Re: Improving Clojure startup time with -Xbootclasspath
Very interesting tip! Also, like vimclojure, you can run nailgun ( http://martiansoftware.com/nailgun/background.html) locally or on your server via ssh. On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:07 AM, Alex Osborne a...@meshy.org wrote: We were discussing Clojure startup time (in the context of Leiningen) and Phil Hagelberg asked some JRuby people about startup time. They suggested using -Xbootclasspath. Check this out: % time (echo | java -client -cp clojure.jar clojure.main) 0.84s user 0.04s system 96% cpu 0.908 total % time (echo | java -client -Xbootclasspath/a:clojure.jar clojure.main) 0.42s user 0.04s system 106% cpu 0.431 total For the server VM: % time (echo | java -server -cp clojure.jar clojure.main) 1.07s user 0.06s system 113% cpu 0.995 total % time (echo | java -server -Xbootclasspath/a:clojure.jar clojure.main) 0.56s user 0.06s system 109% cpu 0.562 total For reference: % java -version java version 1.6.0_16 Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_16-b01) Java HotSpot(TM) Server VM (build 14.2-b01, mixed mode) Apparently on Dan Larkin's PC startup time went from a terrible 5.5s to a more bearable 1.9s. Looks like it's problematic to put Clojure libs in the bootclasspath though. I get an NPE: Caused by: java.lang.NullPointerException at clojure.lang.RT.load(RT.java:377) at clojure.lang.RT.load(RT.java:371) Which is this line from RT.java: URL classURL = baseLoader().getResource(classfile); (clojure.lang.RT/baseLoader) isn't null, so I'm not sure what the deal is with that unless the class loading runs in a different thread where it is null or something. But if you just put the Clojure jar itself in -Xbootclasspath and the rest of your libs as normal -cp you still get a nice fast start. :-) Charles Nutter has a nice list of JVM flags here: http://blog.headius.com/2009/01/my-favorite-hotspot-jvm-flags.html I don't get much of a benefit out of -XShare on my system but it might be worth trying as well. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comclojure%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: AOT'd namespaces lose their metadata
2009/11/23 Phil Hagelberg p...@hagelb.org: I noticed an odd bug when working on the help command for leiningen. It uses docstrings on metadata for help output, but when AOTing the project, the docstrings (as well as all other metadata) would be lost. Note that this doesn't happen when metadata is added to the namespace after the fact as is the case with clojure.core and alter-meta!. Any idea what might be causing this? I'd like to dig deeper but am unsure where to look. There's a ticket for it https://www.assembla.com/spaces/clojure/tickets/130-Namespace-metadata-lost-in-AOT-compile but I don't think anyone's spent any time in trying to fix it. thanks, Phil -- ! Lauri -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Holding onto your head step functions -- confusion
Scratch this question. I think I've figured out that the step function in some people's code is there for aesthetic reasons only. As long as the step function contains the same code as would otherwise go directly inside the (lazy-seq ... ) there's no difference. That is, (let [step (fn [a b] stuff)] (lazy-seq (step a b))) is the same as (lazy-seq stuff) The lazy documentation on the web site had made me think there was something special about the former, i.e. the compiler was optimizing it in some special way. Someone please correct me if I'm still confused. On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Garth Sheldon-Coulson g...@mit.edu wrote: Hi All, I'll confused about the hold-onto-your-head business when building lazy seqs using lazy-seq. The lazier documentation on the web site doesn't really clear things up for me, though I've read it a few times. Under what circumstances must one use a step function, and under what circumstances it it acceptable not to? If this is covered in depth somewhere other than the lazier page please feel free just to send a link. As a point of discussion, does the following function have the potential to cause memory problems? Some notes: *kernel* and *options* are dynamic vars I want the lazy-seq to close over. parse-simple-atom is a function for parsing each element (atom, **unrelated to Clojure atoms**) of the coll. type is an arg that is used in the parsing of each element of the coll. (defn parse-expr-coll-to-lazy-seq [coll type] (let [kernel *kernel* options *options*] (lazy-seq (binding [*kernel* kernel *options* options] (when-let [s (seq coll)] (cons (parse-simple-atom (first s) type) (parse-expr-coll-to-lazy-seq (rest s) type))) Thanks, Garth -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: leiningen - a Clojure build tool
Leiningen and Clojar are LEGEN... wait for it... DARY! Anyways, just wanted to say thanks. On Nov 19, 1:23 pm, Alex Osborne a...@meshy.org wrote: meb wrote: Was the name Leiningen inspired by the Esquire short story Leiningen vs. Ants? That would be a brilliantly obscure way to challenge the predominance of ant. Or did you have another reference in mind. From the Leiningen README: Leiningen! he shouted. You're insane! They're not creatures you can fight--they're an elemental--an 'act of God!' Ten miles long, two miles wide--ants, nothing but ants! And every single one of them a fiend from hell... -- from Leiningen Versus the Ants by Carl Stephenson For those who haven't heard of it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leiningen_Versus_the_Ants The story seems to be online in various places, like this one: http://www.americanliterature.com/Stephenson/SS/LeiningenVersustheAnt... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Datatypes and Protocols - early experience program
On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Krukow karl.kru...@gmail.com wrote:
On Nov 19, 12:01 am, samppi rbysam...@gmail.com wrote:
Question: are the general mechanisms for accessing and setting fields
their keywords and assoc respectively:
(deftype Bar [a b c d e])
(def b (Bar 1 2 3 4 5))
(:c b)
(def c (assoc b :e 2))
Does (:c b) and (assoc b :e 2) take advantage of Bar's field
information? Is it any faster than using an array map? Are there any
equivalents to struct maps' accessor functions?
I've been wondering about this myself. I think you'd often want a
persistent types in the sense of the persistent datastructure.
You can use the ability to implement interfaces, specifically
automatic support for IPersistentMap:
ser= (deftype Bar [a b] [clojure.lang.IPersistentMap])
#'user/Bar
user= (assoc (Bar 1 2) :a 42)
#:Bar{:a 42, :b 2}
user=
I have a question here, though: what is this?
ser= (assoc (Bar 1 2) :c 42)
#:Bar{:a 1, :b 2, :c 42}
user= #:Bar{:a 1, :b 2, :c 42}
Is it a Bar with field-speed access to :a and :b and map-speed
access to :c?
