Linux-Advocacy Digest #159, Volume #35 Tue, 12 Jun 01 13:13:04 EDT
Contents:
Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux starts getting
good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!) (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Why Linux Is no threat to Windows domination of the desktop ("Laura M. Hagan")
Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff? ("Edward Rosten")
Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff? ("Edward Rosten")
Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff? ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals ("jet")
Re: Redhat video problems. ("Mart van de Wege")
Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals ("jet")
Re: IBM Goes Gay ("Edward Rosten")
Linux penetration MUCH lower than previously claimed ("Jon Johansan")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux starts
getting good, Microsoft buries it in the dust!)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:12:01 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, GreyCloud
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:58:43 -0700
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>>
>> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, drsquare
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote
>> on Sun, 10 Jun 2001 00:15:49 +0100
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>> >On Sun, 10 Jun 2001 03:39:00 +0800, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
>> > ("Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
>> >
>> >>"Nick Condon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >
>> >>> Why? It's just where you born. It's not like you achieved anything. Your
>> >>> parents fucked, and out you popped. It could have been anywhere. So just
>> >>> keep that image in mind, next time you feel patriotic, just visualise your
>> >>> father hunched over your mother. Which is all it comes down to, really.
>> >>
>> >>Well, I'm proud to be American.
>> >
>> >What is their to be proud of.
>>
>> Let me count the ways. Some of these are of course ancient, but...
>>
>> [1] Tamed the West -- an internal matter, to be sure, but quite
>> an accomplishment given the primitive technology at the time.
>> [2] Helped defeat the Nazis *and* the Japanese, more or less simultaneously.
>> [3] One of the highest GDP/capita in the world.
>> [4] First man on the moon.
>>
>> These are the ones that come immediately to mind. There were of course
>> some lowlights as well:
>>
>> [A] Segregation/slavery of blacks. This continued until well into
>> the 70's, even though slavery was officially abolished more than
>> a century earlier. It's not clear that it's ended even now.
>> [B] Isolated incidents such as MOVE, Waco, and the Texas Fremen.
>> These indicate (perceived?) injustice, although it's not clear
>> how much or by whom.
>> [C] Native American massacre during the formative years (this is
>> the flip side of [1], above). We may never know the true extent
>> of the horror.
>> [D] The biggest user (dare I say waster?) of energy in the world.
>> 6% of the population consumes half of the energy. We're getting
>> better, and our technology may well pull our collective rears
>> out of the fire, but it's not something to be proud of.
>> We also backed out of the Kyoto accord. While there may have been
>> good reasons to do so (it's not clear to me personally), it's
>> not going to help our reputation any.
>>
>> Again, there may be some obvious ones I'm missing.
>
>Let us not forget Nikolai Tesla. Without his advanced thinking we
>wouldn't have TV, Radio, solenoids, AC power, etc. He got out of Europe
>from the "Impossible, can't be done" crowd. He came to America where he
>could freely invent and test. And I have to agree with Tesla about
>Edison too.... a screwdriver mechanic.
Ah, yes. Unfortunately for Tesla, he became rather crazy in his
later years; but I'd forgotten about him.
I'd say that one's rather obvious. :-) As for Edison -- I can't say.
I'm not familiar with their interactions. I was always under the
impression that Edison tried a large number of materials before
settling on carbon fiber for his inaugural light bulb. :-)
(Tungsten came somewhat later.)
(Side note: Believe it or not, there's at least one bulb out there
that has been burning for 100 years.)
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
EAC code #191 43d:11h:15m actually running Linux.
Linux. The choice of a GNU generation.
------------------------------
From: "Laura M. Hagan" <doesn'[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why Linux Is no threat to Windows domination of the desktop
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:06:31 -0700
Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Laura M. Hagan" wrote:
> >
> > Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > "Laura M. Hagan" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > >
> > > > > There are three types of homosexuals:
> > > > >
> > > > > a) those who have AIDS
> > > > > b) those who will get AIDS
> > > > > c) those who will get die before they get a chance to get AIDS.
> > > >
> > > > d) Lesbians, who have a lower chance of getting AIDS than
> > > > do either male or female heterosexuals.
> > > > Idiot.
> > >
> > > What's your pre-occupation with lesbos?
> >
> > Why do you want to pretend they don't exist?
>
>
> They aren't germane to the subject at hand.
