Linux-Misc Digest #76, Volume #26 Thu, 19 Oct 00 00:13:04 EDT
Contents:
strange behavior in my cron job ("Frank Cheng")
Re: Java Servlets on Redhat 7.0 (Robert Lynch)
Re: Downloading xchat (David Efflandt)
Re: help to delete file(hosts.allow,hosts.deny ) ("John Lampe")
Re: environment variables in xterm (David Efflandt)
IceWM question (jhecker)
Only user "root" and "mysql" can connect to mysql? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Mandrake Kernel Patch help (David Efflandt)
Re: mytime script (David Efflandt)
Re: IceWM question ("pl")
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (Andrew J. Perrin)
Re: RedHat 6.2 Network Install? (Akira Yamanita)
Re: Using RDEV (David Efflandt)
Re: Wanna lose warranty and pay $200 because my laptop has Linux? (David Efflandt)
Locked inbound telnet under RH7 ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: HACKED ? All logins fail ("Michael Westerman")
Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7 (Hal Burgiss)
Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7 (Robert Lynch)
Re: startx crashes ("Michael Westerman")
Re: RedHat 6.2 Network Install? (Monte Milanuk)
Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7 (Robert Lynch)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (Darin Johnson)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Frank Cheng" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: strange behavior in my cron job
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:11:11 GMT
I just met a strange problem in cron job. I use PIII650,128MB RAM, Redhat6.2
installed.
I have an entry in cron job: 30 7 * * 1-5 /etc/ppp/ppp-on; this will connect
to my isp every morning. But it failed. Looking at the log file, I only get
the message saying "script failed". Actually, when I manually run the script
at command line as root "# /etc/ppp/ppp-on" and it works. And I notice that
in the log it also state that script started.
Is there any difference when I run in command line and put it in the cron
job? I have another entry "0 17 * * 1-5 /etc/ppp/ppp-off" in cron job and it
works both in command line and cron job.
I appreciate any suggestion.
Frank
------------------------------
From: Robert Lynch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Java Servlets on Redhat 7.0
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 17:24:31 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Java Servlets on Redhat 7.0
>
> Does anyone have it working
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
Using tomcat 3.1, servlets work flawlessly on RH 7.0.
HTH. Bob L.
--
Robert Lynch-Berkeley CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Subject: Re: Downloading xchat
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:45:17 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Mon, 16 Oct 2000, Derrick King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I would like to get hold of XCHAT, which I believe is a good IRC program. I
>have found some references to it via various seach engines, but...
>
>1. There are several different packages (source and binaries, different
>versions of Linux), how do I know which one to doanload. I am running
>Mandrake V 7.1.
>
>2. Once downloaded, how do I install it!
Isn't it on your CD or already installed (it was on my Mandrake 7.0)? If
using KDE check under Gnome and X Apps, Internet. I just started using
IRC a couple of days ago and I was able to figure it out.
I just seemed to have one peculiar problem that my ISP is not able to
route to irc.core.com (traceroute craps out). But I can get there from a
core.com ppp dialup, and others are on from all over. Strange.
Some of the default listed servers are dead, but any other ones I tried
from current web lists work.
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: "John Lampe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.security
Subject: Re: help to delete file(hosts.allow,hosts.deny )
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:50:33 GMT
# chattr -i filename
might be what you're looking for.
John Lampe
"lckun" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Hi all,
>
> I have problem to delete files hosts.allow hosts.deny in /etc.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Subject: Re: environment variables in xterm
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:56:10 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Mon, 16 Oct 2000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I am running RH6.2, using gnome. Although I set certain environment
>variables in the user's profile files, when I open a new xterm for the
>same user,they do not transfer. How do I set enviromental variables
>(like EDITOR) to automatically apply when I open a new xterm.
You might try putting such settings in $HOME/.bashrc since opening an
xterm is not really logging on, so $HOME/.bash_profile is not run. I
noticed that when I put a colored prompt in .bash_profile, it does not
show up in an xterm unless I 'su -' to another user using their
environment.
Also make sure that you export any variables that you set. The simplest
way is to export it as you set it is using bash:
export EDITOR="whatever with any switches"
Of course other shells might use other files or methods.
