Linux-Advocacy Digest #15, Volume #35 Wed, 6 Jun 01 20:13:05 EDT
Contents:
Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft (Larry Elmore)
Re: Why Linux Is no threat to Windows domination of the desktop (The Ghost In The
Machine)
Re: UI Importance (GreyCloud)
Re: XP - what's for me? ("Weevil")
Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux starts getting
good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!) (Charlie Ebert)
Re: Compiling Knews was: Linux beats Win2K (again) (flatfish+++)
Re: Just when Linux starts getting good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!
("Interconnect")
Re: Compiling Knews was: Linux beats Win2K (again) (flatfish+++)
Re: Silly Gnome DNS lookups (Nic Bellamy)
Re: UI Importance (GreyCloud)
Re: UI Importance (GreyCloud)
Re: Windows advocate of the year. ("Weevil")
Re: UI Importance (Josiah Fizer)
Re: XP - what's for me? (Richard Thrippleton)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Larry Elmore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.arch,misc.invest.stocks
Subject: Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:12:13 GMT
Peter da Silva wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Larry Elmore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > How? Don't they pay M$ per copy they ship? If they don't ship it, they
> > dont have to pay M$ for it. (I know that wasn't always the case, but
> > that was then and this is now)
>
> Then they get the cost of the OS back. If they really do have the option.
>
> > > Oh, Microsoft doesn't let you do that? Well, isn't that the point?
>
> > Umm, didn't Microsoft get nailed in the courts and have to stop that
> > practice some years ago, _before_ the "big" antitrust case?
>
> Technically, yes. In practice, the situation is not much changed.
It's not? You mean there actually _aren't_ any companies that now sell
both Windows and Linux PCs? I'd have _sworn_ I'd read about several
doing so. Must've just been propaganda. :)
> Have you tried getting a rebate for the copy of Windows you didn't use? Some
> people have managed it. It's no easier than removing a welded-on outboard
> without damaging it.
<...>
> Sure, you can get a welding torch and cut the motor off. You still don't
> get to buy it without the motor.
You do if you go to the right manufacturer. Where's it written that
_every_ seller of computers ought to customize to the buyer's content?
For that matter, where's it written that _any_ have to do so? Or that
those who do must be easy to find, as easy as Walmart or Costco? By
definition, mass marketers deal with the _mass_ market. If you want
custom stuff, you generally have to go to a custom shop, _regardless_
of what the product is! Try buying shoes without shoelaces and getting a
discount on the final price some time -- it can be done, but not through
any major retailer, that's for sure!
If I wanted a PowerPC-system with Linux or without an OS, I think it
would be quite a bit harder to find than an Intel-based PC with Linux or
without an OS. I strongly suspect you'd have to look long and far
(probably forever) for a dealer who'd sell you an _Apple_ machine
without MacOS for a discount! I realize, of course, that the dealers
can't buy Apple's without MacOS, so they sure aren't going to take money
off for erasing MacOS, but by the same token, most stores that sell
computers don't have a choice as to whether a not an OS comes with what
they've bought from manufacturers. Lord knows, there'd be almost _no_
demand at most computer stores for a machine without an OS, so why keep
one in stock? And so what if they erase Windows off a machine that came
with it and sell it? What are they going to transfer the license to?
> > It's not like Windows is "welded on", is it? Nor are you forced to
> > dual-boot. And you could theoretically sell your copy of Windows as long
> > as all traces of it were erased off your machine, right?
>
> Not without violating the license. The last PCs we bought, the license was
> a sticker attached to the case. Even before that, it was labelled "Only for
> sale with a new PC". Sometimes you don't even get physical media, you just
> get a CD image on the second partition you can burn to a CD if you want.
The license is in Windows itself, as well (try "Help"). The copy of
Windows 98 that came on my wife's computer (still there because some
things still require it, like most games, even though we both mostly use
Debian) says in its EULA that _only_ if the product is marked "Not for
Resale" may it not be sold, and that the initial owner may sell it once.
> Microsoft really tries very hard to make sure Windows is as "welded" to the
> computer as they can.
I'm sure they do. What else would you expect them to try to do? I
certainly don't like all of their methods and past actions, but they're
beginning to feel the reaction of the market against them, too. They
will feel it more as time goes on, and it will likely have profound
effects _long_ before the antitrust case ever gets out of the appeal
process, I think. I suspect the Microsoft antitrust case will go the way
of the IBM antitrust case -- the only _real_ winners will be the
lawyers.