Yes.
Also can I assume that
(assoc (Bar 1 2) :a 42)
#:Bar{:a 42, :b 2}
will share structure with the (Bar 1 2) and still has fast access
to :a? Is the assoc function using that :a is a field?
Shared structure only kicks in when data structures become large
enough for it to be a performance advantage. That's not the case for
small maps or the fixed fields of a deftype.
I guess I am just asking if the performance guarantees are those I
would expect of Clojure (i.e., too fast ;-))
Yup. The fixed field access to deftypes via keyword literal lookup is
the fastest offered by any Clojure data structure.
Rich
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making rlwrap Clojure friendly
Hi, has anybody tried to make rlwrap lexer more Clojure friendly? Just adding - to the word characters would be a big gain (to enjoy auto-completion.) I spent some time looking through rlwrap sources but has not find a good place to do the changes. Regards, Sergey. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: making rlwrap Clojure friendly
Probably it can be done with Rlwrap filters, I have not tried it yet. On Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 2:30 PM, Sergey Didenko sergey.dide...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, has anybody tried to make rlwrap lexer more Clojure friendly? Just adding - to the word characters would be a big gain (to enjoy auto-completion.) I spent some time looking through rlwrap sources but has not find a good place to do the changes. Regards, Sergey. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Hi, Am 21.11.2009 um 05:22 schrieb Mark Engelberg: Which reminds me, every once in a while I see people talking about this here, and brainstorming up some alternatives to binding that might interact better with lazy data structures. Has there been any real progress on this, or has every proposed solution been equally problematic? I wrote up a little blog post on the problem and the possible solutions. Feedback welcome. http://kotka.de/blog/clojure/Taming_the_Bound_Seq.html Sincerely Meikel smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Does a standard function exist that acts like assoc except it applies fns to vals
Hi, Am 22.11.2009 um 22:32 schrieb samppi: (defn vary [coll keys-and-fns] (let [fn-map (apply arrray-map keys-and-fns) keys-and-vals (mapcat #((val %) (get coll (key %))) fn-map)] (apply assoc-args coll keys-and-vals))) As Jon said: update-in. (- coll (update-in [:x] fn-x) (update-in [:y] fn-y)) Sincerely Meikel smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Improving Clojure startup time with -Xbootclasspath
Hi, On Nov 23, 9:57 am, Dmitry Ulanov dula...@gmail.com wrote: Very interesting tip! Also, like vimclojure, you can run nailgun (http://martiansoftware.com/nailgun/background.html) locally or on your server via ssh. I'd also like to mention clj-server: http://github.com/Neronus/clj-server. Sincerely Meikel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
initialization of clojure.contrib.logging library
Hello all I have one question about logging library from contrib? How i can configure it to write data into log files? P.S. I'm not Java developer, and may be don't know many of java's logging tricks -- With best wishes, Alex Ott, MBA http://alexott.blogspot.com/http://xtalk.msk.su/~ott/ http://alexott-ru.blogspot.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Datatypes and Protocols - early experience program
On Nov 20, 5:24 pm, Rich Hickey richhic...@gmail.com wrote: Yup. The fixed field access to deftypes via keyword literal lookup is the fastest offered by any Clojure data structure. Rich While we are talking performance. Is there a simple way to explain the performance characteristics of protocols versus interfaces? /Karl -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: leiningen - a Clojure build tool
On Nov 18, 8:29 am, Phil Hagelberg p...@hagelb.org wrote: I'm pleased to announce the initial release of Leiningen. Leiningen is a build tool for Clojure designed to not set your hair on fire. I really like it so far - particularly the combination of lein and clojars! I'm not sure if this is the place for questions and/or bug-reports, perhaps lein should have its own group? Anyway, here is my situation. I have a project I want to push to clojars using lein. The project depends on the newest version of clojure in the new branch - i.e. commit 75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63 in http://github.com/richhickey/clojure/tree/new I created a clojar in my group: [org.clojars.krukow/clojure-1.1.0-alpha-snapshot 75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63] and for my project which depends on this jar i created a project.clj: (defproject org.clojars.krukow/circuit-breaker 0.1 :dependencies [[org.clojars.krukow/clojure-1.1.0-alpha-snapshot 75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63]]) I ran deps: krukow:~/Projects/clojure/circuitbreaker$ lein deps [copy] Copying 1 file to /Users/krukow/Projects/clojure/ circuitbreaker/lib krukow:~/Projects/clojure/circuitbreaker$ ls lib/ clojure-1.1.0-alpha- snapshot-75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63.jar krukow:~/Projects/clojure/circuitbreaker$ But now all lein commands fail. E.g, krukow:~/Projects/clojure/circuitbreaker$ lein help Exception in thread main java.lang.ExceptionInInitializerError at java.lang.Class.forName0(Native Method) at java.lang.Class.forName(Class.java:247) at clojure.lang.RT.loadClassForName(RT.java:1516) at clojure.lang.RT.load(RT.java:389) at clojure.lang.RT.load(RT.java:371) ... I suspect it is because I've put another version of clojure on the classpath. Any advice on how to do projects that depend on specific versions of clojure? /Karl -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Datatypes and Protocols - early experience program
On Nov 12, 1:10 pm, Rich Hickey richhic...@gmail.com wrote:
An early version of the code for a few important new language
features, datatypes[1] and protocols[2] is now available in the 'new'
branch[3]. Note also that the build system[4] has builds of the new
branch, and that the new branch works with current contrib.
If you have the time and inclination, please try them out. Feedback is
particularly welcome as they are being refined.
Thanks,
Rich
I've had very good experiences so far - I really like the modeling
aspects of this.
Two comments.
First is a bug.
Using newest commit of new: 75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user= (deftype Foo [x])
#'user/Foo
user= (defprotocol P (fun [x]))
P
user= (extend ::Foo P {:fun (fn [x] x)})
nil
user= (fun (Foo 42))
#:Foo{:x 42}
user= (def f1 (Foo 42))
#'user/f1
user= f1
#:Foo{:x 42}
user= (def f2 (fun f1))
java.lang.IllegalAccessError (NO_SOURCE_FILE:7)
user=
The error occurs if I try to bind the result of a protocol function to
a var.
Second is a feature request:
Map-based initializers and Default values for deftype.