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: jhecker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: IceWM question
Date: 18 Oct 2000 21:05:13 -0400
Hi all,
I am trying to find how to add additional workspaces in Icewm. Checked
the config file, and the ice config tool, but didn't see it. Does anyone
know how?
TIA -
Regards,
jh
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Only user "root" and "mysql" can connect to mysql?
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:58:05 GMT
Only user "root" and "mysql" can connect to mysql?
If I try to tryed under my id I get
ERROR 2002: Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket
'/var/lib/mysql/mysql.sock' (111)
If you know how to fix this please email me at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Subject: Re: Mandrake Kernel Patch help
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 01:19:45 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Tue, 17 Oct 2000, A.Bev <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Hello people,
>
>Ok i'm using Mandrake 7.1 wich has kernel 2.2.15 pathed by mandrake. I
>want to install 2.2.17 in order to build my own in order to be 100% for
>my maschine. But how can i also add the patches added by mandrake. I
>searched a bit (since it should be open source) but can't find any
>Mandrake specific patch.
I guess the question is, what patches do you need? I upgraded Mandrake
7.0 to genaric kernel 2.2.16 earlier on my laptop and 2.2.17 on my desktop
now and did not need any patches. Most source patches for special
features would be for generic kernels anyway. My laptop uses commercial
sound drivers anyway and I just made sure that my desktop had modules for
my nic and soundcard (skipped modules I never use anyway).
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Subject: Re: mytime script
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 01:31:08 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Tue, 17 Oct 2000 18:10:21 -0000, killroy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>Hi there!!
>
>Is there a software(and its site) that checks the time of a dial-up user.
>We are using XTACACSD ij our server.
I don't have a clue what that is. But the typical Unix way to set your
system clock is with ntpdate from the xntp package (network time
protocol). If it is not on your Linux CD it is in normal Unix mirrors
rather than Linux sources. But it is easy to compile in Linux. The html
docs link to a list of time servers.
ntpdate updates your system clock from internet time servers and you can
then update your CMOS clock with something like 'setclock' in RedHat,
possibly 'clock -w' in Slackware(?), or something like hwclock in other
distros.
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: "pl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: IceWM question
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:28:32 GMT
> Hi all,
>
> I am trying to find how to add additional workspaces in Icewm. Checked the
> config file, and the ice config tool, but didn't see it. Does anyone know
> how?
>
> TIA -
>
> Regards, jh
Which config tool? icepref lets you edit them from the "Workspaces" tab.
You can also edit the ~/.icewm/preferences file. The following line sets up my
2 workspaces, simply called "1" and "2"
WorkspaceNames="1","2"
Just a comma-delimited list of names in double quotes. Add another name--get
another workspace.
HTH...
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Andrew J. Perrin)
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: 18 Oct 2000 22:15:07 -0400
Robert Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Andrew J. Perrin),
> In a message on 17 Oct 2000 19:14:06 -0400, wrote :
>
> AJP> Robert Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> AJP>
> AJP> > Roberto Teixeira <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> AJP> > In a message on 16 Oct 2000 17:15:08 -0400, wrote :
> AJP> >
> AJP> > RT> >>>>> "Jan" == Jan Schaumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> AJP> > RT>
> AJP> > RT> Jan> The most portable document format is PDF (Portable Document
> AJP> > RT> Jan> FOrmat - D'uh). RTF is not half as portable.
> AJP> > RT>
> AJP> > RT> Not to start a document format war, but isn't PDF a proprietary
> AJP> > RT> format? What about PS? I don't know if PS is proprietary, but it sure
> AJP> > RT> is *very* portable
> AJP> >
> AJP> > Except for MS-Windows boxes....
> AJP>
> AJP> gsview32 exists for windows and displays postscript fine.
>
> True, but *most* MS-Windows people don't know this.
ah yes, but this would be a problem with the people, not their boxes....
ap
--
======================================================================
Andrew J Perrin - Ph.D. Candidate, UC Berkeley, Dept. of Sociology
Chapel Hill, North Carolina, USA - http://demog.berkeley.edu/~aperrin
[EMAIL PROTECTED] - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Akira Yamanita <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: RedHat 6.2 Network Install?