Larry
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why Linux Is no threat to Windows domination of the desktop
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:12:55 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Tue, 15 May 2001 21:51:17 -0400
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Ray Fischer wrote:
>>
>> Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >Ray Fischer wrote:
>> >> Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> >Ray Fischer wrote:
>> >> >> Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> >> >Edward Rosten wrote:
>>
>> >> >> >> > Where in my statements did I say I was afraid
>> >> >> >> > of homosexuals. I am not afraid of them anymore
>> >> >> >> > than I am afraid of people with bipolar disorder
>> >> >> >> > or any other genetic malfunction.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> If you have really firm evidence that homosexualtiy
>> >> >> >> is genetic, I suggest you publish.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Then you admit that it's a choice.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Why are bigots so often stupidly illiterate as well?
>> >> >
>> >> >I have a right to judge other people by their CHOICES and BEHAVIOR.
>> >>
>> >> Ditto, bigot.
>> >
>> >So, if I hold someone's felonious behavior against them,
>>
>> Being a homosexual is not a felony, bigot.
>
>But it's even MORE revolting.
To you, perhaps. To others, it's perfectly natural.
That's your problem; I doubt that they care. (I can't say I do.)
Now flaunting it in public may be all of our problems -- although
I can't say they're any worse than some of the hardcore feminists,
another group that is apparently also in the disfavor of conservatives.
Why, I'm not entirely sure, although it may be in part because of
misconceptions such as the notion that homosexuality is a choice
(lesbians are homosexual, too) and that male homosexuals spread AIDS
(AFAIK, no more so than heterosexuals; any intimate contact that
exchanges and/or transmits fluids will run the risk of giving away
the retrovirus), or that promiscuous sex damages society somehow
(there is a risk of disease, but that's why people take precautions).
But there's a difference between how one conducts oneself in the
bedroom, and in the boardroom. Parading around nude in the bedroom
isn't a problem, but parading around nude in the boardroom or along
a parade route might not get the desired result.
(Side point: homosexuality has also been observed in (other) primates,
in the wild. How "natural" is that?)
[.sigsnip]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
EAC code #191 37d:05h:26m actually running Linux.
I am, you are, he, she, and it is, but they're not.
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: UI Importance
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:23:33 -0700
Ayende Rahien wrote:
>
> "drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:31:59 +0200, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> > ("Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
> >
> > >"drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > >> >It does teach you a good lesson on how C works.
> > >>
> > >> IF you already know how it works.
> > >
> > >And if you don't, you'll search for the info.
> > >Point of the excersize completed.
> > >If you don't search for the info, then another point of the excersize was
> > >completed. You aren't fit to be a programmer.
> >
> > What's the point in the exercise at all if you have to search for
> > everything afterwards?
>
> That you learn how to search for the info.
> You need a photographic memory and a really funky brain to remeber
> everything about computers. The average programmer doesn't even bother to
> remember anything that he doesn't commonly use, they just use MSDN or the
> equilent for their enviroment. If you can't do that, you can't program
> anything of value, period.
>
> This also teach you to some of the basics in C, as well.
That pretty much summed up how I had to approach projects. I had way
too many books then to search thru, and then I had to draw up a general
plan of how the program was supposed to accomplish it and then go out
and start asking the prospective if that is what they really wanted.
I'd refine all the things they wanted in a few visits before I started
any code. Then I wrote up what was necessary and what were going to be
potential roadblocks and attacked the difficult areas first. I didn't
have time to know the whole language and all its idiosyncracies.
--
V
------------------------------
From: "Weevil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: XP - what's for me?
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:25:32 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:c2yT6.8484$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Ian Pegel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9flr50$679$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:TKlT6.8411$
> > > Is that a sentance?
> >
> > ...has that been spell-checked?
> >
> > LOL
>
> I don't pick knits over spelling in most cases, since typos happen. Hell,
> Even words in the wrong places are fine or other such compositional
errors,
> but this wasn't.
>
Nah, you just did it because of who wrote it. Had Chad Meyers, or any other
windows advocate, written the same thing, you would have said nothing.