Example:
user= (deftype TransitionPolicy [fail-count timeout])
#'user/TransitionPolicy
user= (def p (TransitionPolicy {:fail-count 5 :timeout 5000}))
;; I'd like
'user/p
user= p
#:TransitionPolicy{:fail-count 5, :timeout 5000}
user=
Now defaults:
user= (deftype TransitionPolicy [fail-count :def 5 timeout :def
5000])
;;I'd like
#'user/TransitionPolicy
user= (TransitionPolicy :fail-count 5)
#:TransitionPolicy{:fail-count {:fail-count 10}, :timeout 5000}
user= (TransitionPolicy)
#:TransitionPolicy{:fail-count 5, :timeout 5000}
I know I can easily construct functions that realize these maps and
default initializers, but it would be nice to have Out-of-the-box if
it doesn't complicate the design.
Cheers,
/Karl
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Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
On Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 4:37 PM, Meikel Brandmeyer m...@kotka.de wrote: Hi, Am 21.11.2009 um 05:22 schrieb Mark Engelberg: Which reminds me, every once in a while I see people talking about this here, and brainstorming up some alternatives to binding that might interact better with lazy data structures. Has there been any real progress on this, or has every proposed solution been equally problematic? I wrote up a little blog post on the problem and the possible solutions. Feedback welcome. http://kotka.de/blog/clojure/Taming_the_Bound_Seq.html That's excellent Meikel, thanks. Any reson you didn't use the with-bindings macro to make your final example a bit simpler? --Chouser -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: making rlwrap Clojure friendly
On Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 7:30 AM, Sergey Didenko
sergey.dide...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
has anybody tried to make rlwrap lexer more Clojure friendly? Just
adding - to the word characters would be a big gain (to enjoy
auto-completion.)
I spent some time looking through rlwrap sources but has not find a
good place to do the changes.
The shell script I use to start my Clojure REPLs includes this:
rlwrap --remember --complete-filenames \
--history-filename ~/.clojure/history \
--break-chars \\\'(){}[],^%$#@;:| \
java and its startup args here
I'm sure it's imperfect, but works well enough for me.
--Chouser
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Re: Mysterious errors w/ protocols and types
On Nov 23, 7:36 am, samppi rbysam...@gmail.com wrote:
The following code contains an error, and I cannot figure out what it
is at all. When I run StateMeta's test once, the statement marked with
a comment above fails. When I run it again, it succeeds. This has been
causing very weird bugs in my code. I've replicated the behavior in
both a script and the REPL. Here's the bugged code:
[snip]
I recommend that you try and find a minimal version of a program that
exhibits the bug. This makes it so much easier to fix quickly. In your
case, it looks like the combination of varargs and protocol functions:
krukow:~/emacs/clojure/clojure$ rlwrap java -cp
clojure-1.1.0-75cd05080f7260c54007d7728fb280ae53b56f63.jar
clojure.main
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user= (defprotocol P (foo [x args]))
P
user= (deftype T [x])
#'user/T
user= (extend ::T P {:foo (fn [x args] args)})
nil
user= (foo (T 42) 1 2 3)
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user=
Perhaps varargs isn't supported yet?
/Karl
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Re: Improving Clojure startup time with -Xbootclasspath
I added the contrib lib expecting it to fail but it worked, and loaded
(in half the usual time) some code from the user.clj as well:
java -Xbootclasspath/a:clojure\clojure.jar;clojure-contrib\clojure-contrib.jar
clojure.main
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user=
I had been reading in this paper:
http://www.tedneward.com/files/Papers/BootClasspath/BootClasspath.pdf
about the case below and how that could explain the NPE, but when I
added the lib to see it, the thing worked.
public class NewObjectLoader {
public static void main (String args[]) {
NewObject no = new NewObject();
System.out.println(
no.getClass().getName() + was loaded by +
no.getClass().getClassLoader());
}
}
Sure enough, the NewObject class is not only found at compile-time and
runtime, but it prints
NewObject was loaded by null, indicating it owes its existence to
the bootstrap ClassLoader.
Running on Vista
java -version
java version 1.6.0_13
Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_13-b03)
Java HotSpot(TM) Client VM (build 11.3-b02, mixed mode, sharing)
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Re: Performance tuning for a simple SLE solver
I replaced the calls to get-in with a my-get-in macro that compiled them to nested calls on the map or vector: (my-get-in sle [:A 1 2]) = (((sle :A) 1) 2) The form (data key) seems to be about 10 to 15 times faster than the equivalent (get-in data [key]) on my laptop. It cut the runtime in half or so. I would think that floating point operations might be faster, too. On Oct 9, 6:38 am, andi.xeno...@googlemail.com andi.xeno...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi, I'm new to Clojure, and let me first say that I love it! At least I love the language, but I have some concerns regarding performance: My first try was to implement a Gauß elemination algorithm for solving a system of linear equations. Here is the code: http://www.xenoage.com/extern/zongblog/matrix.clj Solving 1.000.000 SLEs (see last line) took 33.000 ms on my machine, while the corresponding algorithm written in Java needed less than 300 ms. Since I am a Java programmer and I have no experience in functional programming, I probably have to apologize for the bad code. Anyway, I already tried to make it faster using the well-known performance tips (like type hints), but they did not really help (ok, 25.000 ms instead of 33.000, but it is still too much). What are my options? - Can you identify problems in my code? I do not mean things that make it 10% faster, but at least double as fast. - Could you say, that Clojure is not made for such numerical things, and I should use Java code for these performance-critical algorithms? (would be perfectly ok for me) - Should I try it in Clojure, but using a (mutable) Java array instead (also ok for me, since this mutable structure is only used locally and within a single thread) Any ideas? Thanks in advance :-) Andi -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Mysterious errors w/ protocols and types
Variable-length arguments in protocols seem to be supported, but
there's just a weird, stateful behavior. Look what happens when you
call foo first with one argument twice (it fails both times), then two
arguments (it succeeds), then one argument again (it succeeds now
too!). Is this a Clojure bug?
