill have time to try to make one.
Paul
> Hi all,
>
> I built a little speed controller for an electric trolley this week,
> and since there's often discussion on home-brew speed controllers on
> here I thought it might be useful if I documented the design for
> others to peruse/critique/copy:
>
> http://zeva.com.au/speedy/
>
> So far it seems to work a treat! Hopefully might be of some use to
> others out there working on their own controllers, and I'm always
> open to any constructive criticism on the design from the experts :)
>
> -Ian
>
>
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--- Begin Message ---
Ahhh, another person who likes the xtracycle!
Great product I'm sure.
I would love to have on on my bike.
Their website is so well designed, so many times I visited their
website, even after making the purchase. Fantastic folk!
I paid in full for an extracycle with all the trimmings, as in 2x
saddlebags, passenger carry board, etc... Cost me $AU730. 2 months
later, still no product. The last eta I was given was November, but
seeing as I already pain in full, I may get it by September. Anyway I
cancelled the order. So sad to say. :-(
It is bad when great products by newly formed companies find themselves
with a case of great front-end, shithouse backend. Something about a
worldwide shortage since August/September last year because of an
incorrect production run at the Taiwanese manufacturing yards.
I was intending for my xtracycle-equipped bike to be my main vehicle.
But as this won't happen for another 2 or 4 months, I'd decided to go
for a recumbent trike instead, and could only afford it by selling my
ICE car (not for conversion) and apply for an xtracycle refund.
Perhaps in the future, when I have more cash on hand, and can actually
afford to convert my beloved ute to electric, I will look at it again.
Such a sweet looking product! :-)
Anyway, if you are the type that enjoys taking the bike out for a ride,
check this product out (in a few months when they have stock......) Same
for the electric attachment, different company though. They're not
currently taking orders, changes are a-happening.
About that StokeMonkey electric attachment, I reckon the main thing it
has got going for it, over the hub motors we all see is that its output
is attached to the pedal crank of the bicycle. Meaning that you have
some odd 400W of added power over your entire gear range, as compared to
a fixed ratio with a hub motor.
And yes, I tried purchasing one of those aswell. Well submitted my
interest was the best I could do as they haven't been accepting new
orders for at least 2 months now. I'm not sure about the holdups with
their products.
Two great products, just wish they were a little cheaper and in stock ;-)
Cheers,
James.
Ian Page-Echols wrote:
> I found the bike store Clever Chimp recently in my searchings for
> saddlebags for my bike. They sell, among other things, FreeRadical
> kits by Xtracycle, which attaches to the back of a normal bike and
> allows you to carry a ton of stuff on there (one of the images on the
> Xtracycle site shows a biker carrying a kayak!).
>
> What I just found was that Clever Chimp is selling an electric kit for
> bikes equipped this way. Looks pretty well thought out. Batteries
> are 36 volt NiMH (choice of 9 or 13Ah at 12 and 19 lbs) and it sounds
> like the motor and mountings are around 20 lbs. Top speeds of around
> 30 mph, and a range of around 50 miles (can't find this again, but I
> remember reading that number, most likely with the larger battery?),
> and $1350 for the kit. You're talking almost 70 lbs for a full bike
> set up this way, so might be best as a 2nd bike. Very tempting.
>
> http://www.xtracycle.com/freerad.php (North San Juan & Emeryville, CA)
> http://cleverchimp.com/products/stokemonkey/ (Portland)
>
> Ian
>
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I have my heater relay for my 220V pack grounded on one 12v side and
the other going to the positive wire of my heater fan through a
switch in the dash which used to be the AC switch, When the AC switch
is on and the fan is turned on the relay makes contact on the first,
second and third fan speed position but on the fourth position or the
highest, the relay drops out and I need to turn the fan off to get it
to contact again. I have a diode across the relay coil (not sure if
needed) and that's it. Any suggestions as to a fix for this and why
it happens on the high fan speed setting?
Thanks,
Mark
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Zeke,
We're talking maximum temperature on the insulation.
155 deg C for class F and 180 deg C for class H, which
a lot of motors use. Yea, that's hot. When the coil
insulation is at these limit temps, the outside of the
frame may be in the neighborhood of 100 deg C.
Jeff
--- Zeke Yewdall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 155 degree C, as in 312 degrees F? That seems
> awfully hot for a motor
> to me. I guess it's good, but I thought you were
> normally supposed to
> keep them below 100C or so...
