Linux-Advocacy Digest #143, Volume #35 Mon, 11 Jun 01 22:13:02 EDT
Contents:
Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff? (Terry Porter)
Re: MS at it again (Charles Lyttle)
Re: Windows makes good coasters (Terry Porter)
Re: More micro$oft "customer service" (Woofbert)
Re: double whopper with cheese a threat to heterosexuals (Richard Fisher)
Re: More micro$oft "customer service" (Woofbert)
Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft (Larry Elmore)
Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff? (Bob Hauck)
Mail Order Brides? Check this place out! ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Linux dead on the desktop. (B. P. Uecker)
Re: Microsft IE6 smart tags ("Paolo Ciambotti")
Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft (Andrew Reilly)
Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals ("Goddess")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff?
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 12 Jun 2001 01:04:42 GMT
On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:09:46 +0100,
pip <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Terry Porter wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:40:40 +0100,
>> pip <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> > I use Gnome. I am sorry, but I don't see how it is a failure ? It's now
>> > fast and stable and I like it very much. Just because you have a some
>> > beef with their implementation and language choice - it is far to harsh
>> > to say this. As far as I (a user) am concerned it is great - and as a
>> > programmer they have added some wonderful things! All the better.
>>
>> Hey Pip, which version of Gnome are you reffering to ?
>>
>> I really like Gnome, tho the version that came with Mandrake7.1 was
>> too unstable for me, suffering the odd WM freeze :(
>>
>> Any advice re production suitability for Gnome ?
>
> Which ever version came with RH7 and RH7.1.
Cool, then I'm off to get RH7.1 and give it a go.
>
> Anyway, by your tone I can tell you disagree - and I am not saying that
> you are not correct - just that in my experience it is fine for me (RH
> 6.2 Gnome version was crap). Anyway there is KDE for you, so everyone is
> happy.
Actually I'm not disagreeing, I'm wondering if I had a version that was
uncommonly unstable etc.
I *LOVE* the Gnome interface, and will be very happy with it when its stable.
Please forgive me if my tone was otherwise than that of a Linux user wanting
feedback from someone who's using a stable version of Gnome :)
As regards KDE, I just wont use it, as I'm a GPL purist (don't beat me,
its a ideological issue).
--
Kind Regards from Terry
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
Free Micro burner: http://jsno.downunder.net.au/terry/
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: Charles Lyttle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: MS at it again
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:11:28 GMT
"Donal K. Fellows" wrote:
>
> Shane Phelps wrote:
> > Patents are issued for ideas, copyright is issued for a particular published
> > expression of an idea.
> > For example, if the Dyson Sphere and derivitive concepts had been patended
> > (which is probably no more unlikely than some of the software patents around)
> > I could still infringe that patent without stealing large chunks of
> > Larry
> > Niven's "Ringworld" and infringing his copyright.
>
> SF is not generally taken as being prior art when it comes to patents...
Ask A.C. Clarke about that one. He was denied a patent on
geosynchronus patents because the SF story he described them in appeared
more than 2 years before he applied for the patent. The first time he
applied, the patent was turned down because there was no means to launch
one. Then the Russian launched Sputnik and he re-applied and his patent
was turned down because his story was "prior art".
>
> Donal.
> --
> Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> make: *** No rule to make target `war'. Stop.
--
Russ Lyttle
"World Domination through Penguin Power"
The Universal Automotive Testset Project at
<http://home.earthlink.net/~lyttlec>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: Windows makes good coasters
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 12 Jun 2001 01:15:50 GMT
On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:01:09 +1200,
Stuart Fox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "Terry Porter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:41:09 +1200,
>> Stuart Fox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >
>> > "Peter Köhlmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >> Stuart Fox wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > Try running XF86Setup on an AST PC with an ATI Mach32 chip on the
>> >> > motherboard. X will not run afterwards, and will not run until you
> edit
>> >> > the config file.
>> >> >
>> >> On what junkyard did you find that stuff?
>> >
>> > Linux advocates told me that Linux with X would run fine on a 486, with
> 16MB
>> > memory so I tried it. It didn't. It ran fine with no X loaded.
>> >
>> > It was an old PC from work. Sad.
>> >
>> >
>> Norti norti Stuart!
>> Please tell the rest of the story?
>>
>> What was your window manager ?
>
> Can't remember, the default that came with BugHat 5.2 (Enlightment at that
> stage - probably a little heavy for the box)
E gad, Enlightenment is sure pretty and cool, but its huge and slow compared
to many other wm's.
