Re: Using the preps
Hi All, I believe it is a good idear to use all the preparations in the first instance and from time to time. Each one has a specific task and function. If having used all in balance and things get out of balance in your environment then by all means use one or several preparations to correct the imbalance. Best wishes, Peter. - Original Message - From: RiverValley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 6:27 PM Subject: Using the preps Hi All, Could problems develop from using some of the preps but not all. like just using 500, 501 and 508. thanks, Daniel - Original Message -
Re: RoundUp/Cover crop
Hi All What type of cover crop would you recommend as a companion planting for grapes ?? Thanks Per Garp/NH - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 10:34 PM Subject: Re: RoundUp Hi! Peter, If the cover crop is slowing vine growth, it suggests that there is a Nitrogen shortage. The cut cover crop and any mulch is mostly carbon and needs a specific proportion of nitrogen to break it down. It is important to start with a legume with the right inoculant to help set nitrogen from the air, into the soil, in a form the plant can use. The break down of carbon, also uses large amounts of nitrogen, which may be what has happened. When you get a nitrogen credit in the soil, it is OK to have a non nitrogen fixing cover crop. The use of the Preps will help the whole process. I also use the combined compost Preps, sprayed onto the freshly slashed cover crop, which seems to help it break down. If you have the time and a good Whipper Snipper, using the line, not blade, you can make a little guard on a long handle, which you can put against the butt of the vine and slash right to the butt, at ground level. I do not see properly managed cover crops as competing. They will keep out weeds and should produce all the N and C your crop requires. While they will use some water, if slashed fairly often, they also reduce water loss from bare soil and the effect of heat on the root run. In Oz with our mainly shallow soils, it is important to use all of it we can. A sun dried inch or two is wasted country and it also kills feeder roots. Gil J Peter Young wrote: Gil, We had a marvelous green manure crop this spring which, when we couldn't get control of it in the vine row, completely shut down vine growth in early summer. It is a young vineyard and apparently very sensitive to competition. Once the green manure crop finally fell away natually, the more noxious north coast weeds began to appear because of our irrigation. In some areas we did sow a clover vine row cover crop, but it was just a competitive. It's sad that next door, my conventional farming neighbor who uses a pre-emergent over the winter and then regularly applied RoundUp through teh growing season had much better growth and vigor with less water and a lot less fertilizer. We had hoped to only try to keep the 18 around each vine clear, but that is turning out to be impractical and next season we are going for an 18 to 24 wide strip. The aisles will continue to have cover crop in them providing habitat. Our biggest concern this year is getting in to the vineyard at the right points in time over the winer to use the vinegar and the number of passes we'll have to make each season since vinegar has not effect on the roots. Peter
Re: Using the preps
Dear Daniel, Some will tell you no problems can occur from using some but not all the preps. I say yes, problems can and often do develop. But they are subtle and may not be noticed by everyone. For example, In Australia Alex Podolinsky taught farmers to use 500 and only after quite some time to use 501--if at all. One of the reasons he gave such counsel was that use of the 501 on paddocks and hayfields significantly hastened seeding and lessened vegetative growth. Had he used the two back-to-back vegetative growth would have increased because the 500 increases the digestive, nutritive activity in the soil that feeds the foliage AND the atmospheric activities of photosynthesis, blossoming, fruiting and ripening would have been enhanced. I realize that stirring and spraying large paddocks with 500 and then turning right around and stirring and spraying 501 is too much for busy farmers to accomplish, or if they could do it it wouldn't be easy. But these two soil and atmosphere preps need to be sprayed back-to-back for balance to be maintained. In fact, ideally horn clay should be used as the final application in a three part sequence, as it stimulates the ebb and flow of sap in plants which allows for the exchange between the below ground activities of the plant and the above ground activities. The pity of what has happened in Australia--and to some extent New Zealand as well--is many farmers launched into biodynamics by spraying 500. And they got wonderful results bringing soils to life so that digestion and nutrition was improved for plants. But the forces all too soon began to work too strongly downward and not enough upward into the atmosphere. Thus the available, easily leached minerals from