when i had lyphoma, the last chemo knocked my red cells down and the dr stopped it. i am wondering if this would help humans fighting lyphoma and chemo? what is it's shelf life? might not hurt to have some on hand just in case. YES, i would be willing to try it siince the dr. told me none of the chemos did any good nd i was back to 3 months. 1 year later i went into spontaneous remission and have been there now for 10 years. maybe if we had ghone with winstrol to begin with.
---- Amani Oakley <aoak...@oakleylegal.com> wrote: > Hi Everyone > > With Ardy's permission, I want to share with everyone, the very promising > results we have gotten with the use of Winstrol. > > When Ardy first contacted me, she provided me with Tigger's lab results. As > Ardy has mentioned, the results were pretty grim. The key findings for me > were: > > March 12/16 Red Cells: 1.07 (RR: 5-10) > Haematocrit 6.3 (RR: 30.0 - 45.0%) > Haemoglobin 4.6 (RR: 9.0 - 15.1) > Reticulocyte 5.2% > WBC 3.3 (RR: 5.5 - 19.5) > %Neutrophils 16.4% > %Lymphocytes 64.0% > %Monocytes > NRBC None recorded > > Even though there are no reference ranges listed for the percentage > distribution of neutrophils and lymphocytes, I know this distribution pattern > is abnormal. There should be more neutrophils and lymphocytes in cats, with > the ratio being something like 1.8/1, so maybe 45% neutrophils and 25% to 35% > lymphocytes would be the kind of range one would like to see. The very high > lymphocyte count here (higher than the neutrophils) suggests these are > leukemic cells - ie abnormal lymphocytes produced as a result of the viral > infection. > > Ardy frantically tried all kinds of places to get the Winstrol and she was > finally able to get some and start Tigger on it, on March 15 - so three days > after this blood work was drawn. > > The next set of blood results showed an slight increase in red cells, a > significant increase in the haematocrit, haemoglobin, reticulocytes, and a > reversion of the neutrophil/lymphocyte distribution to what one would prefer > to see. > > March 25/16 Red Cells 1.70 (RR: 5-10) > Haematocrit 14.1 (RR: 30.0 - 45%) > Haemoglobin 4.6 (RR: 9.0 - 15.1) > Reticulocyte (Not done) > WBC 3.1 (RR: 5.5 - 19.5) > %Neutrophils 43% > %Lymphocytes 20% > %Monocytes 26% > %Blasts 9% > NRBC 9/100 WBC (Normal is 0) > > > So we started to see a slight increase in the red cell count (which although > it still is well out of reference range, is a 70% in increase from the > previous awful result. The haematocrit more than doubled. The haemoglobin > stayed about the same. The reticulocyte level wasn't done but we started to > see nucleated red blood cells (NRBC) appearing, which are immature red cells > which still have their nuclei - mature red cells do not have nuclei. This > indicates they are being pushed out early by the bone marrow in response to > the low red cell count. The neutrophil/lymphocyte ratio has normalized, but > the monocytes are quite high (usually are low like 2% or so) and are > indicative of an inflammatory process going on. The total white cell count > was still lower than the reference range, suggesting a depression of this > cell line as well. > > Not surprisingly, the pathologist who reviewed this set of blood results said > (in part) the following: "This anemia appears NON-REGENERATIVE, and although > I can't confirm the exact cause based on this CBC alone, given this > appearance, and especially the macrocytosis [elevated monocytes] and > metarubricytosis [presence of lots of nucleated red blood cells] and in the > face of minimal polychromasia, FeLV is my top differential. . . . The blasts > noted do appear consistent with lymphoblasts. . . While they could be > neoplastic, their overall concentration is small, and I could not confirm > neoplasia as seen here." > > In the meantime, Ardy was reporting that Tigger was not needing as much pain > medication (or any at all), and began to eat on his own. > > > The last set of blood results showed: > > April 26/16 Red Cells 1.67 (RR: 5-10) > Haematocrit 12.2 (RR 30.0 - 45%) > Haemoglobin 4.6 (RR: 9.0 - 15.1) > Reticulocyte 10.31% (Not usually seen) > WBC 4.9 (RR: 5.5 - 19.5) > %Neutrophils 45% > %Lymphocytes 40% > %Monocytes 3% > %Blasts 12% > NRBC 95/100 WBC (Normal is 0) > > So, looking at these results, I was initially concerned because of the slight > slippage of the red cell count but then I realized that if you combine the > red cells with the massive increase of nucleated red blood cells (95 per 100 > WBC's) and also add the reticulocytes (an even more immature form of red > cells), then we would actually be seeing a much much increased red cell > count. (See the comments from the Pathologist, which follow, to see that he > also has picked up on this.) I was also concerned about the drop in > haematocrit but then I recognized that the red cells are becoming more normal > in size (they were quite macrocytic in the last blood sample), so it would > show a drop because it is machine calculation. I also initially could not > understand why Ardy got a PCV result of 16 (with the previous one being 14), > because PCV and haematocrit are considered the same. However, thinking