[CODE4LIB] Core Competencies of Electronic Resources Librarianship Adopted as NASIG Policy
The NASIG Board approved and adopted Core Competencies of Electronic Resources Librarianship as NASIG policy at their June 2013 meeting in Buffalo, New York. Sarah Sutton, former chair of the Core Competencies Task Force (CCTF), notes that she and the CCTF have high hopes that both library and information professionals and LIS educators will find the document a valuable resource upon which to base their work. Sarah writes, I am so gratified that many practitioners have already used the draft document, which circulated in the professional community over the past few months. It has sparked much interest and use, as evidenced by the wonderful sessions at the recent NASIG Annual Conference. I think the document supports NASIGs Vision to promote dialogue and professional growth, to provide learning opportunities, to advocate for its constituents, to challenge assumptions and traditions, and to take a leadership role in the information environment. Core Competencies of Electronic Resources Librarianship is available on the NASIG website, http://www.nasig.org/committee-core-competencies-task-force.cfm. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Charlene N. Simser Publicist, NASIG, Inc. public...@nasig.org | @NASIG ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Established in 1985, the North American Serials Interest Group, Inc. is an independent organization that promotes communication and sharing of ideas among all members of the serials information chain anyone working with or concerned about serial publications. For more information about NASIG, please visit http://www.nasig.org/.
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
[CODE4LIB] Job: Enabling Technologies Librarian/Instructional Designer at University of Michigan
Enabling Technologies Librarian/Instructional Designer (University of Michigan, Michigan) The A. Alfred Taubman Health Sciences Library at the University of Michigan invites applications for the position of Enabling Technologies Librarian/Instructional Designer. This position provides a unique and exciting opportunity for a creative, service-oriented information professional to join an innovative digital library system. This is a key role on a new team dedicated to the facilitation of evidence-based instructional design to improve learning and performance in health sciences education. The Enabling Technologies Librarian will be able to apply instructional design theory/models to enhance instruction produced in a variety of environments and will focus on curriculum design and performance improvement for a wide array of disciplines in the health sciences. Apply at umjobs.org, keyword 84901. Brought to you by code4lib jobs: http://jobs.code4lib.org/job/9296/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
i don't know why we're not talking about Haskell
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Functional programming FTW! On 7/30/13 10:27 AM, Mark A. Matienzo mark.matie...@gmail.com wrote: i don't know why we're not talking about Haskell - ** The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. They are intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager or the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to anyone or make copies. ** IronMail scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content. ** **
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
and so the PointBash language was created. Thanks, you've doomed us all. C:\Dev-Code\zerodiv.pb [Warning] Expected period at end of `int i = x/0` add period and recompile.' On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/ -- *Scott Turnbull* APTrust Technical Lead scott.turnb...@aptrust.org www.aptrust.org 678-379-9488
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
-:) -Rich -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Scott Turnbull Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 10:41 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby and so the PointBash language was created. Thanks, you've doomed us all. C:\Dev-Code\zerodiv.pb [Warning] Expected period at end of `int i = x/0` add period and recompile.' On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/ -- *Scott Turnbull* APTrust Technical Lead scott.turnb...@aptrust.org www.aptrust.org 678-379-9488
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
+1 Jeremy Nelson Metadata and Systems Librarian Colorado College -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Mark A. Matienzo Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:27 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby i don't know why we're not talking about Haskell
[CODE4LIB] (Haskell ecosystem would be nice) Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:27:01AM -0400, Mark A. Matienzo wrote: i don't know why we're not talking about Haskell I did to tell there is a lack of libraries and it is not as convenient as perl when it comes to use regexps. I wrote a MARC::MIR reader for ISO2709 but have some issues (it seems it is not lazy as expected) and need IS05426 support. regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
[CODE4LIB] Job: Production Programmer at American Theological Library Association
The American Theological Library Association (ATLA) seeks qualified and experienced applicants for a position as Production Programmer for ATLA's new production system (Drupal based). The programmer is chiefly responsible for developing Drupal applications, as well as the deployment and testing of such software applications. The successful candidate is an expert at Drupal-related technologies, and will have the opportunity to contribute at the architectural and design levels to the new production system. To perform this job successfully, an individual should have knowledge of: JavaScript, jQuery, PHP, MySQL, Drupal, RSS, XML, HTML, CSS, DOM, AJAX, VB.Net, or other technologies as appropriate. Candidates should have a proven ability to produce accurate and timely work in a publishing atmosphere with firm deadlines as well as effective interpersonal skills to work in a collegial team environment with other staff members. A working knowledge of current metadata standards (MARC 21, METS, MODS, TEI, etc.) and XML is preferred. Brought to you by code4lib jobs: http://jobs.code4lib.org/job/9299/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 02:21:55PM +, Rich Wenger wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. sure ... but i don't want to be stuck on PHP or python when i have the power of perl inside my hands, other would argue perl is too hard for librarians and go python, someone else will tell us all that yeah, his go server is 30 times faster than our dynamic langages based ones. Guess what? They are all right and it's a matter of what you need and how those languages will taste to you. There is no silver bullet, so don't expect a cancer cure for the moment. Sorry about that :) regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