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user= (defprotocol P (foo [x args]))
P
user= (deftype T [x])
#'user/T
user= (extend ::T P {:foo (fn [x args] args)})
nil
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42) 1 2)
(1 2)
user= (foo (T 42))
nil
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Re: Clojure Terracotta - TIM
Hi Paul, This time I tested it under Linux, following the instructions exactly and it worked. Though when I opened the second REPL it failed with a NullPointerException. I repeated the step and had two REPLs with the same vars. For some reason it failed earlier on Windows, I will try to make it work there. Yes, I can try to help. Feel free to write me. Actually, I would like to try Clojure + Terracotta as a data layer for my Java app, so I'm more interested in adapting the changes to the latest Clojure codebase and tuning Terracotta interaction. I saw autolocking in config and now thinking how bad that can be. I will study your google document and the changes to Clojure classes to understand the TIM better. P.S. (svn rev. 1335 + the new tim-clojure) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
PersistentStructMap Exception
Hi, I'm getting a cast exception on trying to create a simple structure and wondered if there was something obvious that I'm not doing. The transcript below shows my version of java. Running on Mac Book Pro, Snow Leopard 5.6.1 bash-3.2$ java -version java version 1.6.0_15 Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_15-b03-219) Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (build 14.1-b02-90, mixed mode) bash-3.2$ java -cp clojure-1.0.0.jar clojure.lang.Repl Clojure 1.0.0- user= (defstruct s1 :a :b) #'user/s1 user= (s1 1 2) java.lang.ClassCastException: clojure.lang.PersistentStructMap$Def cannot be cast to clojure.lang.IFn (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0) Thanks -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: making rlwrap Clojure friendly
So simple :) Thanks!
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:47 PM, Chouser chou...@gmail.com wrote:
The shell script I use to start my Clojure REPLs includes this:
rlwrap --remember --complete-filenames \
--history-filename ~/.clojure/history \
--break-chars \\\'(){}[],^%$#@;:| \
java and its startup args here
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Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Hi, On Nov 23, 3:36 pm, Chouser chou...@gmail.com wrote: http://kotka.de/blog/clojure/Taming_the_Bound_Seq.html That's excellent Meikel, thanks. Any reson you didn't use the with-bindings macro to make your final example a bit simpler? Woops. The reason might be the time of day (23 o'clock after getting up on 5:30 in the morning). I simply forgot about with-bindings. :( I will update the post tonight. Maybe I'll also show a more detailed example for bound-fn. Sincerely Meikel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Hi, On Nov 23, 3:32 pm, nchubrich nicholas.chubr...@gmail.com wrote: Meikel, is get-thread-bindings only in a development version of Clojure? I have 1.09.11 and don't see it documented or usable (or in the online docs). I'm not sure what 1.09.11 means, but the following commits added push-/ pop-/get-thread-bindings as wells as with-bindings and bound-fn. thread-bindings interface: http://github.com/richhickey/clojure/commit/110b9c2eb8a128d837e6e620efc7e1c4e33feb82 with-bindings and bound-fn: http://github.com/richhickey/clojure/commit/fbacc4a5751fa5c15baa599b5a058cd81b05a247 Sincerely Meikel -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Mysterious errors w/ protocols and types
On Nov 23, 11:36 am, samppi rbysam...@gmail.com wrote:
Variable-length arguments in protocols seem to be supported, but
there's just a weird, stateful behavior. Look what happens when you
call foo first with one argument twice (it fails both times), then two
arguments (it succeeds), then one argument again (it succeeds now
too!). Is this a Clojure bug?
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user= (defprotocol P (foo [x args]))
P
user= (deftype T [x])
#'user/T
user= (extend ::T P {:foo (fn [x args] args)})
nil
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42) 1 2)
(1 2)
user= (foo (T 42))
nil
Varargs in protocols are not yet supported.
Rich
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Feedback for a visitor closure generator
Multimethods are a great abstraction in Clojure. They are great for
adapting a wide variety of inputs to a function. However, I often
need to decouple the adaptation of data from the function that
operates on the adapted data. Also, after the work is complete, I
need to adapt the data back to the original format.
As such, I've found the need to create visitor closures in my code.
Along the way I came up with a helper function to generate visitor
closures. I'd like feedback on the visitor generator.
* Getting Motivated: String functions *
I write the following code a lot to deal with keywords symbols:
(keyword (some-str-fn (name a-keyword) str-fn-args))
(symbol (some-str-fn (name a-symbol ) str-fn-args))
Each of these can be abstracted out as
(defn visit-keyword
[str-fn a-keyword args]
(keyword
(apply str-fn (name a-keyword) args)))
(defn visit-symbol
[str-fn a-symbol args]
(symbol
(apply str-fn (name a-symbol ) args)))
So, the code is now called as follows
(visit-keyword str-fn a-keyword args)
(visit-symbol str-fn a-symbol args)
This is one possible implementation of a visitor patter for symbols,
keywords strings.
* More Problems: Map Functions *
It's common to filter on values or keys when working with maps. I've
written a lot of code like this:
;keys
(into {} (some-pred-fn (comp a-pred key) map-fn-args))
;values
(into {} (some-pred-fn (comp a-pred val) map-fn-args))
A first approach would be to write specific helper function for each
case. However, this can be turned into a visitor as well.
(defn visitor-keys-pred
[pred-fn pred-arg args]
(into {}
(apply pred-fn (#(comp % key) pred-arg)
args)))
(defn visitor-vals-pred
[pred-fn pred-arg args]
(into {}
(apply pred-fn (#(comp % val) pred-arg)
args)))
The definition looks a little funky, but we'll see why in a minute.
For now the functions can be called as follows:
(visitor-keys-pred pred-fn pred-arg args)
(visitor-vals-pred pred-fn pred-arg args)
* Putting it together: Visitor Closures *
As you can see, a pattern is starting to develop. Each visitor
function has a similar signature:
[f first-arg rest-args]
This obviously becomes
[f args]
Each visitor follows a similar pattern, too.
1. Apply a visit-fn to get to a common base type
2. Do work on the base type
3. Apply a return-fn to get back to the original type.
We can turn this description into a closure generating function:
(defn visitor
Used to implement visitor patterns. (first (args)) is modified by
the visitor function, and the result is wrapped in a return-fn call.
[visit-fn return-fn]
(fn [f args]
(return-fn
(apply f
(visit-fn (first args))
(rest args)
We now have a new way to define previous visitor functions. Here's
what they look like using this new helper function:
(def visit-keyword (visitor name keyword))
(def visit-symbol (visitor name symbol ))
;Works w/ predicate functions
(def visit-keys-pred (visitor #(comp % key) (partial into {}))
(def visit-vals-pred (visitor #(comp % val) (partial into {}))
As you can see, the only thing we described is the visit-fn and return-
fn. The rest of the behavior is defined by the visitor pattern
itself.