it > through further, I think the answer is that the PCV is the actual manual > spinning down of t he blood whereas the haematocrit is a machine calculation measuring the red cell density percentage. I think in this case, the machine has not added in the reticulocytes and the nucleated red blood cells in the calculation, whereas the manual spinning of the blood sample would have included these cells in the red cell density percentage. I therefore think that the true haematocrit is actually 16 not 12.2. > > In the microscopic, it is also noted that Howell-Jolly bodies are also > present. These are remnants of nuclei in mature red cells and again supports > the conclusion that there are a lot of new red cells coming out of the bone > marrow (which frankly, is amazing given that the blood work from the end of > March suggested that (a) the bone marrow was no longer producing red cells > and (b) the red cell population in the circulating blood was dangerously > depleted). > > The total white cell count has also increased to the point that it is just > below the normal reference range, so that is more good news. The lymphocyte > percentage is up a bit higher than we like to see, but the dramatic monocyte > count seen in the last sample has dropped significantly (12% to 3%), so > again, more normal. The blasts are still there. > > My opinion to Ardy was that she actually needed to double the Winstrol at > this point and put Tigger on Doxycycline. Ardy had discussed Doxycycline with > her vets but they talked her into Convenia instead. The great thing about > Convenia is that Tigger can get one shot which lasts several weeks, and so it > is one less thing Ardy has to stress him about in terms of giving him more > medicine. So we agreed to just keep going with the Convenia and play it by > ear. However, seeing the blasts and the slightly increased lymphocyte > percentage, I think that Doxycycline is needed here. I confirmed that while > Doxycycline (being an antibiotic) doesn't kill the FeLV virus, but it > interferes with RNA replication which is how the virus reproduces and pretty > much every source I checked recommended the use of Doxycycline when treating > for FeLV. Ardy has spoken to her vet about it. > > With respect to the Winstrol, I actually had my Zander on 2mg twice daily for > a long time - until his haematocrit went above 20 or 25 I think, and then I > dropped him down to 1 mg twice a day. However, any appreciable dip in the > haematocrit, I would go back to the 2 mg twice daily dose until I was > satisfied his results were stable again. My view is that while Tigger's red > cells and anemia have responded to the Winstrol, it is a sluggish response to > date (although the immature red cells are really appearing in significant > numbers), so I suggested we try 2 mg twice daily until his red cell counts > begin to recover more satisfactorily. > > Here is what the Pathologist is now saying, when looking at the CBC results: > "This anemia is MARKEDLY REGENERATIVE. While I would want to rule out > hemorrhage, given this presentation, I suspect this is secondary to > hemolysis. IMHA secondary to FIV infection is a differential to consider. . . > . I do recommend repeat CBCs with reticulocyte counts to monitor HCT levels > and regenerative status. Blasts are seen. Upon close review, they appear > consistent with large immature lymphocytes. While I couldn't rule out an > early leukemic population, they are still present in small numbers, and a > definitive diagnosis of neoplasia cannot be made here. Given their > concentration, it is also possible that they could also represent stimulated > inflammatory blasts instead. . . " Unfortunately, I think we have utterly > confused the pathologist at this point, because he has no idea what could > account for the change he has seen between the earlier blood results and this > one, so you can see he is now making other suggested diagnoses, and he doesn't even mention FeLV (though Tigger has tested positive several times now for FeLV). > > As Ardy has said, she knows that Tigger is not out of the woods yet, but we > are certainly seeing signs of moving in the right direction, though it will > be a bumpy ride for sure. We have had to adjust medications in response to > his symptoms, and Ardy has been unwavering in her commitment to her little > boy. She has had to deal with less-than-committed vets, who, as is often the > case, are ready to write off Tigger. Thankfully for Tigger, he has a tireless > defender on his side! > > I am also happy to see that the Winstrol appears to be making a big > difference here. As I have posted previously, when the bone marrow shuts > downs, I know of no other product that is able to turn it back on again to > produce red cells, white cells and platelets. Moreover, it is pretty darned > inexpensive compared to all the other products offered which sometimes work > but often don't. Ideally, in my view, if a cat is confirmed to be FeLV > positive, he/she should be started on Winstrol to AVOID the almost inevitable > crash in red cells, white cells and platelets. > > Amani > > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