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:36:08 GMT
Jon McLin wrote:
>
> A friend asked for some assistance installing RedHat 6.2 on a machine without a
> CD, but with a network card. Having successfully installed many distributions
> in many different configurations, I foolishly agreed.
>
> - Unlike RH 5.2, RH 6.2 doesn't have by default support an NFS
> installation. Solution: make a disk with bootnet.img from the RH 6.2 CD.
> - The bootnet. img on the CD is non-functional. Tried many times, dd to
> floppy then boot. System doesn't recognize it.
Download the latest bootnet image for 6.2. It worked great for me
though it was an FTP install.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Subject: Re: Using RDEV
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:36:59 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Tue, 17 Oct 2000 18:52:01 GMT, mike <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I moved a hard drive with Redhat Linux 6.1 from a primary master on
>one computer to another computer and set the
>drive up as a primary slave. The issue was getting into
>and running the Linux system.
> I used TomsRtBt to use fdisk and identify partitions and
>then mount the root partition of the Rh6.1. I then copied
>the linux kernel "vmlinuz-2.12-20 to a c:\loadlin DOS
>partition. I had to mount the c:\ partition to do this.
>I also discovered that I had to change all the references
>of /dev/hda to /dev/hdb in /etc/fstab. I was then able to
>boot the system with loadlin. I also made a
>boot floppy disk using "mkbootdisk".
> The issue that I am bringing up is that I did not have to
>use "rdev" to change the identity kernel's identity of
>where the root partition was. Why didn't I have to
>change it? I was able to make the boot floppy without rdev.
Maybe mkbootdisk does that for you automatically (or did it put LILO on
the floppy?).
>True I did not have to use lilo so far.
> Out of curiosity I did, rdev /root/vmlinuz and the results were:
>/dev/sdd2. What is /dev/sdd2? I thought that it would give
>me the old root device /dev/hda10 as it was when the drive
>was in another computer used as a primary ide master.
The distribution kernel was compiled on a scsi partition and that is what
is in the kernel as /dev/sdd2.
> When is rdev used?
You need to use rdev if you simply: cp /boot/vmlinuz /dev/fd0 and that
vmlinuz was compiled on a different / partition. In other works if used a
distro kernel compiled on /dev/sdd2, you would need to use rdev to change
/boot/vmlinuz (before copying) or /dev/fd0 (after copying) to your current
root partition.
You don't need rdev if you have a LILO floppy, only if it is a floppy with
a bare kernel.
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Efflandt)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux.mandrake
Subject: Re: Wanna lose warranty and pay $200 because my laptop has Linux?
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:52:22 +0000 (UTC)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Mon, 16 Oct 2000 07:54:20 GMT, YY Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>So I called again Toshiba to finalize shipment for servicing of my Toshiba Tecra. I
>was told if they find any other OS than what it came with it I'll loss the warranty
>and be charged $200 for repair. That is more clear warning that I was originally
>told. Not only I will whack MBR this time but will really empty the contents of
>/dev/hda5 while /dev/hda1 will only have solely a Windows 98!
I had a screen glitch on my Sony, but fortunately I had LILO on a /boot
partition instead of the MBR so it was simple to make the Win98se
partition the boot partition with fdisk. Then when I got it back, I
simply had to switch it to /boot as the active boot partition with Win
FDISK. I think I even mentioned in the paperwork that if they noticed
that the second partition was smaller than normal it was another OS. But
that had nothing to do the the screen glitch because it glitched in Win98
and even the Sony logo during boot before any OS was loaded.
I hear a lot of Sony bashing (it took them a month to fix it), but at
least they did not charge me anything just because I had another OS on the
computer.
--
David Efflandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.de-srv.com/
http://www.autox.chicago.il.us/ http://www.berniesfloral.net/
http://cgi-help.virtualave.net/ http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cgi-wiz/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Locked inbound telnet under RH7
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:54:36 GMT
I installed a fresh RH7. And to my surprise I was not able to telnet to
the machine (inbound) from other pingable machines. Not even from the
machine itself. Though, I can telnet to the other non RH7 machines
(outbound). There is no "/etc/inetd.conf" and the services are
turned on on the /etc/services". I tried modifying
"/etc/hosts.allow/deny" and /etc/sysctl.conf".. without results.