* Second form *
The one catch is that visitor assumes that the dispatched data is the
first argument to f. Sometimes it is the last argument to f, as in
take drop. It is easy enough to define visitor* that works on the
last argument of a function. The definition is in the link.
http://gist.github.com/241144
* Back to Multimethods *
The power of the individual closures can be amplified when wrapped in
a multimethod. Consider our String/Symbol/Keyword group.
(defmulti visit-string (fn [ args] (second args))
(defmethod visit-string clojure.lang.Symbol
[f args]
(apply visit-symbol f args))
(defmethod visit-string clojure.lang.Keyword
[f args]
(apply visit-keyword f args))
(defmethod visit-string :default
[f args]
(apply f args))
We now have a visit-string function that can truly visit anything.
Our function calls above become:
(visit-string str-fn a-keyword args)
(visit-string str-fn a-symbol args)
* Closing questions *
So now that you've how why this works, I've got some questions for
the group:
* Did I accidentally duplicate functionality in core?
* How can this be more flexible?
* What maintenance problems are there that I don't see?
* Will speed be an issue?
* Is the signature of visitor sensible? Is the signature of the
generated function sensible? How could it be better?
Thanks in advance,
Sean
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Re: Mysterious errors w/ protocols and types
I see; then that of course would be the reason. Thanks for the answer.
On Nov 23, 12:24 pm, Rich Hickey richhic...@gmail.com wrote:
On Nov 23, 11:36 am, samppi rbysam...@gmail.com wrote:
Variable-length arguments in protocols seem to be supported, but
there's just a weird, stateful behavior. Look what happens when you
call foo first with one argument twice (it fails both times), then two
arguments (it succeeds), then one argument again (it succeeds now
too!). Is this a Clojure bug?
Clojure 1.1.0-alpha-SNAPSHOT
user= (defprotocol P (foo [x args]))
P
user= (deftype T [x])
#'user/T
user= (extend ::T P {:foo (fn [x args] args)})
nil
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42))
java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Wrong number of args passed to:
user$eval--12$fn--14$G--1 (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
user= (foo (T 42) 1 2)
(1 2)
user= (foo (T 42))
nil
Varargs in protocols are not yet supported.
Rich
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Re: initialization of clojure.contrib.logging library
The c.c.logging library delegates to an underlying implementation, thus for any configuration help you'll need to check the documentation of the actual logging system, e.g., log4j. On Nov 21, 7:21 am, Alex Ott alex...@gmail.com wrote: Hello all I have one question about logging library from contrib? How i can configure it to write data into log files? P.S. I'm not Java developer, and may be don't know many of java's logging tricks -- With best wishes, Alex Ott, MBAhttp://alexott.blogspot.com/ http://xtalk.msk.su/~ott/http://alexott-ru.blogspot.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Monad problems: finding an m-zero
On 22 Nov 2009, at 22:06, samppi wrote: Yes, I see. I'm going to guess that the parser-m that I give above has no possible m-zero, so I think I'll have to rethink how I'm going to approach this problem. I probably am going to just define failure in another way. (The reason why I can't use nil is because I need to store metadata on the object representing failure. I'm sure I'll figure something out.) Thanks for your help. Using another value than nil (e.g. a keyword) is doable: (state-t (maybe-t identity-m ::failure)) instead of (state-t maybe-m) However, it seems to me (after a quick look at your initial message) that you want m-zero to be a pair containing a keyword plus a state value. That is not possible because m-zero has to be a constant. You can't pack additional information on m-zero. Using metadata on m-zero looks risky as well (but I didn't think it through to the end) because metadata is easily lost in operations that don't expect it to be there. Konrad. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Monad problems: finding an m-zero
On 22 Nov 2009, at 22:10, John Harrop wrote: Is there an explanation of monads out there that doesn't require the reader to know Haskell to understand it? One that's generic to any FP-capable language? Nothing I know of; you need some syntax if only for the examples. Moreover, there are some fundamental differences to implementing monads in static and dynamically typed languages. There are two monad tutorials for Clojure programmers: [http://onclojure.com/2009/03/05/a-monad-tutorial-for-clojure-programmers-part-1/ Monad tutorial part 1] [http://onclojure.com/2009/03/06/a-monad-tutorial-for-clojure-programmers-part-2/ Monad tutorial part 2] [http://onclojure.com/2009/03/23/a-monad-tutorial-for-clojure-programmers-part-3/ Monad tutorial part 3] [http://onclojure.com/2009/04/24/a-monad-tutorial-for-clojure-programmers-part-4/ Monad tutorial part 4] [http://intensivesystems.net/tutorials/monads_101.html; Monads in Clojure part 1] [http://intensivesystems.net/tutorials/monads_201.html; Monads in Clojure part 2]] Konrad. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Oh, yeah, transients are fast!
i have tried: 1.5 1.6 1.6 -server the last i did both in repl-in-emacs, and in a repl-in-straightup-shell. the numbers i get are weird. it does seem like v2 is faster than v, but never gets stupendously fast (never faster than 500 msec on a dual core macbook pro 2.2ghz core 2 duo 4gb ram), and v does a strange thing where i run v2 a bunch then the first time i run v it is like 2x v2, and then subsequent runs of timing v are like 8x v2. and here i thought hotspot was supposed to get faster, not slower, over time. oy veh. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Clojure User Survey, preparation for 1.1
If you have trouble viewing or submitting this form, you can fill it out online: http://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=dFJSd1p4YXh0d0VxV0xjdk42MTU5RkE6MA Clojure User Survey This user survey will help move Clojure toward an official 1.1 release. How do you get Clojure? * Download release Github Maven or Ivy What distribution of Clojure do you use primarily? * 1.0 release I picked one development snapshot and stuck with it I use the latest development snapshot I follow Github master branch I follow Github new branch What about chunked sequences? * I don't know what they are The help me They hurt me I don't notice any difference Powered by Google Docs Report Abuse - Terms of Service - Additional Terms -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Deep deref
Hi,
Andre, Danny's first approach is about syncing only on the root
object, so that every piece of data is behind one deref:
(def root (ref {:persons [ ... no other refs here... ]))
This approach is simpler to code but can lead to a lot of retried
transactions under heavy concurrent load, as I understand.