All languages other than assembly are boutique and must be eliminated like the cancer that they are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Whatever; if you're not programming Turing machines made from two rocks and a roll of toilet paper, then you're not a REAL coder. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote: All languages other than assembly are boutique and must be eliminated like the cancer that they are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote: All languages other than assembly are boutique and must be eliminated like the cancer that they are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:21:24AM -0400, Andreas Orphanides wrote: Whatever; if you're not programming Turing machines made from two rocks and a roll of toilet paper, then you're not a REAL coder. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8DiOthAKek ./fxk -- H. L. Mencken suffers from the hallucination that he is H. L. Mencken -- there is no cure for a disease of that magnitude. -- Maxwell Bodenheim
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Real coders roll their own programming languages. -Original Message- From: Francis Kayiwa kay...@uic.edu Sent: Jul 30, 2013 10:45 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:21:24AM -0400, Andreas Orphanides wrote: Whatever; if you're not programming Turing machines made from two rocks and a roll of toilet paper, then you're not a REAL coder. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8DiOthAKek ./fxk -- H. L. Mencken suffers from the hallucination that he is H. L. Mencken -- there is no cure for a disease of that magnitude. -- Maxwell Bodenheim
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
umad bro? ;) Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Rich Wenger Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
I think I have the information I need at this point, so this would be a good time to let this thread die before it turns into what I tried to avoid in the first place. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Sherman Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 10:25 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote: All languages other than assembly are boutique and must be eliminated like the cancer that they are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Once you have committed your soul to visual Basic, there is no turning back. On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:07 AM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: umad bro? ;) Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Rich Wenger Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
I recommend going through http://pragprog.com/book/btlang/seven-languages-in-seven-weeks No, of course it's not exhaustive, but it offers an appreciation of some modern languages, their differences, and the roots they derived from. Every coder [their] language. Every language its coder :) Jason -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Marc Chantreux Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 10:14 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 02:21:55PM +, Rich Wenger wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. sure ... but i don't want to be stuck on PHP or python when i have the power of perl inside my hands, other would argue perl is too hard for librarians and go python, someone else will tell us all that yeah, his go server is 30 times faster than our dynamic langages based ones. Guess what? They are all right and it's a matter of what you need and how those languages will taste to you. There is no silver bullet, so don't expect a cancer cure for the moment. Sorry about that :) regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Didn't Dr. Frankenstein say that about the monster? On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:09 AM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: I think I have the information I need at this point, so this would be a good time to let this thread die before it turns into what I tried to avoid in the first place. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
I'm not sure about boutique, but I bet I can define brotique for you. ;) On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/ -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:25:14AM -0500, Matthew Sherman wrote: Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. comparing languages on objective criterias (especially when they are as close as ruby and python) isn't constructive. but ok, let's try * both claim to be very easy to learn (ruby by having a very nice syntax, python by limitating the features from the syntax) * writing python code is very boring when you come from featured. langages like ruby or perl. nothing can be expressed a simple way. * ruby is slow ... i mean: even for a dynamic language. * both langages have libs for libraries for libraries but lack something as robust and usefull as CPAN (and related tools) * python has an equivalent of the perl PDL (scipy) * python has Natural Language Toolkit (equivalent in other langages ?) your basic goal | your langage - write/maintain faster | perl reuse existing faster | python learn faster | ruby executefaster | you're probably screwed. experiment lua, go, haskell, rust regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:25 AM, Matthew Sherman matt.r.sher...@gmail.comwrote: Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. The systems and projects you work on dictate what languages you must know. If the idea is to just start learning, find a project that interests you and learn whatever that requires. Whatever language you use, data comes in, you do something with it, data goes out. You'll undoubtedly call up some libraries to help you. Finding yet another way to do that isn't necessarily a good idea. There's no way to avoid working with a bunch of languages nowadays, so I wouldn't recommend adding to that stack unless you have to.