When I try to telnet to RH7 I get the "Connection refused" with all:
telnet, ftp, ssh, ....
Any Expert soution to unlock theses services?
Thanks
M.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: "Michael Westerman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: HACKED ? All logins fail
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:33:19 +1000
4 options i would try (in no particular order.)
1. restore from backup LOL (I never hava one my self.)
2. Write down crusial settings run redhat install updating only core
packages. (select nothing in custom settitng.)
3. reinstall.
4. check what accounts there are and if they should exist.
replace password programs and databases (they might have been replaced .
corupted or buged.
> user on the system gets the same message (Login incorrect), even root at
the
> secure tty. I can get a bash# prompt in
> single user mode to make changes, but I don't know what to change,
everthing
> I have checked seems fine. Resetting the passwords using passwd or adding
a
> new user in the root group doesn't work. I have checked /etc/pam.d/login
> against a working machine with the same version and they are identical.
> /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow contain the proper entries, and the accounts
do
> not appear to be expired. How can I fix this?
>
> Can anyone help with suggestions.
>
> RH 6.2 kernel v2.2.24-50
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Hal Burgiss)
Subject: Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7
Reply-To: Hal Burgiss <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 03:28:12 GMT
On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:54:36 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I installed a fresh RH7. And to my surprise I was not able to telnet to
>the machine (inbound) from other pingable machines. Not even from the
>machine itself. Though, I can telnet to the other non RH7 machines
>(outbound). There is no "/etc/inetd.conf" and the services are
>turned on on the /etc/services". I tried modifying
>"/etc/hosts.allow/deny" and /etc/sysctl.conf".. without results.
>When I try to telnet to RH7 I get the "Connection refused" with all:
>telnet, ftp, ssh, ....
>
>Any Expert soution to unlock theses services?
Yea, read the release notes. inetd is replaced by xinetd. man xinetd.
[hal@feenix hal]$ cat /etc/xinetd.d/telnet
# default: on
# description: The telnet server serves telnet sessions; it uses \
# unencrypted username/password pairs for authentication.
service telnet
{
disable = no
flags = REUSE
socket_type = stream
wait = no
user = root
server = /usr/sbin/in.telnetd
log_on_failure += USERID
}
--
Hal B
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
------------------------------
From: Robert Lynch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 20:28:56 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> I installed a fresh RH7. And to my surprise I was not able to telnet to
> the machine (inbound) from other pingable machines. Not even from the
> machine itself. Though, I can telnet to the other non RH7 machines
> (outbound). There is no "/etc/inetd.conf" and the services are
> turned on on the /etc/services". I tried modifying
> "/etc/hosts.allow/deny" and /etc/sysctl.conf".. without results.
> When I try to telnet to RH7 I get the "Connection refused" with all:
> telnet, ftp, ssh, ....
>
> Any Expert soution to unlock theses services?
>
> Thanks
>
> M.
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
I had sort of the opposite problem, I wanted to completely turn
OFF telnet and ftp. I found there is a new daemon, xinetd, and
there is a directory /etc/xinetd.d, with:
[root@ives xinetd.d]# ls
linuxconf-web telnet wu-ftpd
Looking at these, the first is off by default:
===
# default: off
# description: The Linuxconf system can also be accessed via a
web \
# browser. Enabling this service will allow
connections to \
# Linuxconf running in web UI mode.
service linuxconf
...
===
while the other two were default on. I turned them off like
this:
===
# default: on ; SET TO OFF 10-15-00
# description: The telnet server serves telnet sessions; it uses
\
# unencrypted username/password pairs for authentication.
service telnet
{
flags = REUSE
socket_type = stream
wait = no
user = root
server = /usr/sbin/in.telnetd
log_on_failure += USERID
# 10-15-00 disable this service
disable = yes
}
===
There is/will be probably some tool to do this.
Maybe you can mess with these files to accomplish what you want.
HTH, Bob L.
