OT legal stuff
Does anyone know how it is best legally to record that a user clicked the check box I agree to the terms and privacy policy of this web site? Is it sufficient to just mark a field in a database and record the date time? Or is there a more official way of recording that they agreed to the terms? ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323394 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: OT legal stuff
Best thing you can do is store the data and time of the acceptance, plus a full copy of the terms they agreed to. If the TCs on the site change at any point you need to know which ones people agreed to, and whether they need to be asked to agree to new ones. This can be more or less important depending on the nature of the site but it's worth doing just in case. Toby On 12/06/2009, at 12:47 AM, Chad Gray wrote: Does anyone know how it is best legally to record that a user clicked the check box I agree to the terms and privacy policy of this web site? Is it sufficient to just mark a field in a database and record the date time? Or is there a more official way of recording that they agreed to the terms? ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323395 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: OT legal stuff
Does anyone know how it is best legally to record that a user clicked the check box I agree to the terms and privacy policy of this web site? I think you're over-complicating it. I mean, look at PayPal. When you sign up, there is a checkbox that says I agree to the terms. You can't create an account without checking it, so if they have an account, logically, they must have agreed to the terms. Just make a note of the time when the account was created. As for updates to the terms, I've never had to re-agree to their terms. The terms have a clause that say where updates will be posted, and how they will notify me (usually by a notice on their web site). As the user, it is my responsibility to keep up-to-date with the terms after they have notified me about a change. If I continue using the site after the new terms go into affect, then I implicitly agree to the updates. I once worked on a site once where they made this into a huge issue. A full copy of the terms were stored with every account, and any time they made any changes, the user had to be shown a new copy, agree to the new terms, have another full copy stored, etc. Instead of a checkbox, they had to type their name into a text box that was placed within a line that said something like, I, [text field], agree to the terms of service as listed above, yadda yadda... It was a nightmare and the users complained about it regularly. Don't make it more complicated than it needs to be unless you have a really compelling legal reason to do so (like, your site handles nuclear waste shipments or something). -Justin ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323396 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: OT legal stuff
In addition to what others have said - I always record their IP address that they were using at the time. This usually only come in handy if your legitimate users start flagging no-spam emails as spam in their AOL accounts. We have this happen all the time. A user signs up, checks yes to receive emails, creates a saved search that emails them when houses come on the market that match their search criteria and then flag it as spam. It's sort of a tripple opt in and they still managed to black list us at AOL. Only after we provided enough proof to AOL and showed them all the steps a user needs to go through to get emailed and then showed them the IP address the users were using when the signed up did AOL change us to the white list and figured out thier users were getting what tehy asked for. I can see other times for CYA purposes if you have to prove the end user computer was the one that was really used at time of agreement. Of course this does not work so well with proxies and dynamic IP's, but RIAA seems to have no problem with that part. ;-) In addition, leagally required really depends on the business your conducting. Retail sales maybe not as much is needed. An online bank would have piles of legal regulations to fulfill. If the terms of agreement are the same for every type of user then I don't see a need to store a copy for every user as one person said they did at one job. If the terms are different per user or user type then saving a copy becomes more important. Again this is business specific. Your best bet would be to contact your company lawyer (if they have one) and find out what they think would be required for the type of business your conducting. Wil Genovese Sr. Web Application Developer On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 10:03 AM, Justin Scott jscott-li...@gravityfree.com wrote: Does anyone know how it is best legally to record that a user clicked the check box I agree to the terms and privacy policy of this web site? I think you're over-complicating it. I mean, look at PayPal. When you sign up, there is a checkbox that says I agree to the terms. You can't create an account without checking it, so if they have an account, logically, they must have agreed to the terms. Just make a note of the time when the account was created. As for updates to the terms, I've never had to re-agree to their terms. The terms have a clause that say where updates will be posted, and how they will notify me (usually by a notice on their web site). As the user, it is my responsibility to keep up-to-date with the terms after they have notified me about a change. If I continue using the site after the new terms go into affect, then I implicitly agree to the updates. I once worked on a site once where they made this into a huge issue. A full copy of the terms were stored with every account, and any time they made any changes, the user had to be shown a new copy, agree to the new terms, have another full copy stored, etc. Instead of a checkbox, they had to type their name into a text box that was placed within a line that said something like, I, [text field], agree to the terms of service as listed above, yadda yadda... It was a nightmare and the users complained about it regularly. Don't make it more complicated than it needs to be unless you have a really compelling legal reason to do so (like, your site handles nuclear waste shipments or something). -Justin ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323400 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: OT legal stuff
I've had really paranoid customers who've had me add an open text field, where the customer was required to type out their full name and then check the I Agree box... Not sure it actually makes it anymore legally binding but it made my customer happy. I suppose every little thing you can add (within reason) gives you just a bit more proof that the end user meant to sign up for your service. =] -- Alan Rother Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion MX 7 Developer Manager, Phoenix Cold Fusion User Group, AZCFUG.org ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323401 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
RE: OT legal stuff
You might also force the user to type their initials or their name so that it's more than just a mouse click. -Original Message- From: Chad Gray [mailto:cg...@careyweb.com] Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2009 9:48 AM To: cf-talk Subject: OT legal stuff Does anyone know how it is best legally to record that a user clicked the check box I agree to the terms and privacy policy of this web site? Is it sufficient to just mark a field in a database and record the date time? Or is there a more official way of recording that they agreed to the terms? ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:323406 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: OT: Legal?