calcium or magnesium down to boron and copper migrated downward out of the root zone, and these farms progressively experienced falling production. Many of them gave up on using biodynamics, and what seemed a very promising beginning sort of plateaued out. Another example. I seriously over used 507, the valerian flower juice, one summer and I had carrots blooming in their first year. Corn tassled but made no ears. Tomatoes and peppers blossomed a bit and then died. This remedy stimulates blossoming, but you see, you can overdo it. Glen Atkinson had a great picture of three kale plants in close proximity to each other. One was given repeated homeopathic 500 while another was given repeated 501. The former remained robustly vegetative while the latter went to seed. 500 is like the nervous system while 501 is like the senses. To support these you need the kidneys (yarrow) the intestines (chamomile) the circulation (nettle) the bones (oak bark) the liver (dandelion) the lungs (valerian) and the skin and hair (horsetail). Leaving any of them out is going to cost you the integrity of the farm organism. Steiner's remedies are potent tools and need to be used with skill and insight. You wouldn't repair your automobile using only a flat bladed screwdriver and vice grips. You'd use most if not all of your toolset and use each appropriately. Best, Hugh Lovel Hi All, Could problems develop from using some of the preps but not all. like just using 500, 501 and 508. thanks, Daniel - Original Message - From: Tony Nelson-Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 9:13 AM Subject: Re: Cancer etc Sunny (in particular) - Even amongst fairly mainstream sufferers, attitude and a willingness to accept unconventional therapies seem to have very positive results. An acquaintance with colon cancer was given only months to live but, with the help of a very positive attitude and a diet worked out by the Bristol Centre, survived for several years; yet medical 'wisdom' still regularly dismisses such influences. I wasn't at that time aware of anthroposophical medicine or other, more spiritual alternative therapies - maybe, had I been able to pass on to him the suggestions arising from this thread, he'd still be with us! Tony N-S. _ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp Visit our website at: www.unionag.org
Re: Heads up: USDA Organic Rules to Impact BD Practices
Dears, The rules for spraying compost tea w/molasses were written out of fear and ignorance, unfortunately. It's that one size fits all mentality that so often infects bureaucracies. There's a lot of crops that don't have 120 days from planting to harvest. I'm told that the commonest vector for transmission of trichinosis (sometimes found in pork) is bird droppings on lettuce or some such. If the politics were a little different maybe we would see compost tea mandated to protect us from such a thing. Personally I don't want to be regulated by the government. What I've noticed over the years is the more laws we have the more lawless our society has become and that where governments work best is where people act responsibly because of personal motivation rather then because they are made to do so. Yes, the real issues are clean tea makers and teas with a good mix of healthy bacteria and fungi. There is a fear of pathogenic coliforms akin to the fear of poisonous spiders. Most are benign or evens beneficial. There are just a few dangerous ones, and if you keep your eyes peeled you don 't run afoul of them any more than you would run afoul of dangerous coliforms. Best, Hugh Lovel If the rules say that you can't spray CT on food crops for 120 days before harvest, then they are talking about foliar feed. They are worried about I. coli which forms in anaerobic situations in CT where there is too much food for the organisms (molasses) and too little aeration getting on food that is going to market. The participants in the CT list/serve are talking about their CT makers in terms of their ability to clean them well and quickly and in terms of getting not only bacteria, but a balance of bacteria and fungi. There's so much to understand. I would say that the NOP standards apply only to Certified organic growers. But certified organic is supposed to be the highest standard in the U.S. If they are so worded that they exclude the use of CT, then really they aren't useful for organic farmers because 24-hour CT as conceptualized by Elaine at Soil Food Web, Inc. makes organic much better. This is why Elaine's lectures around the world are so important. A lot of organic growers don't really know anything about what is actually going on in making compost--only that raw manure is prohibited. They have the rule without the understanding, and could easily have anaerobic conditions in their compost pile to start with. Elaine is writing a guide for understanding compost making. That ought to help matters. I surely do hope she can reach mainstream organic growers. If people do listen and understand instead of just following rules, then there shouldn't be any trouble. There also must be a