>
> Z
>
> On 7/26/07, Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Zeke,
> >
> > Class F is for 155 degree C max. Most often used
> is
> > an allowable 115 deg C rise (over a 40 deg C
> ambient).
> >
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Zeke Yewdall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > sorry.
> > >
> > > It says
> > >
> > > CL.F DUTY-1 HR 115c
> > >
> > > Z
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
> > Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you
> sell.
> > http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/
> >
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
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on the rumor from Jukka, I contacted A123 to ask if they were iron or
cobalt cells. I got a partial answer
A123 Systems Product Evaluation wrote:
Mr. Frederiksen,
A123 utilizes a nano-phosphate technology that does not contain cobalt
or Manganese.
Best,
Steve
Either A123 is flat out lying or that bird you heard Jukka was a mocking
bird : )
Dan
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Joseph T. wrote:
As terribly ridiculous it sounds, it's true unfortunately. Tires that
are over 6 years old have aged, believe it or not from just sitting
there. The tires, despite little/no use, have deteriated enough to
make them dangerous. This article talks all about it:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/05/27/eveningnews/consumer/main698335.shtml
While I don't doubt that tires age, I must say that I don't believe the
effect is nearly as bad as this article indicates. It has a
sensationalist tone, and no real facts.
I would expect that as a tire ages, its load-carrying capacity (and
other parameters) will gradually decrease. Fine... *how much* capacity
does it lose after 6 years? 1%? 10%? 50%?
I *know* I've run tires more than twice the "6 year" age that article
touts, with not one single failure. I can think of endless numbers of
cases where people with old or classic cars are running tires that are
decades old. So my guess is that the percent degradation is low. It
would only matter in cases where the tire was already being run at its
full load capacity even when new.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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HI, Mark
I've set up my Echo the same way ( using the AC switch to control the
heater) so I'm familiar with the wiring.
The fan takes a lot of current on high (about 12 amps) , so I can think of
two possibilities:
1. Your 12V system voltage is dropping enough to drop the relay out. Put a
voltmeter on your 12V system and watch the voltage as you change the fan
speed.
2. There is enough voltage drop in the AC switch or wiring to allow the
relay voltage to drop when the fan is on high.
To check this, put a voltmeter on the relay coil and watch as you change
fan speeds.
What relay are you using?? It could be that the AC switch itself is the
culprit - it's only designed to send a signal to the A/C amplifier, not
power a large relay directly.
Mine is set up so that the AC switch only drives a small ( 17 ma coil) relay
, and THAT relay drives the larger KUEP relay ( 100 ma coil). You could try
something like that.
A third possibility ( this seems unlikely to me) is that the blower switch
is faulty and is not grounding the heater relay ( which needs to be on to
power the AC switch) when teh blower switch is in the "high" position. Or,
if the ground wire from the heater switch were loose, it might have that
same effect (because there is more current through that ground wire when the
fan is on "high").
Phil
From: Mark Dutko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Heater Relay Dropout Issue
Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 06:49:38 -0700
I have my heater relay for my 220V pack grounded on one 12v side and the
other going to the positive wire of my heater fan through a switch in the
dash which used to be the AC switch, When the AC switch is on and the fan
is turned on the relay makes contact on the first, second and third fan
speed position but on the fourth position or the highest, the relay drops
out and I need to turn the fan off to get it to contact again. I have a
diode across the relay coil (not sure if needed) and that's it. Any
suggestions as to a fix for this and why it happens on the high fan speed
setting?
Thanks,
Mark
_________________________________________________________________
http://newlivehotmail.com
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On some models the high side of the switch is feed through a different source
of power and not through the resistor block that feeds the lower fan speeds.
It might be dropping out because of that?
Tom
---- Mark Dutko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have my heater relay for my 220V pack grounded on one 12v side and
> the other going to the positive wire of my heater fan through a
> switch in the dash which used to be the AC switch, When the AC switch
> is on and the fan is turned on the relay makes contact on the first,
> second and third fan speed position but on the fourth position or the
> highest, the relay drops out and I need to turn the fan off to get it
> to contact again. I have a diode across the relay coil (not sure if
> needed) and that's it. Any suggestions as to a fix for this and why
> it happens on the high fan speed setting?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mark
>
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