Huhwhat? You were talking about homosexuals. Let
me say this slowly, so you'll be sure to keep up:
Lesbians
are
homosexual.
You were also talking about sexual practices that spread
disease, and your argument against homosexuality is that it
encompasses sexual practices that spread disease. I'll say
this slowly too:
Heteros
spread
more
disease
than
lesbians.
Ergo and therefore, your statement that homosexuality is
more of a disease-spreader than heterosexuality
is
pure
bullshit.
>
>
>
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> DNRC Minister of all I survey
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> L: This seems to have reduced my spam. Maybe if everyone does it we
> can defeat the email search bots. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> K: Truth in advertising:
> Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
> Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
> Special Interest Sierra Club,
> Anarchist Members of the ACLU
> Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
> The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
> Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
>
>
> J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>
> I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> G: Knackos...you're a retard.
>
>
> F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> her behavior improves.
>
> D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (C) above.
>
> C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
> B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff?
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:39:06 +0100
>> > Well, spend you time making silly mistakes and tracking down your
>> > allocation, and I'll be programming a System that just "works".
>> > Choice is yours. I know which route I would use unless the "task"
>> > calls for something where it is not appropriate.
>>
>> I've never really had a problem with allocation/deallocation, but I
>> learnt assembly before I lernt C, so...
>
> Hmmmmm. Must be just me then.
Mabey none of my projects have been big enough.
>> Besides, you seem to be trashing my personal choice based on nothing
>> more than your personal choice. Use what works for you. I've never got
>> on really well with perl or java, but that could be something to do
>> with the kind of program I write.
>
> To be specific I am trashing your compliance with the "These are kiddy
> languages for want-to-be programmers who know nothing about computers"
I didn't agree with everything he said. I did point out that HLLs
definitely have a place. I then went on to say that my personal choice
wasn't to use them much.
> line of things. Personally I hate Perl and think it is the spawn of
> Satan
LOL! I am an ardent AWK fan.
> - but I would not venture to brand Perl programmers as unable to be
> software engineers as mlm has done with complete disregard to sense,
> good reason and respect for fellow professionals.
I have a slight irrational disrespect for BASIC programmers, but I try
not to let it show.
> As you may have noticed in my other posts my personal choice depends on
> the project : C or Java. I may venture into C++ when I have the time to
> learn it properly (not just it's syntactic sugar). My personal choice
> will be made for pragmatic reasons and technical reasons - not because
> of some silly language war of words.
I have been meaning to learn Java, but I haven't got around to it. I'm
glad I took the time to learn AWK, since it has saved me a huga amount of
time. I'm sure I'll get around to it Real Soon Now (tm) but I want to
play around with some hardware instead this summer.
-Ed
--
(You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.) (u98ejr)(@)(ecs.ox)(.ac.uk)
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------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff?
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:41:16 +0100
>> You also may have noticed that C is not the only langauge I ever
>> program in. (Hint look at my sig).
>
> EEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeuuuuuuwwwwww. You are one sick bunny sometimes Ed :)
:)
I like postscript. If you're good at picking up new computer languages,
I'd highly reccmend you to try your hand at postscript. it is a *huge*
language, but you don't need to know much to make good use of it.
-Ed
> [postscript]
>> /d{def}def/f{/Times-Roman findfont s scalefont
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--
(You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.) (u98ejr)(@)(ecs.ox)(.ac.uk)
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------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What language are use to program Linux stuff?
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:43:20 +0100
>> Well, guess what, genuis, if I write a program in the lovely portable
>> perl, an old system with an old version on it won't run the program.
>> guess perl must be really crap then.
>>
>> Basically, what I'm saying is that your point of view here is a bit on
>> the biased side.
>
> I can't comment on Perl as I think it is deeply evil so my comments may
> be irrational.
Which text processing language do you use?
If you think perl is evil, you should have seen some of the 2 teir sed
programs I learnt before I learnt AWK.
>> Just don't forget that no code is completely protable, whatever
>> language you write it in, there will be some bozo with an old/broken
>> compiler/interpreter/whatever.
>
> I agree. But it's all about reducing the effort needed to get it to work
> and work well.
Yep, true. AFAICT there is no perfect or even great solution as yet.
-Ed
--
(You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.) (u98ejr)(@)(ecs.ox)(.ac.uk)
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------------------------------
From: "jet" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:46:10 -0700
Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Ed Cogburn wrote:
> >
> > Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > which DEADLY, INCURABLE diseases are spread by heterosexual contact?