P.S. There is also a file, "/etc/xinetd.conf", but it is
disappointingly bare:
===
#
# Simple configuration file for xinetd
#
# Some defaults, and include /etc/xinetd.d/
defaults
{
instances = 60
log_type = SYSLOG authpriv
log_on_success = HOST PID
log_on_failure = HOST RECORD
}
includedir
/etc/xinetd.d
--
Robert Lynch-Berkeley CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Michael Westerman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: startx crashes
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:34:43 +1000
>
> Sometimes it seems related to the permissions on the files but
> I'm not sure of that.
prove it does by loging in as root and trying it.
------------------------------
From: Monte Milanuk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: RedHat 6.2 Network Install?
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 21:41:07 -0600
Jon McLin wrote:
> A friend asked for some assistance installing RedHat 6.2 on a machine without a
> CD, but with a network card. Having successfully installed many distributions
> in many different configurations, I foolishly agreed.
>
> - Unlike RH 5.2, RH 6.2 doesn't have by default support an NFS
> installation. Solution: make a disk with bootnet.img from the RH 6.2 CD.
> - The bootnet. img on the CD is non-functional. Tried many times, dd to
> floppy then boot. System doesn't recognize it.
> - Try advanced install. RH 6.2 croaks.
> - Boot with RH 5.2 bootdisk. Linux recognizes network card and we are off!
> Only when I point it to the 6.2 NFS disk, it dies a slow and painful death...
> - Boot with Mandrake 6.0. Ooops, this is RH 6.0, also missing the NFS mount
> option.
> - Boot with Caldera 2.4. Can't see the network card (an SMC 9000)
>
> Any suggestions on how to proceed? It is rather amusing/ironic/tragic that a
> network card recognized by a three-year old distribution isn't recognized by the
> Latest and Greatest.
>
> I expect I'll disassemble the box tomorrow to see if there is a spare IDE
> connector to which I may attach a CD. My friend thinks there is not, but I
> remain ever the optimist...
Ok, silly question here... Did you try a different floppy? I have had problems in
the past that boiled down to flaky media.
Monte
------------------------------
From: Robert Lynch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Locked inbound telnet under RH7
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 21:01:24 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Robert Lynch wrote:
[snip]
> I had sort of the opposite problem, I wanted to completely turn
> OFF telnet and ftp. I found there is a new daemon, xinetd, and
[snip-manual configuration by file editing]
> There is/will be probably some tool to do this.
>
This is the second time RH7.0 has caused me to follow-up post to
myself!
I found reading the RH docs, that chkconfig configures xinetd
services also. So to turn telnet off:
[root@ives xinetd.d]# /sbin/chkconfig --list
keytable 0:off 1:off 2:on 3:on 4:on 5:on
6:off
...
xinetd based services:
linuxconf-web: off
telnet: on
wu-ftpd: on
Just do:
/sbin/chkconfig --level 345 wu-ftpd off
for example.
Bob L.
P.S. When I enable telnet, it works:
$ telnet localhost
Trying 127.0.0.1...
Connected to localhost.
Escape character is '^]'.
Red Hat Linux release 7.0 (Guinness)
Kernel 2.4.0-test10 on an i686
login:
--
Robert Lynch-Berkeley CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
From: Darin Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 04:08:47 GMT
"Standard" generally means whatever people want it to mean,
I agree that "Windows" is a defacto ABI standard. But having Word or
Excel being defacto "document exchange" standards doesn't make sense,
because those programs do not attempt to make sure other programs can
use the same format. Even though lots of people can handle it, it
still feels like more of a "common document format" than a "standard".
Or maybe a statement that too many people don't know that Word can
decode a lot of other formats.
"Standard" implies something against which other things are measured
(ie, from the dictionary definition). So almost anything can be a
standard in that sense. Ie, if two or more programs generate the
Word output format, that format can be a standard - but the same
would apply to WordPerfect also. If there's only one of something,
measuring it against itself doesn't make it a standard.
Something that is popular is not necessarily a "standard" or "defacto
standard". A popular interface that you can't measure against is not
a standard. To me, that's the problem with Word being a standard - it
changes shape too often to be measured against. The standard starts
becoming "Word 95", then "Word 97" when enough people switch over,
etc. If the current "defacto standard" happens to be "Word 2001", and
there is no other program that exists at that time which generates
that format, is it a standard?
That's just me perhaps, but my definition of "standard" is not
"something that a lot of people use". But that's because I'm an
engineer.
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