difference between a cow pie you pick up in a BD pasture and the stuff that comes out of the kind of confined conditions that exist in feed lots. This does not help matters. I found Will Brinton's analysis of 500 to have limitations. His analysis of 500 doesn't tell me why it enlivens the soil. It only says that 500 is not raw manure. But how do BD compost and 500 work together? Has anyone ever been able to analyze the process or is it too esoteric? Allan Balliett wrote: If you're monitoring SANET or Elaine Inghams compost tea discussion group, you already know that the USDA organic rules group has been advised to restrict the use of compost teas on food crops. This applies particularly to teas that use added sugars (mollasses, for example). Already, however, it appears that the rule may be generalized to 'ban' all cow manure based teas. The chances of this impacting BD 500 and BC is very high. Of course, this only applies to people who are interested in receiving USDA organic certification, but the possibility of truly negative publicity is very high. I don't have all the details on these events, and what I've said above may be misleading. What I have to say most importantly is that we need to gather all the information we can on this move by the USDA organic group and discuss it among ourselves so we are prepared to speak out on it and more importantly, to talk intelligently to our customers about the difference between biodynamically grown foods and USDA organics. -Allan Visit our website at: www.unionag.org
Query: BD or organic grape alcohol
Hello All, Does anyone onlist have a source for BD or organic grape alcohol? I would like to purchase a gallon if possible? Thanks for any help. Blessings, Jane
Impact BD Practices
dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Re: Loss and Rebirth
Hi, Being a Canadian, we look at American's with our own cultural bias. While we like to think that we are different then you (better, wiser, and nicer), we are more alike then not. Most Canadians will not admit this, but I have no problem seeing our similarities. Goodness is everywhere in the common folks. Both our governments are giving way to industries, that have the similar motivations and ways to control our thoughts (Although your CNN seems to be a quite the military/patriotic brainwash... unbelievable for us...). As far as I'm concern Americans protesting against their own government is not an 'Anti-American' thing, but totally and fully a American ! In every war Americans have protested their government. Protesting the government is healthy and a patriotic things to do! What's not healthy is following blindly a 'petroleum trigger happy military head of state', and believing everything his propaganda buddies say (e.g. CNN). As far as I'm concern the fact that Americans protest their government saves the face of Americans. Gosh... If no one would take to the streets and voice their discontent, what reasons would I have to like America? Just kidding. Hey, while your at it, tell your government to ratify Kyoto and stop taxing the softwood lumber imports. he he he That's just my opinion and I could be wrong... Your northern neighbor, Robin - Original Message - From: Will Winter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: October 27, 2002 8:25 PM Subject: Loss and Rebirth Thanks Susan As a fellow Minnesotan I fully agree with what you say about the deep sadness permeating our state regarding the loss of the Wellstones. I sit here still in mixed grief and continued disbelief. Lost and confused what to do, my wife Rebekah and I attended the Peace Rally yesterday along with 10,000 others. Our hearts swelled when we heard there were 200,000 others rallying for peace in D.C. Our event flooded into an emotional memorial to the great national loss of Senator Wellstone and his family. Just as important, though, we noticed that something fresh is being reborn inside us and inside others. For the FIRST TIME since the reign of the current administration we are beginning to feel we can find our voices again to PROTEST governmental policies and NOT have to whither under the remarks by some that we are anti-American. We now remember that we can vehemently express our opposition to certain policies such as the Agricultural policies or even a preemptive first strike and NOT have to take any guff about being anti-American. Again, we are NOT being anti-American when we speak out. For the first time in decades I can and do say I love America but I will also stand up and fight against some of her policies. Awake in Minnesota, Will Winter
Re: Query: BD or organic grape alcohol
Gina Nonnini of Marian Farms (Demeter) [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jane Sherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: BdNow [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 8:42 AM Subject: Query: BD or organic grape alcohol Hello All, Does anyone onlist have a source for BD or organic grape alcohol? I would like to purchase a gallon if possible? Thanks for any help. Blessings, Jane
FW: (a 9-11 reminder...) For the Michael Age