> >
> > Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome.
>
> Not for men.
>
You keep telling yourself that, please, keep telling yourself that!
>
> >
> > Aaron, you ignorant and sad excuse for a human being, I told you before
> > when you were on one of your rants that the population of Zimbabwe is
> > being decimated by AIDS, as well as other areas in Africa, and the
> > transmission is exclusively HETEROSEXUAL. They have orphanages full of
> > orphans who have lost their parents to AIDS, and many of them have
> > gotten AIDS too, from their mother.
>
> And this is pertinent to North America how, exactly?
There is this new invention called the "air plane", it can get an infected
person from Africa to North America in under 24 hours.
As you keep claiming AIDS is not a problem for you, why do you care about
it? (Obviously you have no concern for others.)
J
------------------------------
From: "Mart van de Wege" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Redhat video problems.
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:45:05 +0200
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Terry Porter"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:24:18 GMT, flatfish+++ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> On 11 Jun 2001 07:51:01 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>Tried that link yet I posted for you this week?
>>>>>
>>>>>Mart
>>>>
>>>> Yes but it didn't work.
>>
>> The Link worked fine.
>> The suggestions AT the link didn't work.
>>
>>
>>>On behalf of Mart, 'thanks for not bothering to give any feedback'.
>>
>> I rather doubt he would want "YOU" speaking for him, and at least he
>> offers advice.
>
> Maybe, but it's no different to you telling us what computer users
> 'want' on a daily basis, so take it as it comes like a ... fish.
>
<snip>
Well, actually it was meant as sarcasm. Sorry it didn't come out that
way, but I still doubt that flatty has tried those links, as most people
posting reports on www.linux-laptops.net seem to get the TP 765something
working just fine.
Flatty's story just smells a little, well, *fishy* to me.
Mart
--
Playing for the high one, dancing with the devil,
Going with the flow, it's all the same to me,
Seven or Eleven, snake eyes watching you,
Double up or quit, double stake or split, The Ace Of Spades
------------------------------
From: "jet" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why homosexuals are no threat to heterosexuals
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:47:42 -0700
Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Burkhard Wölfel wrote:
> >
> > Ed Cogburn wrote:
> > >
> > > Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
> > > [snip]
> > > Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome.
> > >
> > > Aaron, you ignorant and sad excuse for a human being, I told you
before
> > > when you were on one of your rants that the population of Zimbabwe is
> > > being decimated by AIDS, as well as other areas in Africa, and the
> > > transmission is exclusively HETEROSEXUAL. They have orphanages full
of
> > > orphans who have lost their parents to AIDS, and many of them have
> > > gotten AIDS too, from their mother.
> > >
> > > Despite your stupid statements, the truth is still there for anyone to
> > > see, just go to Zimbabwe in Africa or Thailand in Asia or other areas
in
> > > both regions, and you will find AIDS spreading among HETEROSEXUAL
> > > POPULATIONS.
> >
> > Most important fact is that _we_ are all concerned, AIDS is an
> > intercultural disease. No matter how high the risk really is, sometimes
> > discussions like this serve only to forget that it's _my_ health that is
> > in danger.
> > Talking about minorities is easy if you don't belong to them: whatever
> > taboo I might get to, it's not my life.
> > BTW, a good way to get those discussions (face to face, esp. in groups)
> > back to earth is talking about contraception and sexuality of the people
> > involved: Now the taboo is ours, the problem is ours and we are talking
> > about everyday life, not as seen on TV or read in papers written to fit
> > into everyone's lunch break.
> >
> > Think about this:
> > When my girl and I decided to leave condoms outta bed, I
proposed to
> > get us both tested. She was a bit frightened at first, thought that
> > there was only danger where there's a test, but it was easy to convince
> > her: How could she know if I lied to her or not? What if I knew I had
> > AIDS and didn't tell her? (Yeah, excellent rhetoric device for
> > positively predisposed relationships: just twist it around the evil way.
> > Works.)
> > She called her gynaecologist and was told to come next day. When
she
> > arrived, there already was rumors and rants like "uuh, you're the one
> > with the <look left, look right> AIDS test <g> ". Imagine the faces of
> > the other patients waiting.