What about making all derefs that you need inside one transaction?
There are words somewhere in docs that you need dosync if you perform
a few reads that must be consistent. I think this is what you need.
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Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Chris, Graham, Am 23.11.2009 um 21:21 schrieb Graham Fawcett: Very nice. A generalized version might be more useful to your readers: take an input seq, and return an output seq which is evaluated stepwise in the binding environment. Thank you for your good comments. I updated the post with a bound-seq helper, which turns any given lazy input sequence into a bound sequence. The environment might be chosen manually in the style of binding. Or alternatively get-thread-bindings captures the whole environment. http://kotka.de/blog/clojure/Taming_the_Bound_Seq.html Sincerely Meikel smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Deep deref
BTW I'm also coding the simple persistence for Clojure data structures. Though I took Prevayler approach (http://prevayler.org), so I journal function calls that change my root object. This approach is better than simple snapshotting when your data grows big, so you can't do the snapshots very often but do not want to lose a lot of the latest changes. Making snapshots are easy to implement after this, if data objects reference each other only one time or through ids. I guess it would be a simple traversal of the root object. I plan to make this persistence code public if anyone is interested. Though I'm not moving very fast, I'm learning Clojure at the same time. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Deep deref
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 22:46, Sergey Didenko sergey.dide...@gmail.com wrote: BTW I'm also coding the simple persistence for Clojure data structures. Though I took Prevayler approach (http://prevayler.org), so I journal function calls that change my root object. This approach is better than simple snapshotting when your data grows big, so you can't do the snapshots very often but do not want to lose a lot of the latest changes. Making snapshots are easy to implement after this, if data objects reference each other only one time or through ids. I guess it would be a simple traversal of the root object. I plan to make this persistence code public if anyone is interested. Though I'm not moving very fast, I'm learning Clojure at the same time. Yeah it would be cool to look at it. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Deep deref
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:34 PM, Sergey Didenko sergey.dide...@gmail.comwrote:
Hi,
Andre, Danny's first approach is about syncing only on the root
object, so that every piece of data is behind one deref:
(def root (ref {:persons [ ... no other refs here... ]))
This approach is simpler to code but can lead to a lot of retried
transactions under heavy concurrent load, as I understand.
What about making all derefs that you need inside one transaction?
There are words somewhere in docs that you need dosync if you perform
a few reads that must be consistent. I think this is what you need.
I'm starting to think that for some tasks Clojure could use a concept of
row locking with maps. It would mean having a map-of-refs type that was
integrated with the STM, so multiple updates whose keys didn't collide could
occur concurrently.
It *might* be possible to do this using commute and update-in, with a ref
wrapping the whole map. The tricky thing is you want the update-ins to
commute if the keys are not the same, but not if they are. Perhaps we need a
conditional commute that takes two extra arguments, a value to test and a
binary predicate. Then it could be done with (conditional-commute key = map
update-in [key] val-transform-fn).
The idea here being, in this case, that if two of these were done in
overlapping transactions, the first arguments would be compared using the
second argument. If the result was true one transaction would be retried, if
false the operations would commute. (If the second arguments to the two
conditional-commutes differed the transaction would be retried.)
I think adding conditional commute would require changes to core, however.
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roll call of production use?
hi, i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. i know of some, as some folks have been vocal; any other interesting-but-so-far-silent uses people'd be willing to fess up about? many thanks. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 03:00:16PM -0800, Raoul Duke wrote: i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. i know of some, as some folks have been vocal; any other interesting-but-so-far-silent uses people'd be willing to fess up about? I've thrown together a small clojure program to present an internal dashboard of active projects and states and stuff. Having the JVM was invaluable, since I could easily make postgreSQL queries as well as use JGit to walk the history of a git repository. I've mentioned this before, but http://github.com/d3zd3z/webweight is a small program I wrote to learn compojure. One significant part is that I've written an org.davidb.contrib.html and xml that wrap around the same data structure used by clojure.xml. It allows for easier construction of html/xml in code: (html/table :border 1 (html/tr (html/td :valign top Cell) ..)) I also wrote an html/xml emitter that uses ones from the standard Java libraries, since the one in clojure.xml doesn't actually generate valid xml. The other interesting part of webweight is that the build.xml and the ivy and files under etc are sufficient to build most Clojure projects. It's similar to the idea behind Leiningen, but it will also build Java and native code into the project as well. The production webpage is internal, and has a lot more data on it, but I've captured and scrubbed a snapshot http://www.davidb.org/dashboard/sample.html I was able to throw the whole thing together in just a couple of days using Clojure. I haven't really felt this productive writing code since using Common Lisp. David -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: leiningen - a Clojure build tool
Krukow karl.kru...@gmail.com writes: On Nov 18, 8:29 am, Phil Hagelberg p...@hagelb.org wrote: I'm pleased to announce the initial release of Leiningen. Leiningen is a build tool for Clojure designed to not set your hair on fire. I really like it so far - particularly the combination of lein and clojars! I'm not sure if this is the place for questions and/or bug-reports, perhaps lein should have its own group? We hadn't gotten around to really telling anyone yet, but there is in fact a Leiningen group: http://groups.google.com/group/leiningen There's also a #leiningen channel on irc.freenode.org. I suspect it is because I've put another version of clojure on the classpath. Any advice on how to do projects that depend on specific versions of clojure? I'm afraid that you can't just yet, but we're working on it. The problem is compilation currently happens in the same JVM as Leiningen itself runs. Compiling in a separate process or classloader is a planned Lein 1.0 feature and should fix this up. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Would it be possible to create an implementation of delay and lazy-seq that didn't use fn to delay evaluation, or atleast captured dynamic variables? (delay (+ x 3)) reasonable semantics in current clojure (let [x x] (delay (+ x 3))) (delay (fn [y] (+ x y))) semantics should be the same it already is (x should get it's value from the dynamic binding) (delay [x (fn [y] (+ x y))]) semantics should be (let [G_N x] (delay [G_N (fn [y] (+ x y))])), so all captured variables would need renaming using gensyms. delay would need it's body macroexpanded code to be able to correctly capture variables. It would also try to capture local variables, but that wouldn't change the semantics and would probably be optimized away by the compiler. I might have missed some important detail, since dynamic binding and lazyness have such a peculiar semantics interaction, but it would yield much more reasoanable execution, wouldn't it? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 00:00, Raoul Duke rao...@gmail.com wrote: hi, i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. i know of some, as some folks have been vocal; any other interesting-but-so-far-silent uses people'd be willing to fess up about? many thanks. I use Clojure for web crawling / scraping of certain services with storing extracted data in a custom database. I could marry existing Java libs with an excellent xml/html walking via zippers; and could test it in REPL which is a pleasure to use. After finishing a prototype it became a valid production version which Just Works in a near-zero time. Ah, and I eradicated many bugs early by having set *warn-of-reflection* - esp. for the code heavily calling Java. Nothing revolutionary, it was just use of typical web-related techniques, which are unfortunately still a major pain in the ass on many programming platforms (and they don't have macros!! ;) More uses incoming. It will be bulk data load of QDBM and TokyoCabinet storages, for example. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Monad problems: finding an m-zero
Konrad, Glad to see you're still around doing monads in Clojure. :) Jim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Annotations on the new deftype?