[CODE4LIB] PyCon Call for Proposals
Attention Pythonistas! The Call for Proposals for PyCon speakers is out: http://us.pycon.org/2014/speaking/cfp/ PyCon will be April 9-17 in Montreal. (It's long because it includes tutorials and development sprints as well as conference talks; people don't necessarily attend all of it.) The Python Software Foundation sponsored the introduction to Python workshop at ALA Annual and they'd be interested in seeing proposals from the library world. But I have a conflict for early April, so y'all are going to have to supply the proposals :) Have fun! Andromeda Yelton LITA Board of Directors, Director-at-Large, 2013-2016 http://andromedayelton.com @ThatAndromeda
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Well, this is probably some obvious bait, but I will take it. :) *writing python code is very boring when you come from featured. langages like ruby or perl. nothing can be expressed a simple way* I'd call this an intentional feature, as opposed to a detriment. The idea behind Python is you should never have to stare at a line of code for a long time and wonder just what the programmer was trying to do. Cleverness can kill. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:25:14AM -0500, Matthew Sherman wrote: Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. comparing languages on objective criterias (especially when they are as close as ruby and python) isn't constructive. but ok, let's try * both claim to be very easy to learn (ruby by having a very nice syntax, python by limitating the features from the syntax) * writing python code is very boring when you come from featured. langages like ruby or perl. nothing can be expressed a simple way. * ruby is slow ... i mean: even for a dynamic language. * both langages have libs for libraries for libraries but lack something as robust and usefull as CPAN (and related tools) * python has an equivalent of the perl PDL (scipy) * python has Natural Language Toolkit (equivalent in other langages ?) your basic goal | your langage - write/maintain faster | perl reuse existing faster | python learn faster | ruby executefaster | you're probably screwed. experiment lua, go, haskell, rust regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Seven Languages in Seven Weeks ++ Great geek fun. On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:13 AM, Jason Stirnaman jstirna...@kumc.edu wrote: I recommend going through http://pragprog.com/book/btlang/seven-languages-in-seven-weeks No, of course it's not exhaustive, but it offers an appreciation of some modern languages, their differences, and the roots they derived from. Every coder [their] language. Every language its coder :) Jason -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Marc Chantreux Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 10:14 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 02:21:55PM +, Rich Wenger wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. sure ... but i don't want to be stuck on PHP or python when i have the power of perl inside my hands, other would argue perl is too hard for librarians and go python, someone else will tell us all that yeah, his go server is 30 times faster than our dynamic langages based ones. Guess what? They are all right and it's a matter of what you need and how those languages will taste to you. There is no silver bullet, so don't expect a cancer cure for the moment. Sorry about that :) regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
This discussion brought to mind this oldie but goodie... http://www.canonical.org/~kragen/tao-of-programming.html Thus spake the master programmer: ``When you have learned to snatch the error code from the trap frame, it will be time for you to leave.'' 1.1 Something mysterious is formed, born in the silent void. Waiting alone and unmoving, it is at once still and yet in constant motion. It is the source of all programs. I do not know its name, so I will call it the Tao of Programming. If the Tao is great, then the operating system is great. If the operating system is great, then the compiler is great. If the compiler is great, then the application is great. The user is pleased and there exists harmony in the world. The Tao of Programming flows far away and returns on the wind of morning. 1.2 The Tao gave birth to machine language. Machine language gave birth to the assembler. The assembler gave birth to the compiler. Now there are ten thousand languages. Each language has its purpose, however humble. Each language expresses the Yin and Yang of software. Each language has its place within the Tao. But do not program in COBOL if you can avoid it... pax, John Lolis Information Technology Manager White Plains Public Library 100 Martine Avenue White Plains, NY 10601 email: jlo...@wppl.lib.ny.us tel: 1.914.422.1497 fax: 1.914.422.1452 http://whiteplainslibrary.org/ On 7/30/2013 at 11:57 AM, in message 11189354.1375199827231.javamail.r...@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net, Peter Schlumpf pschlu...@earthlink.net wrote: Real coders roll their own programming languages. -Original Message- From: Francis Kayiwa kay...@uic.edu Sent: Jul 30, 2013 10:45 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:21:24AM -0400, Andreas Orphanides wrote: Whatever; if you're not programming Turing machines made from two rocks and a roll of toilet paper, then you're not a REAL coder. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8DiOthAKek ./fxk -- H. L. Mencken suffers from the hallucination that he is H. L. Mencken -- there is no cure for a disease of that magnitude. -- Maxwell Bodenheim
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
