[cayugabirds-l] Moving the Christmas Count Date Earlier
Moving the Christmas Count earlier would certainly make it impossible for us and many local families to participate--there are too many conflicting required school or work, or other social events the two weeks before Christmas. In addition, the compilation dinner would not be well-attended, and I think that is an important event bringing many local birders together--it's a nice way to start the new year. Sandy At 07:49 AM 12/30/2013, you wrote: I'll stick my neck out and resurect the suggestion that we change our Christmas count date. It would be great to add the many students and holiday travelers to our group of counters. Maybe the second or third Saturday of December. Laura Laura Stenzler lmailto:m...@cornell.edum...@cornell.edu On Dec 29, 2013, at 10:52 PM, Dave Nutter mailto:nutter.d...@me.comnutter.d...@me.com wrote: Perhaps the line of fire proximity of people buildings was the reason the DEC police called in the gunners who were in the SW corner of the lake tied to a tree along the shore of Treman. I saw in the background 2 adults and a child on the beach of the west shore, associated with the first house, a large new one. I'd like to petition the DEC to have the south end of the lake, say the portion within the City of Ithaca, which does not allow firing guns, off limits to hunting. --Dave Nutter On Dec 29, 2013, at 08:47 PM, Anne Clark mailto:anneb.cl...@gmail.comanneb.cl...@gmail.com wrote: It sounds as if some of these folks might be illegally close to buildings, although I suppose they argue that their guns are pointing down the lake. On the other hand, in the park area, trails and inlets make a complex problem for claiming that nothing could be in the line of fire when shooting at ducks flying in and over. Do they really stop firing when the ducks swing toward shore? Per the DEC hunting regulations Question: How far from a building do I have to be to discharge my firearm? Answer: You cannot discharge a firearm or bow within 500 feet of any school, playground, occupied factory or church. You cannot discharge a firearm or bow within 500 feet of a dwelling, farm building, or structure unless you own it, lease it, are an immediate member of the family, an employee, or have the owner's consent. This does not apply to the discharge of a shotgun over water when hunting migratory game birds and no dwelling, public structure, livestock, or person is in the line of fire. On Dec 29, 2013, at 5:07 PM, Kenneth V. Rosenberg wrote: I birded at East Shore Park on Saturday mid-day, and at Stewart Park this morning -- I must say that I have never seen so much hunting pressure at the south end of the lake. I want to say clearly that I am not against legal duck hunting in well managed areas (and I buy a Migratory Bird Stamp to support wetland conservation), but what is going on this year does not seem to be sustainable or an appropriate use of such a large public space. Boats with hunters and decoys were anchored right under the trees at the Swan Pen at Stewart Park, at the tip of the red lighthouse jetty, at the wooden buoy marker, on the beach at Hogs Hole, and along East Shore -- yesterday there was an additional boat cruising the center of the lake to chase duck flocks. Needless to say there was not a single spot for ducks to rest safely anywhere in the southern quarter-mile or so of Cayuga Lake (and probably north past Myer's Point as well), and any flock that circled around over the south end of the lake (no matter how high) was shot at. I don't know if DEC would consider that proper management of this important waterfowl wintering area. This seemed pretty different from the past few years when a few hunters kept the duck flocks moving around but there was plenty of place for them to rest -- notably along the Stewart Park shoreline, which was not available today. This activity will undoubtedly affect the numbers of waterfowl on this year's Christmas Bird Count on Wednesday (wasn't much to count today). If this trend continues in future years, I strongly recommend that the Cayuga Bird Club move its count to the days prior to the late hunting season -- this slight straying from tradition will probably yield more accurate numbers of local waterfowl populations. In spite of the hunting, I did manage to see a few distant LONG-TAILED DUCKS and a single WHITE-WINGED SCOTER far to the north of East Shore Park, and a flock of 12 RUDDY DUCKS, along with HORNED and PIED-BIILED GREBES, COMMON LOON, and 3 DOUBLE-CRESTED CORMORANTS -- all decent CBC birds if they can hang in there. There were also TUNDRA SWANS around this morning -- 2 on the ice at Stewart Park east end when I arrived, and a flock of 40-50 in the center of the lake way out. Later in the morning, as I was scouting around the Farmers Market and Community Gardens, several small flocks of swans passed over Ithaca heading south. Yesterday, at Taughannock Falls State