With all the newly added/being worked on defprotocol/deftype features - I've not seen anyone mention JDK annotations being part of things, is support for annotations being worked on as part of this? Would be a -very- handy addition, esp. as more and more JVM libraries/tools are looking for them. Mark -- Pull me down under... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. Hello, 1- We have this license server, used to control the use of a professional software (this one written using delphi). This was tested with thousands of simutaneous connections, and has been working with no hiccup for 6 months. It uses nio + ssl + a mysql database. 2- An application that connects to telephony switches and gives real time call informations to web users. With the whole administration part (managing customer, agents and their different price lists, showing statistics). It has many users permanently logged in as they need to monitor those calls (they are call shops). So they can see the calls counting for their (typically 8) booths, and can do various operation on the calls (like interrupting a prepaid call for instance). That's a lot of polling. We're still in the ramp-up period so we only have a fraction of the existing customers using our application yet. This project uses compojure + jetty + ssl + a postgres database. There isn't much to report, everything worked as expected. The jvm integration was a big help, providing access to some java third party libraries. Also using java, i can develop on windows, and just drop the jar on a solaris or linux server, it just works. The REPL helps a lot too. I'd like to see support for database connection pooling, and those pesky sql underscored column names to end up with dashes on the clojure side. Also compojure has somewhat of an attitude. Actually i miss cl-sql and hunchentooth, but hey you can't get everything, and what we've got is already fantastic. The language itself is perfect for the job, though i'm looking forward to the protocols and deftype extensions. The type metadata trick always seems wrong, and including it in a map feels like a hack. Refs, atoms and agents helped a lot, as well as the immutable data structures. There it is, an application programmer's view on clojure ! Sacha De Vos -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure User Survey, preparation for 1.1
Stuart, I think there's another valid option for getting clojure. I got it by installing the unfortunately titled Emacs Starter Kit from http://github.com/technomancy/emacs-starter-kit. I has an install clojure option that does most of the work of installing clojure, clojure-contrib and setting up slime in a way that gets one going very quickly. Regards, Bill On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:55 PM, the.stuart.sie...@gmail.com wrote: If you have trouble viewing or submitting this form, you can fill it out online: http://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=dFJSd1p4YXh0d0VxV0xjdk42MTU5RkE6MA Clojure User Survey This user survey will help move Clojure toward an official 1.1 release. How do you get Clojure? * - Download release - Github - Maven or Ivy What distribution of Clojure do you use primarily? * - 1.0 release - I picked one development snapshot and stuck with it - I use the latest development snapshot - I follow Github master branch - I follow Github new branch What about chunked sequences? * - I don't know what they are - The help me - They hurt me - I don't notice any difference Powered by Google Docs http://docs.google.com Report Abusehttp://spreadsheets.google.com/reportabuse?formkey=dFJSd1p4YXh0d0VxV0xjdk42MTU5RkE6MAsource=http%253A%252F%252Fspreadsheets.google.com%252Fviewform%253Fformkey%253DdFJSd1p4YXh0d0VxV0xjdk42MTU5RkE6MA- Terms of Service http://www.google.com/accounts/TOS - Additional Termshttp://www.google.com/google-d-s/terms.html -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comclojure%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: PersistentStructMap Exception
user= (defstruct s1 :a :b)
#'user/s1
user= (s1 1 2)
(struct s1 1 2) or (struct-map s1 :a 1 :b 2)
-- {:a 1, :b 2}
or:
(struct s1 1)
-- {:a 1, :b nil}
(struct-map s1 :b 2)
-- {:a nil, :b 2}
--
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Re: roll call of production use?
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:35 PM, Phlex ph...@telenet.be wrote: i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. Hello, 1- We have this license server, used to control the use of a professional software (this one written using delphi). What are the ethics of using an open source product like Clojure to implement DRM restrictions for some other product? Seems there might be something a bit iffy there -- if not legally, perhaps morally. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
1- We have this license server, used to control the use of a professional software (this one written using delphi). What are the ethics of using an open source product like Clojure to implement DRM restrictions for some other product? Seems there might be something a bit iffy there -- if not legally, perhaps morally. -- Ah nice to see you've finally adopted a lisp ! This customer's request seemed reasonable, and the project looked like a perfect test bed for clojure. The scope was small, and the requirements well defined. It involved multithreading, networking, databases and long up-times. The ethics are not mine to define. I'm just programmer, and will leave this discussion to you philosophers. Once a consensus will be reached you may drop me a mail. In the meantime, I'll just go hack at my next evil project. Sacha De Vos -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Datatypes and Protocols - early experience program
On Nov 12, 6:10 am, Rich Hickey richhic...@gmail.com wrote: An early version of the code for a few important new language features, datatypes[1] and protocols[2] is now available in the 'new' branch[3]. Note also that the build system[4] has builds of the new branch, and that the new branch works with current contrib. If you have the time and inclination, please try them out. Feedback is particularly welcome as they are being refined. Thanks, Rich [1]http://www.assembla.com/wiki/show/clojure/Datatypes [2]http://www.assembla.com/wiki/show/clojure/Protocols [3]http://github.com/richhickey/clojure/tree/new [4]http://build.clojure.org/ The first stumbling point I reached is that deftypes provide an automatic implementation for IPersistentMap, but not IFn. I attempted to write (instance key), which exploded, but (key instance) works just fine. My existing code uses (instance key) almost universally. Should I get used to this, or are there plans to provide a default IFn implementation? Allen -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
I use an internal DSL (Domain Specific Language) in Clojure to generate C++ and C# code. Cheers Morten On Nov 24, 10:00 am, Raoul Duke rao...@gmail.com wrote: hi, i'd be interested to hear who has successfully used clojure in production. i know of some, as some folks have been vocal; any other interesting-but-so-far-silent uses people'd be willing to fess up about? many thanks. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: roll call of production use?