> > The doctor was really cool: He told her to have the test made
> > anonymously at the "Gesundheitsamt", a public health care office,
> > because her health insurance record would block her entry into public
> > service.
> > Once again: This doctor said, Lady, don't let your future employer (the
> > Fed. Rep. of Germany) know that you had yourself tested or they won't
> > employ you. And this guy even knew examples!
> > And all we wanted to do is live our relationship in a responsible way.
> >
> > People, this is so pervert, I couldn't believe it.
> > And the pervertion is the same as with Mr. "baise-cule" Kulekiss: take a
> > strong sexual taboo, fear of death and painful disease and start to
> > gossip. The greater the distance (taboo) the easier assumptions and
> > guesses become "truth". The whole thing works quite fine, as long as it
> > is not disturbed by truth, which would mostly be a catastrophe in these
> > cases.
>
> Well, this may come as a surprise to you, but the US Army tests EVERY
> soldier for AIDS every 6-12 months.
Why? You keep claiming it's not a problem for men.
J
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: IBM Goes Gay
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:47:38 +0100
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "The Ghost
In The Machine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Matthew Gardiner
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote
> on Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:28:02 +1200
> <9g3k91$vsa$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>> > Why not talk about this? We've already established that Windows is
>>> > superior to Linux in every regard, right?
>>>
>>> LOL!
>>>
>>> And whilst we're off topic, why not dip in to some
>>> racism/nationalism/patriotism debates?
>>>
>>> -Ed
>>
>>I'd also like to go into a debate on whether colourful computers run
>>faster than beige ones. That should get the Mac crowd going.
>
> Could we throw in some nostalgia for the Amiga, Atari, and other such
> computers as well? :-)
I have recently been singing the praises of BBC Basic. Will that do?
-Ed
--
(You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.) (u98ejr)(@)(ecs.ox)(.ac.uk)
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------------------------------
From: "Jon Johansan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Linux penetration MUCH lower than previously claimed
Date: 12 Jun 2001 11:48:13 -0500
http://www.wininformant.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=21403
or
http://www.zdnet.com/eweek/stories/general/0,11011,2772060,00.html
But they both say the same thing:
Gartner Dataquest has reported that 8.6 percent of server shipments in the
U.S. during the third quarter of 2000 were Linux-based and 97% of those were
Red Hat. Another interesting finding was that when so-called "white box," or
non-branded, server purchases were excluded and only branded server
purchases considered, Linux's share of the market fell to just 6 percent in
the third quarter of 2000.
IDC claims a higher figure in previous reports, 27%. But IDC considers ANY
PC which has Linux installed on it a "Server Environment." Obviously that
stretches the definition a bit.
Yes, I know the study was partially sponsored by MS (someone has to pay for
these things) so please don't fire off stupid replies implying that MS
purposely contaminated it's own results by 'buying the study' - that's just
preposterous. Consider when car companies pay someone like JD Powers to
guage customer satisfaction - the company that paid for the survey does NOT
always come out on top and that's why people trust JD Powers. Same for both
IDC and Gartner. They are paid by _someone_ to find something out. If the
results don't go your way then, sure, it's ok for you to not publish them
(Ford pays JD Powers to find out if people like the Explorer and it turns
out they don't - no need to buy Superbowl time to advertise that - but if
they did like it, of course you advertise it - it's normal and is done all
the time). So, ahead of time, ANYONE who says "MS paid for it therefore they
said whatever MS told them to" is automatically defined as an idiot and
mindless so don't fall into that hole oK?
Further Quote: [Donn] Miller [of MS] told eWEEK that Microsoft had helped
sponsor the study to see exactly who was using Linux, what the server
deployments were and what operating system was running on it.
"There has been a lot of hype around Linux over the past year, and we wanted
to try and find out the real story on its adoption," he said. "While I admit
there has been interest in Linux, this by no means accounts for one out of
every four new servers sold. That is simply ridiculous."
The study results prove that Linux on the server side is still "just a niche
play," Miller added. It's unrealistic to look at sales numbers and believe
that all of these are being deployed. While many users have bought Linux to
try it out, a large number of those copies bought, downloaded and acquired
were tested and then never actually used, he said.
"Many of our customers have tested it, but found that it falls short of what
is required for a business server platform," Miller said. "Windows has good
penetration on the server side, but the misstated Linux market share figures
unfairly present the actual position of Novell and others rather than us."
------------------------------
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