On Tue, Sep 20, 2005 at 09:04:53AM -0700, Guido van Rossum wrote: > On 9/20/05, Michael Hudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Guido van Rossum <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > > On 9/19/05, Raymond Hettinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> I propose that in Py3.0, the "and" and "or" operators be simplified to > > >> always return a Boolean value instead of returning the last evaluated > > >> argument. > > > > > > While you're at it, maybe we should switch to && and || as well? > > > That's another thing I always mistype when switching between > > > languages... > > > > You're joking, surely? > > I wasn't, but I wasn't pushing for it either. Consider it withdrawn > given the response. > > > > Also, this proposal needs to be considered together with the addition > > > of a proper conditional operator, like x?y:z. > > > > I think this discussion has been had before, you know. > > Unfortunately, if we were to accept Raymond's proposal, we'd have to > revisit the discussion, since his proposal removes several ways we > currently avoid the need. > > In fact, I think Raymond's example is more properly considered an > argument for adding a conditional expression than for removing the > current behavior of the and/or shortcut operators; had we had a > conditional expression, he wouldn't have tried to use the "x and y or > z" syntax that bit him. > > Given this realization, I'm now -1 on Raymond's idea, and +1 on adding > a conditional expression. I believe (y if x else z) was my favorite > last time, wasn't it? I've changed the subject accordingly.
I'm +1 for allowing authors to write return bool(thing or default) when they mean a function to return a bool. I had the "privilege" of working in a large base of perl code (a learning experience) and while some engineers abused functions that were documented as only returning true/false by depending on the side effects of 'and' and 'or' this was easily fixed. The functions were changed to literally return a plain true or false value and those engineers were summarily fired. I'm a dependable Hettinger fanboy but on this one I have to agree with the we're-all-adults club. Let the authors type an extra few chars if they want to make the code match the intent. -jackdied _______________________________________________ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com