From my files... Thank you Steve the many others in my life who have brought this piece to my attention. -- Forwarded Message From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2002 12:15:13 EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: a 9-11 reminder... For the Michael Age We must eradicate from the soul All fear and terror of what comes towards Man Out of the future And we must acquire serenity In all feelings and sensations about the future We must look forward With absolute equanimity to everything that may come And we must think only that whatever comes Is given to us by a world directive full of wisdom It is part of what we must learn in this age, Namely to live out of pure trust Without any security in existence. Trust in that ever present help of the spiritual world. Truly, nothing else will do If our courage is not to fail us. And we must seek this awakening within Ourselves Every morning and every evening. Rudolph Steiner, from a lecture given in 1910 -- End of Forwarded Message
Re: Impact BD Practices
consumption atitude of practicioners? Dear Nelson, could you please explain a liittle better what you mean by this. I don't understand. Sincerely, Christy Korrow - Original Message - From: Nelson Jacomel Junior [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 8:38 AM Subject: Impact BD Practices dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Re: Impact BD Practices
Hello, Congrads on finding such an exciting Ph.D. thesis! I suspect that there will not be much scientific literature concerning your topic here in America, but certainly more in Germany and elsewhere. Such a lack of information is WHY you are justified to study this topic as a Ph.D.. If we knew the answer to your problem then your research topic would not be fit for a Ph.D.. In other word, the less you know about your problem, or how to solve your problem, the better it is. This may sound cynical, but too many graduates students simply catalogue what we already know. This latter task is valuable but not for higher education purposes. Having said that, do you know this reference: *Lorand, A.C. 1996. Biodynamic Agriculture - A Paradigmatic Analysis. The Pennsylvania State University, Department of Agriculture and Extension Education. Ph.D. Dissertation. 114p. It's a good start for pointing out the social evolution and perception of BD. It's on the web. Search for it! I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? Perhaps you can look at what has been done in that topic for organic farming. Maybe you will be inspired by the methodologies they might have used in their studies. Have fun! Robin - Original Message - From: Nelson Jacomel Junior [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: October 28, 2002 6:38 AM Subject: Impact BD Practices dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Re: Impact BD Practices
Dear Nelson: Last year, 2 local professors/team ...University of Windsorcompleted a 2-year research paper on conventional, organic, and biodynamic farming practitioners in ontario, canada. They surveyed all the groups with questionaires including personal convictions, level of integrity re land stewardship,etc. Also, familial and financial state of being., and i believe there were some social conclusions/ impacts/trends noted. While this was not exclusively a bd subject, there were some distinct differences which were no surprise to most of us who read the finished paper. A noteworthy social impact is always found in consumers who participate in a csa ...community supported agriculture... venture: sincere appreciation for the hand-blessed produce and process which they share in. Appreciation is generative, and this surely has a ripple impact in their compound worlds. If the document (fairly academic) sounds interesting for you, i could obtain a copy and forward to you if you can wait a while. ? ...manfred palmer - Original Message - From: Nelson Jacomel Junior [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 9:38 AM Subject: Impact BD Practices dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Re: Impact BD Practices
Hi! Manfred, Sounds very interesting. Is the document small enough to email? I have unrestricted access. Gil manfred palmer wrote: Dear Nelson: Last year, 2 local professors/team ...University of Windsorcompleted a 2-year research paper on conventional, organic, and biodynamic farming practitioners in ontario, canada. They surveyed all the groups with questionaires including personal convictions, level of integrity re land stewardship,etc. Also, familial and financial state of being., and i believe there were some social conclusions/ impacts/trends noted. While this was not exclusively a bd subject, there were some distinct differences which were no surprise to most of us who read the finished paper. A noteworthy social impact is always found in consumers who participate in a csa ...community supported agriculture... venture: sincere appreciation for the hand-blessed produce and process which they share in. Appreciation is generative, and this surely has a ripple impact in their compound worlds. If the document (fairly academic) sounds interesting for you, i could obtain a copy and forward to you if you can wait a while. ? ...manfred palmer - Original Message - From: Nelson Jacomel Junior [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 9:38 AM Subject: Impact BD Practices dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Re: RoundUp/Cover crop