And by the way, it's "nit," not "knit." Look up nit, think about it for a
minute, and then you'll understand the metaphor and never make that mistake
again. :)
On an unrelated note, I wonder if Bill Gates understands what a prime number
is yet?
--
Weevil
"The obvious mathematical breakthrough [for breaking encryption schemes]
would be development of an easy way to factor large prime numbers."
-- Bill Gates
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charlie Ebert)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux starts
getting good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:26:51 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Stephen Edwards wrote:
>
>I'm sick of working-class union-types, who think that
>being American is about being a worker all your life.
>
>Being an American is about achieving greatness, on your
>own, like in the old days, when people knew what they
>had. If you think that there's no reason to love the
>US, then I'd suggest that you go and live in China for
>a few years, and then we'll see what you have to say.
>
>If you don't understand that, then you are a spineless
>coward.
>
>Godammed fucking linguini-spined coward liberals just
>piss me off... GRRR!@#
You are quite possibly the most disgusting person
I've ever encountered on the Internet.
It is a horrible shame that you are amongst us.
--
Charlie
=======
------------------------------
From: flatfish+++ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Compiling Knews was: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:28:47 GMT
On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:53:59 +0000, "Gary Hallock"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>
>This had nothing to do with docs. The install disk was defective. Like
>I said, that is something that should be expected once in a while given
>the poor reliabilty of floppy disks. It was the Windows software that
>detected a new device and went out looking for a driver that screwed up.
>Windows should have done some sanity checks before starting the install.
In my case Windows 98SE didn't know anything about the card. The
install disks from Linksys were an abortion.
>So, you agree. Linux just worked and Windows failed miserably,
No.
I am saying some Linux distos worked fine and others failed.
Win2k worked fine will Win98se failed.
>
>Yeh, W2K works, unless you already have one NIC installed. As I have
>mentioned here before, when I installed an ethernet card on my Thinkpad,
>it already had a working token ring card. W2K refused to install the
>ethernet and totally screwed things up with no rational error messages
>until I uninstalled the token ring card and deleted all references to
>TCP/IP. But, once again, Linux just worked. Why can't W2K handle
>adding a second NIC?
Good for you, I have still be unable to get an IBM Token Ring 16/4
card working with ANY distribution.
>> MAJOR difference in time.
>>
>
>And W2K still sucks, just for different rreasons than W98.
Not as much as Linux.
Websters dictionary still has Linux listed.
It says "see Sucks"
>> So, I agree with you in this case.
>>
>
------------------------------
From: "Interconnect" <mark###@logichip.com.au>
Subject: Re: Just when Linux starts getting good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 09:42:15 +1000
Mike Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Ha! Well said. When -- eons ago -- I was faced with paying several hundred
> dollars to get a Windows server license for my house, I looked for better
> options. (Not to mention, I would have had to buy new hardware to run it.)
>
> That was about the time I found Linux and MASQ. In fact, still today I'm
> writing this on the connection provided by that HP Vectra. 90 Mhz and
> almost a year of uptime.
>
> Microsoft is having a hard time competing with Linux since I can go and
> buy a boxed set for $30 and run comparable services for years with fewer
> reboots than it takes to configure basic networking under Windows.
>
> Sure Windows runs things right out of the box. All the user has to do is
> pay the fees, choose the right options with the mouse, reboot, and they
> get the functionality they want. Sure, installing a MASQ server meant
> recompiling the kernel for me.
>
> But even recompiling a kernel is nearly idiot proof these days (I was
> pretty green when I did it), and coupled with the excellent step-by-step
> directions provided by various How-Tos, one can't fail.
>
> How do you compete with that?
Quite simply MS can't. Which is why they and the Winvocates are running
scared of Linux and GPL.
> - Mike Johnson
> Network Administrator
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Chad Everett"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> > The issue was whether I could use my Windows machine as a NAT server and
> > firewall for my private LAN with out-of-the-box software. Answer was
> > "No...unless you want to purchase Windows 2K Server...Windows 2K Pro
> > can't do it cause Microsoft provides a 'whole' solution" meaning Win2K
> > Pro has ICS but it is so severly crippled, it's useless.
> >
> > The issue was whether I could setup my Windows machine so that I could
> > run GUI applications remotely over a secure encrypted channel from
> > multi-platform remote hosts and do it with out-of-the-box free software.