If your still interested, try something like xfce, flwm, icewm, blackbox etc.
>
>> how fast was the 486 ?
>
> DX-2 50
Same as I have running my router.
Thats not so slow, and with 32 megs ram would have been tolerable
with X and flwm. I also think a kernel below the 2.2 series as well,
because they are faster.
>
>> Define "fine" ?
>>
> No noticeable lag at the command prompt.
Under X with E and that box, I doubt the lag would have been acceptable.
Of course in the console only it would have been "ok" if not fine.
--
Kind Regards from Terry
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
Free Micro burner: http://jsno.downunder.net.au/terry/
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: Woofbert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: More micro$oft "customer service"
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:23:03 GMT
In article <6vbV6.11847$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Erik Funkenbusch"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I'll add my own hyperlinks, thank you. I don't need or want
> > Microsoft to do it to my web pages -- no matter what color they
> > make them.
>
> To be quite frank, there is little you can do about it.
>
> If I want to create a web browser that replaces all instances of
> macman with moron, I can do so, and there is no legal leg for you to
> stand on.
Sure... But any decent web server can detect what sort of browser the
guest is using.
At the cost of some processing power, you could then dynamically
substitute every word that MS would create a hyperlink out of into a
hyperlink.
One of the tactics that people used against Third Voice (Anybody
remember Third Voice?) was a Javascript that would detect the ThirdVoice
plugin and take you to a different web page. That page would explain the
evils of Third Voice, tell you how to remove it, and ask you to come
back when you're done.
--
Woofbert: Chief Rocket Surgeon, Infernosoft
email <woofbert at infernosoft dot com>
web http://www.infernosoft.com/woofbert
------------------------------
From: Richard Fisher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: double whopper with cheese a threat to heterosexuals
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:26:54 +0100
Some misguided fool wrote:
> They collect and trade Hepatitis,
Aaron, you are brilliant - pure comedy, I applaud you. You were joking,
right?
Hepatitis...it's not a fscking collectible card game!
I sincerely hope you've not had any children yet, and that you never do
- the damage to the gene-pool is unthinkable.
------------------------------
From: Woofbert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: More micro$oft "customer service"
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:25:29 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Dave Martel
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:46:38 GMT, Woofbert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, drsquare
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >> Well, it's not like they're being redirected there from my site, so
> >> I'm not too concerned
> >
> >Unlike some people, I can look at this problem from more points of view
> >than only my own. They may be redirected from my customers' web sites,
> >so I am concerned.
>
> Personally I think this is all much ado about nothing,
I'm amazed at how staunchly you defend nothing.
>but just to
> show I'm a nice guy here's a little more fuel for the discussion:
> <http://www.newsbytes.com/news/01/166676.html>
>
> Microsoft 'Smart Tags' Could Violate Law - Attorney
>
> "Technology embedded in the upcoming version of Microsoft's Internet
> Explorer (IE) browser could run afoul of the law by placing
> unauthorized links on privately owned Web sites, an intellectual
> property attorney said today. "
>
> "Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) attorney Robin Gross said today
> that the Microsoft "Smart Tag" technology could violate both copyright
> law and federal rules prohibiting deceptive and unfair business
> practices. "
Oh, thank you, EFF! That's the position I had on Third Voice. I wrote
them about it a couple of years ago, and their position was that it
increases people's ability to communicate. I don't send them money any
more.
> <snip>
>
> "But Gross said that by embedding Smart Tags on Web sites without the
> express permission of the site owners, Microsoft could be accused of
> creating "derivative works," that is, unauthorized, edited copies of
> the Web site content that users are attempting to visit."
>
> "'That makes it a new work (and) you are not allowed to do that under
> copyright law,' Gross said. While Gross said she would need to see the
> Smart Tags in action to determine whether they cross the "derivative
> work" threshold, she warned that Microsoft is, at the very least,
> dancing dangerously close to the line.
>
> "And even if the Smart Tags don't violate copyright law, Gross said,
> they could put Microsoft on the wrong side of regulations preventing
> deceptive trade practices."
>
> <snip>
Well, there you go. I guess itwas something after all.
--
Woofbert: Chief Rocket Surgeon, Infernosoft
email <woofbert at infernosoft dot com>
web http://www.infernosoft.com/woofbert
------------------------------
From: Larry Elmore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.arch,misc.invest.stocks
Subject: Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:35:07 GMT
"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>
> Said Larry Elmore in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sun, 03 Jun 2001 05:33:52
> [...]
> >If nobody drove standard anymore, what difference would it make?