Bud Schneehagen Well said Schnee! Claude Schneegans ;-) [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings]
OT: Legal?
Ok, a client of mine has gone nuts. He is an agent for a few celebrities, and I had offered to create a site for one of his clients free-of-charge provided I was the one running the site. He has now decided to go to another designer, and wants me to give him the site, which as I said he has not paid for. Now, there is no written contract saying that I would do it for him free-of-charge, so I guess he has me there. But at the same time, since there is no contract saying I would do it free-of-charge, since he hasn't paid me, he is not entitled to the site. I told him if he wanted to pay me for the work, I would give it to him, but he keeps threatening me of legal action. Am I wrong here or is he really entitled to the site? Anyone know anything about the law in this case? Cedric [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings]
Re: OT: Legal?
Cedric - Had the same thing happen to me.The code is your intellectual property until YOU release it to the customer.My customer threaten legal action as well, when he didn't want to pay for.I responded by offering to have everything deleted from the server, and then he could go on his merry way.He then decided he would pay for. Not sure where you are, but legally, in the absence of a contract, he shouldn't have a legal basis to stand on.cfinsert check with a lawyer David Groth,Analyst/Programmer III Health Sciences Library Informatics Center MSC09 5100 1 University of New Mexico Albuquerque, New Mexico 87131-0001 Phone: 505.272.8406 / Fax: 505.272.5350 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/8/2003 12:01:07 PM Ok, a client of mine has gone nuts. He is an agent for a few celebrities, and I had offered to create a site for one of his clients free-of-charge provided I was the one running the site. He has now decided to go to another designer, and wants me to give him the site, which as I said he has not paid for. Now, there is no written contract saying that I would do it for him free-of-charge, so I guess he has me there. But at the same time, since there is no contract saying I would do it free-of-charge, since he hasn't paid me, he is not entitled to the site. I told him if he wanted to pay me for the work, I would give it to him, but he keeps threatening me of legal action. Am I wrong here or is he really entitled to the site? Anyone know anything about the law in this case? Cedric [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings]
Re: OT: Legal?
I don't know about the States, but here in Canada a verbal contract is still a contract. So if you tell you would develop for free provided you run the site yourself, HE is the one who breaks the contract. Now the question is WHERE the code is. If it is on a server he does not have acces to, HE will have to sue you, and with only a verbal contract, and especially that he didn't pay for anything, I think he better have a pretty good lawyer ;-/ [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings]
Re: OT: Legal?
Ok, a client of mine has gone nuts. He is an agent for a few celebrities, and I had offered to create a site for one of his clients free-of-charge provided I was the one running the site. He has now decided to go to another designer, and wants me to give him the site, which as I said he has not paid for. Now, there is no written contract saying that I would do it for him free-of-charge, so I guess he has me there. But at the same time, since there is no contract saying I would do it free-of-charge, since he hasn't paid me, he is not entitled to the site. I told him if he wanted to pay me for the work, I would give it to him, but he keeps threatening me of legal action. Am I wrong here or is he really entitled to the site? Anyone know anything about the law in this case? You had a verbal contract. Verbal contracts are legal. The verbal contract said the site was his as long as you are running/hosting it. You're no longer running/hosting it, so it's not his. He broke the contract. Now if he wants the site, you two can negotiate a new contract. Now that you've discovered this fellow's nature, the new contract should contain $$$, all of them up front. -- Bud Schneehagen - Tropical Web Creations, Inc. _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ Web Based Solutions / eCommerce Development Hosting http://www.twcreations.com/ - http://www.cf-ezcart.com/ Toll Free: 877.207.6397 - Local Int'l Phone/Fax: 386.789.0968 [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings]