> > Answer was "No....you can purchase terminal services but that only works
> > with other Windows machines cause Microsoft provides a 'whole'
> > solution".
> >
> > I could continue...but as you can see....Windows can't compete with the
> > power and functionality and cost of Linux....cause Microsoft provides a
> > "whole" solution.
> > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
> > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> > -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
>
>
> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
------------------------------
From: flatfish+++ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Compiling Knews was: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:30:58 GMT
On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:40:46 +0000, "Gary Hallock"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>It is a text file. Windows just insists on requiring that extra CR when
>the rest of the world does not. And why does Windows still default to
>notepad for text files? I have lost count of the number of times I have
>tried to view a text file on Windows and it defaults to using notepad
>which then chokes - and these are Windows files, not a text file from a
>Linux install disk.
>
>Gary
Point is, YOU know that.
Now I know that.
The icon displayed when the newbie double clicks on it doesn't match
any Windows file formats.
How is he supposed to know to pick Wordpad?
User unfriendliness is something Linux is an expert at.
flatfish+++
"Why do they call it a flatfish?"
------------------------------
From: Nic Bellamy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Silly Gnome DNS lookups
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 11:33:50 +1200
ipslo wrote:
>
> I don't know why Gnome insists on doing a DNS lookup every time you open
> an application. KDE probably does the same. If for some reason your
> internet goes down you can't open any applications. Try this, just
> disconnect the network cable and try to open something. It sits there
> like an idiot. When you have unreliable internet service like roadrunner
> this can be very annoying. One weekend their DNS server took 10 seconds
> for every request. It's annoying to wait 10 second to open your
> applications.
Although this is an *.advocacy group, helping people is good advocacy,
so....:
Is your machines' hostname set up in /etc/hosts? Probably the simplest
setup would be to have the following in there:
127.0.0.1 localhost yourhostname.yourdomainname yourhostname
See if that helps.
Regards,
Nic.
-- Nic Bellamy <nic at asterisk dot co dot nz>
IT Consultant, Asterisk Limited - http://www.asterisk.co.nz/
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: UI Importance
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:34:45 -0700
Josiah Fizer wrote:
>
> On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:49:01 -0600, Dave Martel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> >On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:11:40 GMT, "Mike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:00:13 +1200, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> >>> ("Stuart Fox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
> >>
> >>> >Give me an example of how it's crippled?
> >>>
> >>> No command history, no tab completion, leaving lines all over the
> >>> place, shitty shell scripting, shitty redirection, scrolling back up
> >>> the screen, less ability to customise the prompt, no starting
> >>> processes in the background, no ansi colours in prompt, I could go on,
> >>> but I won't
> >>
> >>Are you using Win98?
> >>
> >>The W2k CLI has command history, tab completion (or use the key of your
> >>choice), full redirection (stdin, stdout, stderr), can start processes in
> >>the background, and my shells have 2000 lines of memory (the length is user
> >>programmable).
> >>
> >>There are things that the W2k command line doesn't have, and I could
> >>probably add quite a few significant things to your list. But, I won't.
> >>
> >
> >Still leaving lousy shell scripting and a "choice" of only one shell.
> >
> >BTW has MS implemented *real* regular-expression matching yet?
> >
>
> How is there only one choic of shells? I use TCSH on my Windows 2k
> box.
>
> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
I've never used Win2k... does it have the basic sh shell, ksh korn
shell, tsc tenex c shell, or bash?
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: UI Importance
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:36:01 -0700
Stuart Fox wrote:
>
> "drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:00:13 +1200, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> >
> > >Give me an example of how it's crippled?
> >
> > No command history,
>
> Available in both Win9x & NT. It's on by default in WinNT, you have to run
> doskey to use it in Win9x
>
> > no tab completion,
>
> Available in WinNT
>
> >leaving lines all over the
> > place,
>
> ?
>
> > shitty shell scripting
>
> Debatable. Most NT Admins can get the job done with it. Then again, are we
> talking inherent, or are we talking something like perl?
>
> >, shitty redirection
>
> WinNT does < > |, as well as piping errors to different locations (just like
> Unix)
>
> >, scrolling back up
> > the screen
>
> Which you can do in WinNT
>
> >, less ability to customise the prompt
>
> From Windows 98
> PROMPT [text]
>
> text Specifies a new command prompt.