>
> You mean if nobody wanted to drive standard, don't you? After all, you
> can't wait until after it is unavailable and then say it was made
> unavailable because nobody does it. Nobody can do it once it is
> unavailable. Get it?
No, I meant exactly what I wrote -- a sentence should not be taken out
of context and then lambasted for not making sense without the context.
> >As long
> >as enough people drive standard to make it worth their while, they
> >_will_ make cars with manual transmissions, though if demands drops off
> >enough, they will likely cost more than an automatic simply due to
> >economies of scale.
>
> The theory of supply and demand doesn't have a lot to do with economies
> of scale.
According to _what_ theory of economics?
> Manual transmissions might get more expensive, but, no, they
> will be available as long as it is profitable to build them.
That is EXACTLY what I wrote above. Your reading comprehension leaves a
lot to be desired.
> This
> illustrates just what is wrong with monopolies that make them illegal.
> With a monopoly, this is no longer the case. It isn't whether they can
> sell it profitably that determines if it is "worth their while", but
> whether it maintains the monopoly.
This is utter nonsense.
> Very inefficient from the consumer's
> standpoint; results in shoddy goods at outrageous prices, prevents all
> innovation and makes it very inconvenient to deal with the market, even
> if you 'go along' with the monopoly.
I guess that's why there's no innovation in PC OS's, huh? I guess I was
just imagining writing this on a Debian Linux system. My Hurd partition
doesn't exist, either, nor does my friend's usage of BeOS, my dentist's
office' use of OS/2. Linux apparently isn't (slowly) gaining market
share, after all, I guess. M$ _is_ dominant, but they're facing a real
backlash and I predict the _market_ will have forced them to mend their
ways _long_ before the idiotic anti-trust case winds its way through
appeals. If M$ was so powerful, how could Linux have gained the
marketshare it has? And I would bet most Linux users today have _paid_
for Linux, and probably not a great deal less than they paid for
Windows. Quite possibly more if they got Windows because it came on
their machine.
> >> Just food for thought.
> >
> >Good thing I'm already on a diabetic diet. :)
>
> You're proud of your inability to think about facts that contradict your
> rather silly opinions, and you think it is *funny*? You are warped,
> dude.
No, I think you are so warped by your hatred of M$ that you can't think
objectively about the subject. I do -- and I choose not to use M$!!!
There's nothing funny about M$, but with anti-trust law the cure is
worse than the disease! You want to read a truly silly opinion, read the
finding of fact that idiotic judge wrote against M$ -- it's a travesty
of logic and reason. M$ itself was idiotic (when it wasn't rabid) in its
own defense, but that doesn't excuse the bench from having to think,
too!
> T. Max Devlin
> *** The best way to convince another is
> to state your case moderately and
> accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
You're certainly failing your sigline, then.
Larry
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff?
Reply-To: bobh = haucks dot org
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:44:05 GMT
On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 00:57:15 -0600, Robert Morelli
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> There was an opinion piece on OS opinion a few months ago about
> why so few Linux developers use C++ rather than C. From the
I think the biggest reason is that there hasn't been much portability
between Unix C++ compilers, and GCC was behind the times. Those things
are going away, but you still have issues of binary compatibility
between libraries compiled with different compilers or even different
versions of the same compiler.
> responses, it was clear that a lot of Linux developers haven't
> made an informed judgement about this. They just think C++
> is "complicated" because they aren't willing to tax their lazy
> brains enough to learn about object oriented programming, one of
> the standard concepts in computer programming.
No, they think C++ is complicated because it is. There's a _lot_ more
in there than just OO. C++ has enough concepts in it to do about three
regular languages. I use Python's OO features just fine, but still
don't care for C++ all that much (although I do use it).
Qt/KDE seem to use a fairly restricted subset of C++, BTW. Mostly only
the OO features. "C with classes" if you will. That seems to be the
safest thing to do as far as what compilers are out in the field.
> This is probably part of the reason GNOME is progressing so slowly
> despite having a rather large community of developers.
Yes, implementing an OO design in a non-OO language is working harder
than you need to. Been there, done that.
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| To Whom You Are Speaking
-| http://www.haucks.org/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Mail Order Brides? Check this place out!
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 01:50:40 GMT
http://www.planet-love.com/wwwboard/russian/
Has everything you need to know about "buying" the perfect Russian wife.
These men are the hardcore losers and if you read some of the messages you'll begin to
see why.
Makes for very funny reading!
Dr.