s/objective/subjective/ FTFY On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 9:24 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:25:14AM -0500, Matthew Sherman wrote: Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. comparing languages on objective criterias (especially when they are as close as ruby and python) isn't constructive. but ok, let's try * both claim to be very easy to learn (ruby by having a very nice syntax, python by limitating the features from the syntax) * writing python code is very boring when you come from featured. langages like ruby or perl. nothing can be expressed a simple way. * ruby is slow ... i mean: even for a dynamic language. * both langages have libs for libraries for libraries but lack something as robust and usefull as CPAN (and related tools) * python has an equivalent of the perl PDL (scipy) * python has Natural Language Toolkit (equivalent in other langages ?) your basic goal | your langage - write/maintain faster | perl reuse existing faster | python learn faster | ruby executefaster | you're probably screwed. experiment lua, go, haskell, rust regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
As of Ruby 1.9, I would dispute the Ruby is slower than everything case. There's lots of evidence to the contrary, e.g. http://www.unlimitednovelty.com/2012/06/ruby-is-faster-than-python-php-and-perl.html Jason -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Marc Chantreux Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 11:25 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:25:14AM -0500, Matthew Sherman wrote: Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. comparing languages on objective criterias (especially when they are as close as ruby and python) isn't constructive. but ok, let's try * both claim to be very easy to learn (ruby by having a very nice syntax, python by limitating the features from the syntax) * writing python code is very boring when you come from featured. langages like ruby or perl. nothing can be expressed a simple way. * ruby is slow ... i mean: even for a dynamic language. * both langages have libs for libraries for libraries but lack something as robust and usefull as CPAN (and related tools) * python has an equivalent of the perl PDL (scipy) * python has Natural Language Toolkit (equivalent in other langages ?) your basic goal | your langage - write/maintain faster | perl reuse existing faster | python learn faster | ruby executefaster | you're probably screwed. experiment lua, go, haskell, rust regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Hi, Python, Python, Python. Did I say Python? -Pythonist- Cornel Darden Jr. MSLIS Librarian Kennedy-King College City Colleges of Chicago Work 773-602-5449 Cell 708-705-2945 On Jul 30, 2013, at 11:09 AM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: I think I have the information I need at this point, so this would be a good time to let this thread die before it turns into what I tried to avoid in the first place. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Sherman Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 10:25 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby Ok folks, we have veered into nonconstructive territory. How about we come back to the original question and help this person figure out what they need to about Ruby and Python so they can do well with what they want to work on. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote: All languages other than assembly are boutique and must be eliminated like the cancer that they are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: What would you consider a boutique language? What isn't? -Ross. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Rich Wenger rwen...@mit.edu wrote: The proliferation of boutique languages is a cancer on our community. Each one is a YAP (Yet Another Priesthood), and little else. The world does not need five slightly varying syntaxes for a substring function. If I had switched languages every time the web community recommended it, I would have rewritten a mountain of apps at least twice in the past five years. What's next, a separate language to put periods at the end of sentences? Just my $.02. That is all. Rich Wenger E-Resource Systems Manager, MIT Libraries rwen...@mit.edu 617-253-0035 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Joshua Welker Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:56 AM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby I am already a big user of PHP for web apps, but PHP does not make a fantastic scripting language in my experience. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:18 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby No mention of PHP? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 30, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Kurt Nordstrom doseofvitam...@gmail.com wrote: Whoohoo, late to the party! I like Python because I learned it first, and I haven't had a need to explore Ruby yet. I did briefly foray into learning Ruby in order to try to learn Rails, and I actually found that my background in Python sort of gave me brain-jam for learning Ruby, because the languages were so close together, but just different in some ways. So my mind would be 'oh, so it's just insert Python idiom here but then, it's not. If I tackle Ruby again, I will definitely try to 'empty my cup' first. -K On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Marc Chantreux m...@unistra.fr wrote: hello, Sorry comming late with it but: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:43:33AM -0500, Joshua Welker wrote: Not intending to start a language flame war/holy war here, but in the library coding community, is there a particular reason to use Ruby over Python or vice-versa? Is it the only choices you have? Because I'd personnally advice none of them I tested both of them before stucking to Perl just because * it is very pleasant when it come to explore and modify datastructures and strings (which library things are). * the ecosystem is briliant: perl comes with lot of libraries and tools with a quality i haven't found in other languages. Of course, perl is not perfect and i really would like to use a modern emerging compiled language like go, rust, haskell or even something on the jvm (like clojure or the emerging perl6) but all of them miss libraries. HTH regards -- Marc Chantreux Université de Strasbourg, Direction Informatique 14 Rue René Descartes, 67084 STRASBOURG CEDEX ☎: 03.68.85.57.40 http://unistra.fr Don't believe everything you read on the Internet -- Abraham Lincoln -- http://www.blar.net/kurt/blog/
