Umm fun fact: the reason so much Ai development uses female models first is because of a much easier timer 'reading' the Ai's emotions. Yeah yeah. back in the day geeks being single males, was why. Now it turns out it's much easier to predict and model female ai's . Male Ai's for what ever reason, tend to get hostile, moody, and unpredictable quickly. I have no idea why. Purely as a measuring stick for advances of consciousness. those kinds of things was when we knew we were close to neuro nets with at least somewhat quantifiable spooky programing and some measuring stick for amount of consciousness. I have no idea how, or why that happened. People that know vastly more about the field of Ai hopefully do know what all the above tends to be true.
On Wed, Oct 19, 2022 at 11:16 AM Steve Smith <sasm...@swcp.com> wrote: > > On 10/18/22 10:21 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > > A deep learning system set up for next sentence prediction, one that > consumed gigabytes of literature, would learn to mimic emotions as > expressed in writing. It would likely have mappings of context and events > to plausible emotional descriptions. It would have latent encodings about > the same kinds of things that a person would care about, if exposed to the > same information. It might well have latent states for fear and love and > such. My conclusion would be that emotions are not to be taken so > seriously. > > In the early days of N-gram (early for me, early also because CPU/Storage > had gotten cheap enough for large corpii) analysis I was impressed with how > prophetic something *that* simple could be was. Today's > spell-correction/suggestion etc. stuff is eerie (uncanny?) to me. A few > years ago I wouldn't have imagined that convincing "next sentence > prediction" was imminent, but now I'm ready to expect it any second. > Similar with body-language prediction as a corollary to this *and* to > automated driving... > > In a couple of hours, Dick Gabriel will be giving his talk at SimTable on > his Poetry Generator Inkwell, which I have had my doubts about in > principle. His scholarly essay on the topic The Nature of Poetic Order > <http://www.natureoforder.com/library/nature-of-poetic-order.pdf> is too > large (100 pages) and dense for me to have quaffed in the time available, > but the bits I *have* been able to take in are very promising as one (of > many possible?) perspectives on higher order semantic analysis of texts. > > I don't think writing or analyzing poetry is necessarily anything like the > pinnacle of conscious processing, but it is probably an > important/interesting edge/corner case. > > I'm still processing your concluding statement "emotions are not to be > taken so seriously". I watch my young puppy/kitty growing up together and > virtually *all* I can parse from their interactions with one another, their > people and their physical enviornment IS emotional, and they either take it > all very seriously or not at all? > > > On Oct 18, 2022, at 5:36 PM, Gillian Densmore <gil.densm...@gmail.com> > <gil.densm...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > *terminator soundtrack here* > > On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 5:55 PM Prof David West <profw...@fastmail.fm> > wrote: > >> Maybe lack of emotion, but ability to 'fake it' by repeating what it >> read a being with that emotion would say only proves the AI is a sociopath >> or psychopath. >> >> davew >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022, at 4:44 PM, Russ Abbott wrote: >> >> When Blake Lemoine claimed that LaMDA was conscious, it struck me that >> one way to test that would be to determine whether one could evoke an >> emotional response from it. You can't cause it physical pain since it >> doesn't have sense organs. But, one could ask it if it cares about >> anything. If so, threaten to harm whatever it is it cares about and see how >> it responds. A nice feature of this test, or something similar, is that you >> wouldn't tell it what the reasonable emotional responses might be. >> Otherwise, it could simply repeat what it read a being with that emotion >> would say. One might argue that emotion is not a necessary element of >> consciousness, but I think a being without emotion would be at best a pale >> version of consciousness. >> >> -- Russ Abbott >> Professor Emeritus, Computer Science >> California State University, Los Angeles >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 2:14 PM Prof David West <profw...@fastmail.fm> >> wrote: >> >> >> I an concurrently reading, *Nineteen Ways of Looking at Consciousness*, >> by Patrick House and *Mountain in the Sea*, by Ray Nayler. The latter is >> fiction. (The former, because it deals with consciousness may also be >> fiction, but it purports to be neuro-scientific / philosophical.) >> >> The novel is about Octopi and AI and an android, plus humans and >> juxtaposes ideas about consciousness in comparison and contrast. A lot of >> fun. >> >> Both books pose some interesting questions and both support glen's >> advocacy of a typology. >> >> davew >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022, at 1:26 PM, glen wrote: >> > There are many different measures of *types* of consciousness. But >> > without specifying the type, such questions are not even philosophical. >> > They're nonsense. >> > >> > For example, the test of whether one can recognize one's image in a >> > mirror couldn't be performed by a chatbot. But it is one of the >> > measures of consciousness. Another type of test would be those that >> > measure conscious state before, during, and after anesthesia. Again, >> > that wouldn't work the same for a chatbot. But both aggregate measures >> > like EEG and fMRI connectomes might have analogs in tracing for >> > algorithms like ANNs. If we could simply decide "Yes, *that* chatbot is >> > what we're going to call conscious and, therefore, the traced patterns >> > it exhibits in the profiler are the correlates for chatbot >> > consciousness." Then we'd have a trace-based test to perform on other >> > chatbots *with similar computational structure*. >> > >> > Hell, the cops have their tests for consciousness executed at drunk >> > driving checkpoints. Look up and touch your nose. Recite the alphabet >> > backwards. Etc. These are tests for types of consciousness. Of course, >> > I feel sure there are people who'd like to move the goal posts and >> > claim "That's not Consciousness with a big C." Pffft. No typology ⇒ no >> > science. So if someone can't list off a few distinct types of >> > consciousness, then it's not even philosophy. >> > >> > On 10/18/22 13:12, Jochen Fromm wrote: >> >> Paul Buchheit asked on Twitter >> >> https://twitter.com/paultoo/status/1582455708041113600 >> >> >> >> "Is consciousness measurable, or is it just a philosophical concept? >> If an AI claims to be conscious, how do we know that it's not simply >> faking/imitating consciousness? Is there something that I could challenge >> it with to prove/disprove consciousness?" >> >> >> >> What do you think? Interesting question. >> >> >> >> -J. >> > >> > >> > -- >> > ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ >> > >> > -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . >> > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom >> > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam >> > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> > archives: 5/2017 thru present >> > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ >> > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom >> https://bit.ly/virtualfriam >> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> archives: 5/2017 thru present >> https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ >> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >> >> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom >> https://bit.ly/virtualfriam >> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> archives: 5/2017 thru present >> https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ >> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >> >> >> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom >> https://bit.ly/virtualfriam >> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> archives: 5/2017 thru present >> https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ >> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >> > -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > > -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >
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