Re:[cayugabirds-l] Moving the Christmas Count Date Earlier
Iagree with Sandy. The Jan. 1stdate for the count has its origins with Doc Allen, I believe. He chose it since everyone would have aday off anyway and this has worked for years. All of our data is based on thisdate so I would think that consistency would have value. (Kevin?) Until recently, waterfowl numbers on Jan. 1st weretremendous; it is the currenthunting season that is effecting us. I want to stick with ourtraditional date. We might possibly have more student participationif we picked another weekend, but many people leave school earlier in Decemberthan you might think. Also, thoseweekends before Christmas are much in demand for other holiday parties, etc.(certainly true for our household, so we’d be unlikely to participate in thefuture) and I think we’d create more of a problem. I hope we can make some change onthe hunting regulations at the south end of the lake and improve the situationin that way. CarolSchmitt -Original Message- From: Sandy Podulka s...@cornell.edu To: Cayuga List Cayugabirds-L@cornell.edu Sent: Mon, Dec 30, 2013 10:04 am Subject: [cayugabirds-l] Moving the Christmas Count Date Earlier Moving the Christmas Count earlier would certainly make itimpossible for us and many local families to participate--there are toomany conflicting required school or work, or other social events the twoweeks before Christmas. In addition, the compilation dinner would not bewell-attended, and I think that is an important event bringing many localbirders together--it's a nice way to start the new year. Sandy At 07:49 AM 12/30/2013, you wrote: I'll stick my neck out andresurect the suggestion that we change our Christmas count date. It wouldbe great to add the many students and holiday travelers to our group ofcounters. Maybe the second or third Saturday of December. Laura Laura Stenzler l...@cornell.edu On Dec 29, 2013, at 10:52 PM, Dave Nutternutter.d...@me.comwrote: Perhaps the line of fire proximity of people buildings was the reason the DEC police calledin the gunners who were in the SW corner of the lake tied to a tree alongthe shore of Treman. I saw in the background 2 adults and a child on thebeach of the west shore, associated with the first house, a large newone. I'd like to petition the DEC to have the south end of the lake, say theportion within the City of Ithaca, which does not allow firing guns, offlimits to hunting. --Dave Nutter On Dec 29, 2013, at 08:47 PM, Anne Clarkanneb.cl...@gmail.comwrote: It sounds as if some of thesefolks might be illegally close to buildings, although I suppose theyargue that their guns are pointing down the lake. On the otherhand, in the park area, trails and inlets make a complex problem forclaiming that nothing could be in the line of fire when shooting at ducksflying in and over. Do they really stop firing when the ducks swingtoward shore? Per the DEC hunting regulations Question: How far from a building do I have to be to discharge myfirearm? Answer: You cannot discharge a firearm or bow within 500 feet of anyschool, playground, occupied factory or church. You cannot discharge afirearm or bow within 500 feet of a dwelling, farm building, or structureunless you own it, lease it, are an immediate member of the family, anemployee, or have the owner's consent. This does not apply to thedischarge of a shotgun over water when hunting migratory game birds andno dwelling, public structure, livestock, or person is in the line offire. On Dec 29, 2013, at 5:07 PM, Kenneth V. Rosenberg wrote: I birded at East Shore Park onSaturday mid-day, and at Stewart Park this morning -- I must say that Ihave never seen so much hunting pressure at the south end of the lake. Iwant to say clearly that I am not against legal duck hunting in wellmanaged areas (and I buy a Migratory Bird Stamp to support wetlandconservation), but what is going on this year does not seem to besustainable or an appropriate use of such a large public space. Boatswith hunters and decoys were anchored right under the trees at the SwanPen at Stewart Park, at the tip of the red lighthouse jetty, at thewooden buoy marker, on the beach at Hogs Hole, and along East Shore --yesterday there was an additional boat cruising the center of the lake tochase duck flocks. Needless to say there was not a single spot for ducksto rest safely anywhere in the southern quarter-mile or so of Cayuga Lake(and probably north past Myer's Point as well), and any flock thatcircled around over the south end of the lake (no matter how high) wasshot at. I don't know if DEC would consider that proper management ofthis important waterfowl wintering area. This seemed pretty differentfrom the past few years when a few hunters kept the duck flocks movingaround but there was plenty of place for them to rest -- notably alongthe Stewart Park shoreline, which was not available today. This activity will undoubtedly affect