>
> Prompt can be made up of normal characters and the following special codes:
>
> $Q = (equal sign)
> $$ $ (dollar sign)
> $T Current time
> $D Current date
> $P Current drive and path
> $V Windows version number
> $N Current drive
> $G > (greater-than sign)
> $L < (less-than sign)
> $B | (pipe)
> $H Backspace (erases previous character)
> $E Escape code (ASCII code 27)
> $_ Carriage return and linefeed
>
> >, no starting
> > processes in the background
>
> I'll give you that one.
>
> >, no ansi colours in prompt,
>
> How terrible.
>
> > I could go on,
> > but I won't
>
> It's probably best. The doctor will be coming with your medicine soon
A long time ago MS was advertising named pipes in NT. Do they still
have that in Win2k?
--
V
------------------------------
From: "Weevil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows advocate of the year.
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 23:41:06 GMT
Paolo Ciambotti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Ray Chason"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > My nomination for Winvocate in a Tux is Ebert. Sometimes I wonder if
> > that man is sane.
>
> Oh shit, Charlie is one of my heroes. Nobody ever wonders what side of
> the fence he's on; he calls a spade a spade. And sometimes a diamond or a
> club or a heart gets called a spade too. Charlie cuts a wide swath.
>
> I had a meeting this morning where I wish I had Charlie on our team. I
> would have loved to see the look on my CEO's face when Charlie accused him
> of sucking Bill Gates' oatmeal-covered genitalia for a breakfast snack.
> And it would have been even more fun if Charlie had got in the mood and
> started being actually insulting.
>
> Yeah, I'll vote for Charlie for whatever. So... what are we gonna name
> these awards? Emmy, Oscar, we too gotta have something catchy.
The Billy, of course. There can be no other name for such an award.
--
Weevil
"The obvious mathematical breakthrough [for breaking encryption schemes]
would be development of an easy way to factor large prime numbers."
-- Bill Gates
------------------------------
From: Josiah Fizer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: UI Importance
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:53:04 -0700
On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:34:45 -0700, GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>Josiah Fizer wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:49:01 -0600, Dave Martel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:11:40 GMT, "Mike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>"drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2001 17:00:13 +1200, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
>> >>> ("Stuart Fox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> >Give me an example of how it's crippled?
>> >>>
>> >>> No command history, no tab completion, leaving lines all over the
>> >>> place, shitty shell scripting, shitty redirection, scrolling back up
>> >>> the screen, less ability to customise the prompt, no starting
>> >>> processes in the background, no ansi colours in prompt, I could go on,
>> >>> but I won't
>> >>
>> >>Are you using Win98?
>> >>
>> >>The W2k CLI has command history, tab completion (or use the key of your
>> >>choice), full redirection (stdin, stdout, stderr), can start processes in
>> >>the background, and my shells have 2000 lines of memory (the length is user
>> >>programmable).
>> >>
>> >>There are things that the W2k command line doesn't have, and I could
>> >>probably add quite a few significant things to your list. But, I won't.
>> >>
>> >
>> >Still leaving lousy shell scripting and a "choice" of only one shell.
>> >
>> >BTW has MS implemented *real* regular-expression matching yet?
>> >
>>
>> How is there only one choic of shells? I use TCSH on my Windows 2k
>> box.
>>
>> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
>> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
>> -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
>
>I've never used Win2k... does it have the basic sh shell, ksh korn
>shell, tsc tenex c shell, or bash?
Not out of the box. But that's understandable since it would require
MS to write lots of extra documentation. However you can install all
of the basic shells from a number of sources, both comercial and
freeware.
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------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Thrippleton)
Subject: Re: XP - what's for me?
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:41:00 +0000
In article <C0yT6.8483$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
>Second, your facts are wrong about the UK website, many Macintosh and even
>linux users have been able to access it, the problem is with the 128 bit
>security which the site requires, not because of any specific MS extensions.
If their vague 'security add-in' means SSL, then Links with 128-bit
SSL is most firmly denied. The site was developed by MS, hence they will
obviously abuse that power; how much clearer can it be? Not that I'm too
disappointed, considering the entirely fscked attitude our govt. has towards
the internet; yell 'paedophile' or 'terrorist' and they seem entirely happy
to turn the country into an online police state.
Richard
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