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
Has anyone tried coding using one of these? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3keLeMwfHY
Re: [CODE4LIB] Python and Ruby
It's extremely eerie how this thread has played out almost exactly like a similar one in 2010: http://bit.ly/4kb77v Creatures of habit, we are. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Levy, Michael ml...@ushmm.org wrote: Has anyone tried coding using one of these? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3keLeMwfHY
[CODE4LIB] Job: IT Applications Specialist at Glendale Public Library
This position is within the Library Information Technology Services (LITS) section of the Glendale Library, Arts Culture Department (aka Glendale Public Library, CA). Please share it with anyone who may be qualified. It will only be open for applications for 2 weeks! IT Applications Specialist / Library, Arts Culture Under general supervision, individuals in this journey-level classification works with staff to understand and document business needs for basic to moderately complex applications in a public library setting. Requires two years recent experience in the analysis, programming and/or implementation of government or business computer applications with at least one year in configuring, supporting and troubleshooting major library applications for staff and public use. A college degree in computer science or a related field is desirable. Filing Period closes August 9, 2013 For more information or to apply, please visit www.ci.glendale.ca.us Brought to you by code4lib jobs: http://jobs.code4lib.org/job/9301/
[CODE4LIB] Job Posting / Systems Librarian/Web Librarian / Washington, DC
Apologies for the cross postings . . . . . LAC Group is seeking a Systems Librarian/Web Librarian for a potential long-term contract with a prestigious federal agency located in Washington, DC. We are recruiting for several positions for this contract to run the library and information services for this agency department and these positions are contingent upon award. This library serves the agency's department, public, education community and other government agencies. SUMMARY OF RESPONSIBILITIES: * Maintain SirsiDynix ILS; install patches, upgrades; troubleshoot * Update and maintain web site and portal * Coordinate activities of Technical Services staff; oversee quality assurance * Coordinate collection of metrics and statistics for Technical Services function * Participate in providing reference and research services through regular duty at the reference desk and by responding to requests using the full range of available resources * Participate in liaison and outreach programs * Stay abreast of the information needs and trends within the agency * Stay abreast of trends in library and information science *KNOWLEDGE, SKILLS AND ABILITIES: * Knowledge of integrated library system (ILS), especially SirsiDynix; ability to manage, troubleshoot, install patches and updates and interface with vendor * Ability to manage web sites and portal sites * Understanding of the role of the Library and the needs of its customers * Understanding of the role of technology in library functions and services; ability to apply technology in functional area * Provide general and specialized reference and research services on issues relating to education and educational policy * Strong public/customer service orientation * Excellent oral and written communication skills; ability to communicate with a diverse community * Ability to work independently and as part of a team QUALIFICATIONS AND EXPERIENCE: * MLS from an ALA-accredited library/information science program * Experience with social sciences and policy-focused library services * Demonstrated experience in managing a library or information service function * Familiar with federal contract requirements For immediate consideration, please apply at: http://goo.gl/VOumzt LAC Group is an Equal Opportunity Employer who values diversity in the workplace
Re: [CODE4LIB] Code4Lib Northwest
The BC group is organizing one in Vancouver for November, which you could consider part of the NW region. On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 4:04 PM, Kyle Banerjee kyle.baner...@gmail.com wrote: The c4l meetings in Portland all seemed to work pretty well. I'd be happy to help put another one together. kyle On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Tom Johnson johnson.tom+code4...@gmail.com wrote: There certainly is. We held a Code4Lib NW a few years ago in Portland. It was well attended. I think it would be great we could get better organized about an annual(?) event. I've also been batting around the idea of doing a regional LODLAM Summit event for the West/Northwest. I'm hoping to have that put together for early next year. - Tom On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 11:57 AM, Amy Vecchione amyvecchi...@boisestate.edu wrote: Hi! I was just looking at the Code4Libraries site for the regions and saw that the Northwest link went to an old google group: https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!forum/pnwcode4lib Is there anyone active in coding for libraries in the Northwest in a new discussion group/conference/etc? Thanks in advance! Amy -- Amy Vecchione, Digital Access Librarian/Assistant Professor http://works.bepress.com/amy_vecchione/ Albertsons Library, Boise State University, L212 http://library.boisestate.edu (208) 426-1625