Hi! Per Garp/NH Over here we have winter rain, which is our main growing season, followed by spring when most thing finish for harvest, with grapes coming in around February. We start with a legume peas/ fava beans, hairy vetch etc, planted on the first rains. A soon as it flowers, but before it sets seed, it is slashed and oats or other grain sowed through it. Again, as soon as it flowers and is still at the milky stage, slash it and just let it lay on top and there is your summer mulch. Some run the slasher through a couple of times to cut it shorter. This should supply all the N and C required. I like to spray the freshly slashed material with the compost Preps. Gil COYOTEHILLFARM wrote: Hi All What type of cover crop would you recommend as a companion planting for grapes ?? Thanks Per Garp/NH - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 10:34 PM Subject: Re: RoundUp Hi! Peter, If the cover crop is slowing vine growth, it suggests that there is a Nitrogen shortage. The cut cover crop and any mulch is mostly carbon and needs a specific proportion of nitrogen to break it down. It is important to start with a legume with the right inoculant to help set nitrogen from the air, into the soil, in a form the plant can use. The break down of carbon, also uses large amounts of nitrogen, which may be what has happened. When you get a nitrogen credit in the soil, it is OK to have a non nitrogen fixing cover crop. The use of the Preps will help the whole process. I also use the combined compost Preps, sprayed onto the freshly slashed cover crop, which seems to help it break down. If you have the time and a good Whipper Snipper, using the line, not blade, you can make a little guard on a long handle, which you can put against the butt of the vine and slash right to the butt, at ground level. I do not see properly managed cover crops as competing. They will keep out weeds and should produce all the N and C your crop requires. While they will use some water, if slashed fairly often, they also reduce water loss from bare soil and the effect of heat on the root run. In Oz with our mainly shallow soils, it is important to use all of it we can. A sun dried inch or two is wasted country and it also kills feeder roots. Gil J Peter Young wrote: Gil, We had a marvelous green manure crop this spring which, when we couldn't get control of it in the vine row, completely shut down vine growth in early summer. It is a young vineyard and apparently very sensitive to competition. Once the green manure crop finally fell away natually, the more noxious north coast weeds began to appear because of our irrigation. In some areas we did sow a clover vine row cover crop, but it was just a competitive. It's sad that next door, my conventional farming neighbor who uses a pre-emergent over the winter and then regularly applied RoundUp through teh growing season had much better growth and vigor with less water and a lot less fertilizer. We had hoped to only try to keep the 18 around each vine clear, but that is turning out to be impractical and next season we are going for an 18 to 24 wide strip. The aisles will continue to have cover crop in them providing habitat. Our biggest concern this year is getting in to the vineyard at the right points in time over the winer to use the vinegar and the number of passes we'll have to make each season since vinegar has not effect on the roots. Peter
Re: RoundUp/Cover crop
Gil, How do you sow the oats through the previuos cover crop? thanks, Daniel - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 8:11 PM Subject: Re: RoundUp/Cover crop Hi! Per Garp/NH Over here we have winter rain, which is our main growing season, followed by spring when most thing finish for harvest, with grapes coming in around February. We start with a legume peas/ fava beans, hairy vetch etc, planted on the first rains. A soon as it flowers, but before it sets seed, it is slashed and oats or other grain sowed through it. Again, as soon as it flowers and is still at the milky stage, slash it and just let it lay on top and there is your summer mulch. Some run the slasher through a couple of times to cut it shorter. This should supply all the N and C required. I like to spray the freshly slashed material with the compost Preps. Gil COYOTEHILLFARM wrote: Hi All What type of cover crop would you recommend as a companion planting for grapes ?? Thanks Per Garp/NH - Original Message - From: Gil Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 10:34 PM Subject: Re: RoundUp Hi! Peter, If the cover crop is slowing vine growth, it suggests that there is a Nitrogen shortage. The cut cover crop and any mulch is mostly carbon and needs a