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Richard Newman holyg...@gmail.com wrote: 1- We have this license server, used to control the use of a professional software (this one written using delphi). What are the ethics of using an open source product like Clojure to implement DRM restrictions for some other product? Seems there might be something a bit iffy there -- if not legally, perhaps morally. I don't agree. So long as they abide by the Clojure license, everything is A-OK… and the Clojure license doesn't impose restrictions on its use for this purpose. Hence my if not legally. This use of Clojure is internally consistent, and so I suspect that you're simply slightly offended by the idea of someone making money by using open-source software. In that case, I'd suggest you look first at Red Hat (market cap: $5.09B), and the Linux community's attitude towards them (generally positive). Oh, I have no problem with making money by using open source software, when it's done in the manner that companies like Red Hat do it. It's the use to lock down some piece of proprietary software even more than it already is that seems, at the very least, ironic. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Datatypes and Protocols - early experience program
On Nov 24, 4:55 am, Allen Rohner aroh...@gmail.com wrote: The first stumbling point I reached is that deftypes provide an automatic implementation for IPersistentMap, but not IFn. I attempted to write (instance key), which exploded, but (key instance) works just fine. My existing code uses (instance key) almost universally. Should I get used to this, or are there plans to provide a default IFn implementation? I agree that it would be nice with an automatic IFn implementation if you specify the interface. As an alternative, you could use user (deftype F[x] [clojure.lang.IPersistentMap clojure.lang.IFn] (.invoke [k] (k this))) #'user/F user ((F 42) :x) 42 user -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Meikel's blog post quotes: running into a lot of such trouble is a sign, that you misuse dynamic variables. Use them wisely. I'd like to see examples of what you think is a good, clean, compelling use of dynamic variables that are properly used wisely. My own experience is that if the code is simple enough for you to analyze the use of binding and be sure it is correct, then the code is also simple enough to have easily written in another way (perhaps using explicit parameter passing). On the other hand, if the use of binding is complex enough to really matter, it is also sufficiently complex you can't be 100% sure binding will do what you expect. I even somewhat question the places where Clojure internally uses bindings. For example, if you use with-precision to try to control floating point behavior within a structure that potentially has some deep laziness (like a tree) that can't easily be forced with a doall, you're in for a surprise. I would like to be proven wrong, so I'm serious about wanting to see good examples of dynamic binding. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure User Survey, preparation for 1.1
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 09:55:46PM +, the.stuart.sie...@gmail.com wrote: Since the form only lets me answer one answer for each, but reality is much more complicated. How do you get Clojure? * Download release Github Maven or Ivy I primarily use the latest development snapshot that I pull down with Maven/Ivy. But, I also keep a git workspace and bounce between master and new. As far as chunked sequences, I started using clojure after they were already in place, so I don't really have anything to compare it with. David -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
Re: Clojure Scoping Rules
Hi Mark, In Clojuratica I make what I think is good, clean, compelling use of dynamic vars. I rewrote the code to use dynamic vars after I found that doing it the other way became unwieldy and inelegant. To simplify a little, the API consists of just one main function, let's call it math-evaluate. Every time the user calls math-evaluate, he or she can specify any of a number of flags. Just for illustration, let's say two of these flags are :flag1 and :flag2. The math-evaluate function parses the flags and places them in a map called *options* (or options before I was using dynamic vars). It then calls into the core functions of the code base and returns the result. The core functions call one another in complex ways. There are scores of core functions. All of them have need to have access to the options map, if not for their own consumption then for passing to other core functions. Without dynamic vars, every single function in my code base would need to have an options argument. Moreover, every mutual call between these scores of functions would need to include the options map as an argument. I did it this way for a while, and it was painful. Moreover, if in the future I decided that every core function needed access to *two* of these global-within-the-dynamic-scope vars instead of one, I would need to edit the signature of every function and edit every mutual call between the functions. It turned out that this actually happened: I decided I needed another map to store a few I/O bindings (it's called *kernel*). Because I was using dynamic vars, I was able to change just one location in my code---the namespace where the dynamics are interned---instead of several hundred locations. The trade-off is the following. When I need to return a function or lazy seq I need to close over the *options* and *kernel* vars by jumping through the hoops Meikel has documented. There are only five or six such places in the code, so I'm more than happy to do this. It feels quite elegant to me, although I'd like a little more syntactic sugar. Note that the dynamic vars are solely for my convenience as a programmer, not part of the API of the software. I shield them from the user, so if the user tried to bind *options* him- or herself it would have no effect on the code. Every call to math-evaluate binds the dynamic vars anew on the basis of the flags passed. My use of dynamics is an implementation detail. The source is on github. The real-laziness branch is the newest and uses bound lazy-seqs the most, particularly in clojuratica.base.parse. Comments on this usage welcome. Garth On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 1:43 AM, Mark Engelberg mark.engelb...@gmail.comwrote: Meikel's blog post quotes: running into a lot of such trouble is a sign, that you misuse dynamic variables. Use them wisely. I'd like to see examples of what you think is a good, clean, compelling use of dynamic variables that are properly used wisely. My own experience is that if the code is simple enough for you to analyze the use of binding and be sure it is correct, then the code is also simple enough to have easily written in another way (perhaps using explicit parameter passing). On the other hand, if the use of binding is complex enough to really matter, it is also sufficiently complex you can't be 100% sure binding will do what you expect. I even somewhat question the places where Clojure internally uses bindings. For example, if you use with-precision to try to control floating point behavior within a structure that potentially has some deep laziness (like a tree) that can't easily be forced with a doall, you're in for a surprise. I would like to be proven wrong, so I'm serious about wanting to see good examples of dynamic binding. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comclojure%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en
