Minsky's Guy in a Box, doesn't thrill me, Bruno. We may get to Moravec's 2G robot servant phase, not sure about 3 (they plead with us to be considered conscious). What thrills me is the idea that AI dumb or conscious, can improve on the inventions we have made, and make new inventions, which would change the way we all live. Religions will evolve because they are socially useful, and my concern about Islam stands. AI, which, will change the way we all live equals a Singularity, once it gets in high gear. When, is a gigantic question. But it's impact on faith will be unmistakable. The religions will have to adjust. Where do you pray toward when performing the shahada in the morning, if living on Mars? Easy, toward the earth, where Mecca is. Now, at what time do you do this, Mecca-time, or Mars time. Plus, the rising of the sun is a few light-minutes later (4:00 ?). Christmas on Mars? Santa Claus versus the Martians! https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0058548/For you, who's religion is mathematics, you might use your new, vastly, improved AI to solve for P=NP!
-----Original Message----- From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Wed, Sep 4, 2019 3:44 am Subject: Re: Quantum Foam On 3 Sep 2019, at 02:44, spudboy100 via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: Well, I tend not to disagree with you concerning Islam (The Uma) doing nothing about the Islamists, so that Kuffar lives (infidels) don't really matter under Sharia Law; and no we shouldn't opt to live under their Dhimmi Laws, in which we and our grandkids resign ourselves to permanent 2nd or 3rd class status (If Pakistan is any example?). The Ahmadis within Islam don't hold these values toward kuffar, and are hated by Sunni & Shia for their 'disloyalty.' I can see religions evolving because of this Singularity evolves, or errupts, as you have indicated below. My idea of a Singularity is way different from most people familiar with the term. I think that when AI gets harnessed more & more to the task of improving on, and creating wholly new inventions, this will change human life forever. (For the better). Minsky's brain in a box is nice, and good for stories and movies, but that is a secondary or tertiary thing. The singularity belongs to the past, and is the discovery of the universal machine or number, by Emil Post, Alan Turing, Alonzo Church, Stephen Kleene, … That machine is maximally intelligent and conscious (although in a highly dissociated mode). We can only make it more stupid. The “new” singularity is when the machine will be as stupid as the humans. The more neurons you have, the greatest is the range of the potential stupidity, which accompanies intelligence, and the competence which intelligence can make growing. Intelligence and consciousness are simple. Competence is multiple, have many incomparable degrees, is domain dependent, and it has a negative feedback on Intelligence. Bruno -----Original Message----- From: Lawrence Crowell <goldenfieldquaterni...@gmail.com> To: Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Mon, Sep 2, 2019 11:16 am Subject: Re: Quantum Foam On Sunday, September 1, 2019 at 9:57:43 PM UTC-5, spudb...@aol.com wrote: My guess, even if "young Crowell" objects, is that religion confers an evolutionary advantage to those so, deluded. Thus they, we, breed more offspring with this psychological trait, whilst the socialists doth diminish, hence, their mad- rush by progressives, worldwide, to embrace the Islamists as their chums, those wielders of the jihad. Chief enemy? Oh, any nationalist of any type will do. In any case, as it confers evolutionary advantage, the religions will evolve in their own Darwinian fashion, because around these regions, them's the rules! Nationalism, can surely be suicidal among the pig-ignorant, but among the more nuanced it too, can be am effective tool of survival. With religions tuned toward survival, even yes, postmortem, survival, as illusionary, as this may be; this also is a good evolutionary trait! May, the Spaghetti Monster guide thy path! For subsistence people the distinction between nature and spirits or supernature does not exist, and these provide a narrative framework for communicating information about the environment. We more modern people no longer really have a need for mythic thinking for survival, but it is still there. It has been used as a way to control people and society. As someone on the more progressive side of things, I have mixed sense about Islam. I am opposed to any mistreatment of Muslims, but I see the religion as frankly pernicious. I read a translation of the Koran after 9/11 and frankly the only book I ever read that shocked with as much ideological horror is Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf. During the cold war we did not permit Russian communists to emigrate to the US if they refused to renounce communism. I can almost see the same with Islam, but for our Constitutional protection of religious freedom. Some projections has Islam as the world majority world religion by 2070, but based on other projections the world implosion may be underway and Islam will just feast on the rotting corpse of the modern world --- never to arise again. I think humanity is approaching a sort of peak of all that we may come to know, prove, discover, create and invent. I think before long Homo sapiens will be slouching back to a stone age. The whole period we are in with civilization may be little more than an intermediate period between the Pleistocene stone age where the Earth was rich and abundant and the next stone age where Earth will be depleted and polluted. If so then mythic thinking might again have real survival benefits. If Islam takes control of the start into the next stone age, then frankly I could care less. My point with respect to this list though is that I think this is supposed to be largely about scientific questions and subjects. I did not subscribe to this in order to get screeds about Islam or any other religion. LC-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/1474c97d-d10b-4ef5-839e-a8be0850b6be%40googlegroups.com. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/2039784171.1629108.1567471493570%40mail.yahoo.com. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/B3E8F966-2883-4F44-B52F-398C56509B78%40ulb.ac.be. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/937959138.2641760.1567616740298%40mail.yahoo.com.