specific proportion of nitrogen to break it down. It is important to start with a legume with the right inoculant to help set nitrogen from the air, into the soil, in a form the plant can use. The break down of carbon, also uses large amounts of nitrogen, which may be what has happened. When you get a nitrogen credit in the soil, it is OK to have a non nitrogen fixing cover crop. The use of the Preps will help the whole process. I also use the combined compost Preps, sprayed onto the freshly slashed cover crop, which seems to help it break down. If you have the time and a good Whipper Snipper, using the line, not blade, you can make a little guard on a long handle, which you can put against the butt of the vine and slash right to the butt, at ground level. I do not see properly managed cover crops as competing. They will keep out weeds and should produce all the N and C your crop requires. While they will use some water, if slashed fairly often, they also reduce water loss from bare soil and the effect of heat on the root run. In Oz with our mainly shallow soils, it is important to use all of it we can. A sun dried inch or two is wasted country and it also kills feeder roots. Gil J Peter Young wrote: Gil, We had a marvelous green manure crop this spring which, when we couldn't get control of it in the vine row, completely shut down vine growth in early summer. It is a young vineyard and apparently very sensitive to competition. Once the green manure crop finally fell away natually, the more noxious north coast weeds began to appear because of our irrigation. In some areas we did sow a clover vine row cover crop, but it was just a competitive. It's sad that next door, my conventional farming neighbor who uses a pre-emergent over the winter and then regularly applied RoundUp through teh growing season had much better growth and vigor with less water and a lot less fertilizer. We had hoped to only try to keep the 18 around each vine clear, but that is turning out to be impractical and next season we are going for an 18 to 24 wide strip. The aisles will continue to have cover crop in them providing habitat. Our biggest concern this year is getting in to the vineyard at the right points in time over the winer to use the vinegar and the number of passes we'll have to make each season since vinegar has not effect on the roots. Peter
Re: FW: (a 9-11 reminder...) For the Michael Age
Not to diminish the value of these words,but just to set the record straight, I merely point out that--similar to the popular "Genius has boldness" verse attributed to Goethe--this verse has origins in Steiner's work, but is not actually directly from his pen or mouth as such. For those who are interested, I'll paste below exerpts from three emails that appeared on the anthropos-sciencelist this time last year that spelled this out. On Mon, 28 Oct 2002 09:55:14 -0500 Jane Sherry [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Subject: a 9-11 reminder... For the Michael Age We must eradicate from the soul All fear and terror of what comes towards Man Out of the future And we must acquire serenity In all feelings and sensations about the future We must look forward With absolute equanimity to everything that may come And we must think only that whatever comes Is given to us by a world directive full of wisdom It is part of what we must learn in this age, Namely to live out of pure trust Without any security in existence. Trust in that ever present help of the spiritual world. Truly, nothing else will do If our courage is not to fail us. And we must seek this awakening within Ourselves Every morning and every evening. Rudolph Steiner, from a lecture given in 1910 -- End of Forwarded Message [first exerpt] This "trust meditation" is one of several translations of several versions that are in circulation. The editors at the Rudolf Steiner Archive, however, have pointed out that none of these versions were ever given as such by Rudolf Steiner. They were created by unknown persons by patching together and modifying various passages from Steiner's lectures (or possibly from elsewhere). The first six lines in the above version, for example, are an abbreviated passage from Steiner's lecture "Cognition and Immortality" (Bremen, Nov. 27, 1910), which has been published only in the Archive newsletter (Beiträge zur Rudolf Steiner Gesamtausgabe, #98, p. 10). The remaining lines come from the end of Emanuel Zeylmans' biography of his father, "Willem Zeylmans van Emmichoven. Ein Pionier der Anthroposophie" (Arlesheim 1979, p. 358). The son relates that at his father's death he found a slip of paper in his father's wallet with these lines, which supposedly came from Rudolf Steiner. Although this is entirely possible (Willem was a friend of Steiner's and became the General Secretary of the Dutch Anthroposophical Society), the editors at the Rudolf Steiner Archive have not been able to independently verify the source of these words.The foregoing facts do not necessarily affect the truth of the whole "verse," but readers should be aware that it was not given