Re: [cayugabirds-l] Moving the Christmas Count Date Earlier
My observations from alternative scheduling strategies: I participate in the count around Binghamton. It is scheduled on a weekend before Christmas and is not always easy for folks, depending on such variables as the last dates at Binghamton University as well as holiday events. To keep it on a weekend, the date has to flex, which makes some years worse than others for counters. And it makes it harder to plan ahead. The Jan 1st date seems like a good one for participation because it can be a set date, no matter the year. Anne On Dec 30, 2013, at 10:32 AM, Carol Schmitt wrote: I agree with Sandy. The Jan. 1st date for the count has its origins with Doc Allen, I believe. He chose it since everyone would have a day off anyway and this has worked for years. All of our data is based on this date so I would think that consistency would have value. (Kevin?) Until recently, waterfowl numbers on Jan. 1st were tremendous; it is the current hunting season that is effecting us. I want to stick with our traditional date. We might possibly have more student participation if we picked another weekend, but many people leave school earlier in December than you might think. Also, those weekends before Christmas are much in demand for other holiday parties, etc. (certainly true for our household, so we’d be unlikely to participate in the future) and I think we’d create more of a problem. I hope we can make some change on the hunting regulations at the south end of the lake and improve the situation in that way. Carol Schmitt -Original Message- From: Sandy Podulka s...@cornell.edu To: Cayuga List Cayugabirds-L@cornell.edu Sent: Mon, Dec 30, 2013 10:04 am Subject: [cayugabirds-l] Moving the Christmas Count Date Earlier Moving the Christmas Count earlier would certainly make it impossible for us and many local families to participate--there are too many conflicting required school or work, or other social events the two weeks before Christmas. In addition, the compilation dinner would not be well-attended, and I think that is an important event bringing many local birders together--it's a nice way to start the new year. Sandy At 07:49 AM 12/30/2013, you wrote: I'll stick my neck out and resurect the suggestion that we change our Christmas count date. It would be great to add the many students and holiday travelers to our group of counters. Maybe the second or third Saturday of December. Laura Laura Stenzler l...@cornell.edu On Dec 29, 2013, at 10:52 PM, Dave Nutter nutter.d...@me.com wrote: Perhaps the line of fire proximity of people buildings was the reason the DEC police called in the gunners who were in the SW corner of the lake tied to a tree along the shore of Treman. I saw in the background 2 adults and a child on the beach of the west shore, associated with the first house, a large new one. I'd like to petition the DEC to have the south end of the lake, say the portion within the City of Ithaca, which does not allow firing guns, off limits to hunting. --Dave Nutter On Dec 29, 2013, at 08:47 PM, Anne Clark anneb.cl...@gmail.com wrote: It sounds as if some of these folks might be illegally close to buildings, although I suppose they argue that their guns are pointing down the lake. On the other hand, in the park area, trails and inlets make a complex problem for claiming that nothing could be in the line of fire when shooting at ducks flying in and over. Do they really stop firing when the ducks swing toward shore? Per the DEC hunting regulations Question: How far from a building do I have to be to discharge my firearm? Answer: You cannot discharge a firearm or bow within 500 feet of any school, playground, occupied factory or church. You cannot discharge a firearm or bow within 500 feet of a dwelling, farm building, or structure unless you own it, lease it, are an immediate member of the family, an employee, or have the owner's consent. This does not apply to the discharge of a shotgun over water when hunting migratory game birds and no dwelling, public structure, livestock, or person is in the line of fire. On Dec 29, 2013, at 5:07 PM, Kenneth V. Rosenberg wrote: I birded at East Shore Park on Saturday mid-day, and at Stewart Park this morning -- I must say that I have never seen so much hunting pressure at the south end of the lake. I want to say clearly that I am not against legal duck hunting in well managed areas (and I buy a Migratory Bird Stamp to support wetland conservation), but what is going on this year does not seem to be sustainable or an appropriate use of such a large public space. Boats with hunters and decoys were anchored right under the trees at the Swan Pen at Stewart Park, at the tip of the red lighthouse jetty, at the wooden buoy marker, on the beach at Hogs Hole, and along East Shore