------------------------------
From: B. P. Uecker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:53:53 -0500
Bob Hauck wrote in <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>On Sat, 09 Jun 2001 02:38:57 GMT, Les Mikesell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> My latest disaster with NT was a box set up as an ftp
>> server by someone who follows the updates and patches
>> pretty closely but it still ended up with a directory named
>> 'PRN' last weekend that couldn't be removed and a bunch
>> of hidden files under it that half the world was downloading,
>> consuming most of our internet bandwidth. Security?
>
>You know, I had that happen to me years ago on a Unix box. I quickly
>figured out how to make "write only" upload directories so people could
>still send me stuff but the kiddies wouldn't be able to use the machine
>as a drop box (anonymous could upload but couldn't see or read the
>files he uploaded).
>
>When it happened to our NT server at the office just a couple of months
>ago, I explained the concept to our NT admin. She finally ended up
>just shutting down the ftp server altogether, saying that she couldn't
>find a way to make it work securely.
>
>I'm thinking that there has got to be a way to do this with NT, what
>with ACL's and all. Any pointers from the Winvocates?
Fire her and hire someone who knows how to administer NT. The
solution is preposterously easy. I've done it myself dozens of times.
Seriously. Your NT admin is a moron. Making write-only directories
is TRIVIAL. In fact I'm astonished you couldn't figure out how to do
it yourself.
------------------------------
From: "Paolo Ciambotti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsft IE6 smart tags
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:06:52 -0700
In article <wnSU6.759$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Norman D. Megill"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Wonderful. We get 5 MS-controlled info and opinion pages about the
> company, surrounding a link to the company itself in the middle.
>
> It will be interesting to see what links MS ends up putting on a page
> about Linux. Perhaps links to Mundie's speech about GPL being viral or
> to Balmer's speech calling Linux "a cancer"?
I read a discussion elsewhere today that questioned whether or not this
might constitute copyright infringement. For instance, if I create a web
page with specific links to resources that I select, and MSIE displays my
copyrighted work in a manner that overrides my original intention, then
would that be considered a deriviative work for which MSFT would be in
violation of copyright?
I'd be more than happy to sublicense my webpage to MSFT for, let's say a
fair figure of fifty million quid a smartlink. And MSFT are really
bullish on intellectual property rights now, so I think they'd
understand.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.arch,misc.invest.stocks
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Andrew Reilly)
Subject: Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:04:58 GMT
On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:24:22 -0700, Maynard Handley wrote:
> I've been reading the followup to my message in bizarre amazement.
Your amazement seems bizzare to me. :-)
> Did no-one actually understand my point?
> The issue is NOT "how do I back up the system and then restore it to the
> same or an equivalent system"?
No?
> The issue is, imagine I have a system that I've used for 4 years. It has
> on it maybe two hundred app, perhaps twenty of them commercial, the rest
> free/shareware. The apps have installed shared libs in various places,
> prefs in various places, help files and dictionaries and file translator
> plugins in various places. In addition various pieces of hardware (NTSC
> capture card eg) have installed their crud in various places.
So your world is more broken than my world. Your solution will
probably be more complicated. My answer was from personal
experience, and is something that I've been doing every couple
of years, continuously, for over 10 years. Works for me.
> I want to take this whole mess and have my new, four years later computer
> with substantially different internals (no serial, ADB, SCSI, but new USB
> and 1394) just work the same way.
Your applications shouldn't care what specific hardware
interfaces you have in your box: that's what an operating
system is for. If your operating system is sufficiently
backwards-compatible (mine's carried most of the same interfaces
around for about 20 years) then your applications will continue
to run on the new system.
> And the Linux crowd don't seem to have anything useful to ad either beyond
> "Windows sux". I've not read anything that indicates the problem is better
> on Linux. I could believe that some parts of the problems are
> easier---presumably PER USER prefs files are limited in how far they can
> go. But a linux box used as a personal box---what about all the apps? What
> about drivers installed after the OS? What about OS-wide prefs that you
> set?
Well, it does :-) and in this particular respect, a great deal
more than other alternatives.
Per user pref files tend to be unlimited. I can't think of a
single application that I use that is constrained by system-wide
preferences. My per-user preferences define my environment.
How else could a multi-user system operate?
What about the apps? For the most part they're available in
source, and can be compiled or installed from scratch with
essentially no effort or cost. For the ones that aren't
available that way, the old versions will still work unless I've
changed to a machine with a different processor architecture.
In that case I have to get a replacement or I'm short of luck.
How else could the applications behave? Even Windows is
famously backwards-compatible for applications.