as such by Rudolf Steiner and that it therefore probably does not have the occult power inherent in Steiner's other meditative verses. [exerpt two] I think the reference everyone is looking for is 27th November 1919.Where Steiner said."First, however, everything that remains of the old will have to bereduced to nothingness. The clouds will have to gather round the humanbeing, and he will have to find his freedom - find his own power, hisown strength out of this nothingness. Outer material need will changeinto soul need, and out of this deep need of the soul will vision beborn.We must tear up by the roots every trace of fear and shrinking in faceof what the future threatens to bring to human beings. All our feelingabout the future must be permeated with calm and confidence. Absoluteequanimity in face of whatever the future may bring - that is what manhas to acquire, knowing as he does that everything that happens, happensunder an all-wise cosmic guidance.Our part is to do what is right in each moment as it comes - and toleave the rest to the future, That indeed is the lesson we have tolearn in our time, to base our lives on simple trust. without anysecurity of existence, to have trust in the ever-present help of thespiritual world. That is the only way for us if our courage is not tofail. Let us then set to work to discipline our will."(based on a translation by Mary Adams) [exerpt three] Steiner did not say this on Nov. 27, 1919; this is another amalgam of out of context passages. In this amalgam the first paragraph is extracted from the end of Steiner's lecture of Oct. 30, 1920 (GA 200, p. 120), which is published in English as lecture 6 of "The New Spirituality". The second paragraph is a different translation of the first paragraph of the "trust meditation" that I commented on earlier (the date is Nov. 27, 1910, not 1919). I don't know where the first sentence of the third paragraph comes from. The remainder of the last paragraph is a different (and incomplete) translation of the material from Emmichoven.___Barry Lia \ [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ Seattle WA
Re: Impact BD Practices
Dear Nelson, Interesting topic. I often say that my job is growing farmers, because as the information and advisory person for our association in Australia, the part I love the most is working with farmers as they first come in to Biodynamics and then start to make changes in their thinking and way of life as they evolve and work more with BD agriculture. They become so much more confident, and really enjoy their work. They also develop their observational skills and become more in tune with their environment, then you see their family values changes, food consumption change and attitudes to education for their children as well. That is if they are not too overworked - and that can also happen, when economically they cant afford help and their life becomes a matter of survival on huge properties with too high a workload to achieve their goals. (But that seems to happen in farming generally, and I guess most of life.) I havent heard of any research being done on BD farms re this topic, but I do know of something like it for Organics generally, see below. 11. APPLICANT'S PREVIOUS WORK IN THIS OR RELATED TOPICS (ie. give journal references)Lawrence G et al (2001) Agrigenetics, food consumption and the environment, in Lockie Pritchard (eds) Consuming foods, sustaining environments, AAP: Brisbane.*Lockie S, Lyons K Lawrence G (2000) Constructing Green Foods: Corporate Capital, Risk and Organic Farming in Aust and NZ, Ag Human Values 17, 315-322.* Lockie S (1998) Env and Social Risks, and the Construction of Best-Practice in Aust Agriculture, Ag Human Values 15, 243-252. email for Stewart Lockie [EMAIL PROTECTED] Kirsten Lyons also did some of this work with Stewart on social values and organic foods. Best wishes with your research, Cheryl Kemp Education and Workshop Coordinator Biodynamic AgriCulture Australia Phone /Fax : 02 6657 5322 Home: 02 6657 5306 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.biodynamics.net.au - Original Message - From: Nelson Jacomel Junior [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 1:38 AM Subject: Impact BD Practices dears: after some months away from the list (the server was out of order) I feel very happy to read our mesages again. Now, I'm to start a doctorate study at local university regarding bd agriculture, environment and changes of consumption habits. I would like to ask if we have any information on research done in social changes related to the use of biodynamic agriculture. I mean, we have conversations on the impact of bd practices in our produces but do we have studies on the impact over the consumption atitude of practicioners? Or on citizens? I know its a tough subject despite I'm sure there is a change. Have any one reported that or researched that? Tks for any comment. Nelson Jacomel Junior agronomist, member at South Brasil Biodynamic Agriculture Association from Florianopolis, SC, Brasil. - This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
