Bob -- Your classification of information-related concepts: • Data are the pure and simple facts without any particular structure or organization, the basic atoms of information,
• Information is structured data, which adds meaning to the data and gives it context and significance, • Knowledge is the ability to use information strategically to achieve one's objectives, and • Wisdom is the capacity to choose objectives consistent with one's values and within a larger social context slightly reworked, can be understood as a development using a subsumptive hierarchy: {facts {data -->information {knowledge {understanding}}}}} with {lower {higher}} STAN On Thu, Oct 5, 2017 at 12:39 PM, Bob Logan <lo...@physics.utoronto.ca> wrote: > Dear Arturo - I enjoyed your expression of your opinion because of its > directness and honesty even though I do not quite agree with everything you > said. I enjoyed it because it provoked the following thoughts. > > Yes you are right there seems to be a variety of opinions as to just what > information is. All of them are correct and all of them are wrong including > mine which I will share with you in a moment. They are right in that they > describe some aspect of the notion of information and they are all wrong > because they are attempting to be precise and that is not possible. All > words including the word ‘information’ are metaphors and a metaphor cannot > be right or wrong - it can only be illuminating if inspired or irrelevant > if too narrow. I am afraid caro Arturo that there cannot be a scientific > definition of ‘information’ because definitions cannot be falsified and as > Karl Popper once suggested for a proposition to be scientific it has to be > falsifiable. Of course this is Popper’s definition of science so some may > disagree. So I am with you so far. But where I have to disagree is when you > call the activity of trying to define information a useless activity. I > think it is useful if only for us to see the various dimensions of this > notion. > > Now as promised my thoughts re: what is information? In fact I have > written a whole book on the subject which I invite all FISers to read free > of charge as it is available in an open access format at > demopublishing.com > The availability of the book for free is part of an experiment in which I > wanted to explore if a book could be a two-way form of communication > between an author and his or her readers. So FISers please help yourself to > my book and if you do please honour me with a comment or two as the Web > site you access the book at also has provisions for you feedback. PS - The > book is also available in hard copy from Amazon. > > So now for my definition of information as can be found in the book. > > • Data are the pure and simple facts without any particular structure or > organization, the basic atoms of information, > > • Information is structured data, which adds meaning to the data and gives > it context and significance, > > • Knowledge is the ability to use information strategically to achieve > one's objectives, and > > • Wisdom is the capacity to choose objectives consistent with one's > values and within a larger social context > > In the book I also quote T. S. Eliot whose lines of poetry provide another > perspective on wisdom, knowledge and information > > Where is the wisdom we have lost in knowledge? > Where is the knowledge we have lost in information? – TS Eliot > > My definition of information as well as that of TS Eliot does not > encompass the notion of physicists who talk about information in terms of > Wheeler’s "it from bit” idea. > For me inanimate objects have no information because they have no choice. > They slavishly follow the laws of physics. Only biological, living > organisms have information because they have choice and information is that > which allows them to make their choices. And information is that which they > perceive through their senses from the simplest bacteria to us humans that > ee cummings described as "fine specimen(s) of hypermagical > ultraomnipotence” So this is my second notion of what is ‘information’. > > Even a book is not a form of information. It is the record of information > created by its author and it is a medium that allows its readers to recreate > that original information of its author. From a McLuhan perspective we could > > also ask is information the medium or the message. McLuhan would say they are > the same since he said 'the medium is the message'. And he would also agree > that it is the reader that recreates information when the book > > is read since he also said “the user is the content”. > > Since composing this response a post from Lars-Göran Johansson appeared with > which I am in agreement > > Best wishes to all - Bob Logan > > > > ______________________ > > Robert K. Logan > Prof. Emeritus - Physics - U. of Toronto > Fellow University of St. Michael's College > Chief Scientist - sLab at OCAD > http://utoronto.academia.edu/RobertKLogan > www.researchgate.net/profile/Robert_Logan5/publications > https://www.physics.utoronto.ca/people/homepages/logan/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 4, 2017, at 1:49 PM, tozziart...@libero.it wrote: > > -------- Messaggio inoltrato -------- Da: tozziart...@libero.it A: Alex > Hankey alexhan...@gmail.com Data: mercoledì, 04 ottobre 2017, 07:37PM > +02:00 Oggetto: Re[2]: [Fis] Heretic > > > Dear Prof. Hankey, > I come from a free country, where everybody can say his own opinion, in > particular if his opinion is not totally stupid. > The times of Giordano Bruno and Inquisition are gone. > > -- > Inviato da Libero Mail per Android > mercoledì, 04 ottobre 2017, 06:20PM +02:00 da Alex Hankey > alexhan...@gmail.com: > > Dear Professor Tozzi, > > Might I suggest that you graciously retire from the list, > as you evidently do not wish to participate in what > the rest of us find fascinating topics of discussion. > > As a physicist, I have no difficulty in relating to the concept of > 'information', > and I am aware of no less than five conceptually totally different > mathematical structures, all of which merit the name, 'information'. > > With all good wishes, > > Alex Hankey > > > On 4 October 2017 at 02:30, <tozziart...@libero.it> wrote: > > Dear FISers, > After the provided long list of completely different definitions of the > term "information", one conclusion is clear: there is not a scientific, > unique definition of information. > > Nobody of us is able to provide an operative framework and a single (just > one!) empirical testable prevision able to assess "information". > For example, what does "semantics" and "meaning" mean, in empirical terms? > Therefore, to talk about information is meaningless, in the carnapian > sense. > > Judging from your answers, the most of you are foremost scientists. > Therefore, my proposal is to forget about information, and to use your > otherwise very valuable skills and efforts in other fields. > It is a waste of your precious time to focus yourself in something that > is so vague. It is, retrospectively, a mistake to state that the world is > information, if nobody knows what does it mean. > > -- > Inviato da Libero Mail per Android > > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > > > > > -- > Alex Hankey M.A. (Cantab.) PhD (M.I.T.) > Distinguished Professor of Yoga and Physical Science, > SVYASA, Eknath Bhavan, 19 Gavipuram Circle > Bangalore 560019, Karnataka, India > Mobile (Intn'l): +44 7710 534195 <+44%207710%20534195> > Mobile (India) +91 900 800 8789 <+91%2090080%2008789> > ____________________________________________________________ > > 2015 JPBMB Special Issue on Integral Biomathics: Life Sciences, > Mathematics and Phenomenological Philosophy > <http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/00796107/119/3> > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > > > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > >
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