Drivers and system-wide configuration are an issue of bringing
the new machine up in the first place, and are essentially
orthogonal to the issue of moving your user environment around
with you.
So what _was_ the question?
--
Andrew
------------------------------
From: "Goddess" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:56:16 -0700
"Brock Hannibal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:3b24cf46$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Goddess" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
> <9g1geb$9ik$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> >
> >"Brock Hannibal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:3b2435b3$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
> >> <9g16ij$onq$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> "Brock Hannibal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >>> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >>>> "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
> >>>> <9fvu1k$skg$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >>>>
> >>>>>> Wouldn't that depend on what exactly you were teaching them
> >>>>>> about it? While I don't shield my son from the fact that
> >>>>>> homosexuality exists I don't think I want to teach him that
> >>>>>> it's desirable or glamorous. I must admit the homosexual
> >>>>>> lifestyle and sexual behaviors are not something that I want
> >>>>>> my male child aspiring to. There, afterall, are many
> >>>>>> consequences of that choice that might not include the kinds
> >>>>>> of outcomes I want for my son. I think at 10 years old as
> >>>>>> his gender related sexuality is just emerging, I don't want
> >>>>>> people preaching the benefits of homosexuality to him. Just
> >>>>>> as I prefer not to allow people to preach their religions to
> >>>>>> him. I'll handle teaching him about love, life and religion,
> >>>>>> the schools can handle teaching him reading, writing and
> >>>>>> arithmetic, thank you very much.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Lets say, in theory, your son has a pretty normal (well, as
> >>>>> normal as you can be) hetrosexual up bringing, and learns to
> >>>>> accept/tolerate people with different sexual preferences, and
> >>>>> you and your son have an open father-son relationship in
> >>>>> which your son can talk to about anything. However,
> >>>>> hypothetically, at the age of, say, 17, he comes to you and
> >>>>> says, "dad, I'm gay". What would your response be?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Matthew Gardiner
> >>>>
> >>>> In all truthfulness I can't say I would be happy about it. I'm
> >>>> not sure how I would respond, exactly. I wouldn't disinherit
> >>>> him or anything like that. I would try to make sure he really
> >>>> knew what all the consequences of his choice would be. That's
> >>>> about the best I can do in this hypothetical situation.
> >>>>
> >>>> None of that has anything to do with the schools teaching
> >>>> about homosexuality. It's not their role, in my opinion.
> >>>
> >>> Personally, if I had a son,
> >>
> >> So, you don't have a son, then.
> >
> >I have a son, two of them in fact.
> >
> >>> and he came to me and said he was gay,
> >>> I would neither be disappointed or proud. I would be happy
> >>> that he was able to "come out" as so to speak, and that he was
> >>> willing to talk about any issues he may have. I would give him
> >>> the same advice as as I would give a hetrosexual son, be
> >>> careful, use contraception, remember that if you need support,
> >>> that I (as a father) will always be there.
> >>
> >> Woulda, shoulda, coulda! You don't have a son. You don't know
> >> what it feels like to love a son. You don't know how you would
> >> react.
> >
> >I have two sons. I do know how it feels to love a son and it has
> >nothing to do with his sexual orientation.
> >
> >> That's the bottom line. Basically you're full of hot air,
> >> signifying nothing.
> >
> >No, you are. Thanks for your comments.
> >
> >Marg
>
> Listen, if you can make a case as to why a homosexual lifestyle will
> be somehow better for your boys then I'm willing to listen,
Since no one said that, you would be jumping to conclusions. Better? Not,
but no worse than being a heterosexual, IMO.
but it's
> obvious that being gay has many problems associated with it.
So does being a het have many problems associated with it.
Whether
> that's good or should be, is a different debate. The pragmatic view
> of it is that it's a problem, socially, career-wise, and health-wise.
No more so than any other.
> If you're too dumb to realize that then maybe you should do a little
> research before you say being gay is good and wonderful
It is what it is, no more, no less.
and that you
> would be filled with happy, happy, joy, joy to have your sons'
> declare an affinity for the gay lifestyle.
You are once again jumping to conclusions. I wouldn't jump for joy any more
than I would jump for joy at them being het. Whatever they are is what they
are and I accept it.
Now move along, before you
> get laughed off of usenet.
Hasn't happened yet but you're welcome to try.
Marg
> --
> Brock
>
> "Put a $20 gold piece on my watch chain so the boys'll know I died
> standin' pat"
------------------------------
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You can send mail to the entire list by posting to comp.os.linux.advocacy.
Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
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