Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Reminds me of the Zen saying: In the beginner's mind there are many
possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few.
-Original Message-
From: Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com
Sent: Feb 21, 2013 11:59 AM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Ian, I have to caution against taking the attitude we only code in what we
already know. Of course you are going to be able to hit the ground
running faster in what you are expert in. Putting on the blinders is a
great way to become irrelevant in the technology sphere. If you want to be
a better coder, there is no better way than to learn a new language, and
actually do a project in it. The insights you find in doing this will make
you a better coder when your go back to doing whatever it was you were
doing before.
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.eduwrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one
that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and
the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can easily
get washed out of the calculation when you consider what languages you know
and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
On 2/22/13 11:22 AM, Peter Schlumpf wrote: Reminds me of the Zen saying: In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few. ... with beginner's mind being the zen-preferred place to hang out, right?
[CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden are static. Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of java.lang.Class On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com wrote: To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case) because classes are themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented programming for programmers who were used to writing C and C++. -Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My major
issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method, so when the
static method is being run in the context of the inheriting class it is
unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden are
static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than Java
because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case) because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made many
compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My major
issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method, so when the
static method is being run in the context of the inheriting class it is
unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden are
static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than Java
because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case) because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made many
compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
with regards to Class extending Object, should this error be possible?
error: clone() has protected access in Object
Class.clone();
^
Of course this sort of nit-picking is absolutely not constructive. I'm
just saying that if you're teaching the Object Oriented programming
paradigm, there are better choices than Java. Java is a really difficult
language for the beginner. How many professional Java programmers can work
without an IDE? Compare that to the same metric for any scripting
language.
-Justin.
P.S.
error: clone() has protected access in Object
System.out.println(Class.clone().toString());
^
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:45 AM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote:
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My major
issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method, so when
the
static method is being run in the context of the inheriting class it is
unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden are
static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java
because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case) because
classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many
compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one that
works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the application needs
to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and the overall community
context in which the project will live. The peculiarities of a given languages
truth tables, for example, can easily get washed out of the calculation when
you consider what languages you know and what platforms your institution
supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Ethan
Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet our
expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Concur. I think everyone should just switch to APL [0], then we'll all
suffer equally.
[0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APL_(programming_language)
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:53 PM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.eduwrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one
that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and
the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can easily
get washed out of the calculation when you consider what languages you know
and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Actually, I'm finding this thread very enlightening. I've only had a little
java experience, but always assumed it was the ur-implementation of OO
principles. Now, I've had that assumption corrected.
Thanks,
…adam
On Feb 21, 2013, at 12:53 PM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.edu wrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one
that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and
the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can easily get
washed out of the calculation when you consider what languages you know and
what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Ethan
Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet our
expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
This communication is a confidential and proprietary business communication. It
is intended solely for the use of the designated recipient(s). If this
communication is received in error, please contact the sender and delete this
communication.
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Ian, I have to caution against taking the attitude we only code in what we
already know. Of course you are going to be able to hit the ground
running faster in what you are expert in. Putting on the blinders is a
great way to become irrelevant in the technology sphere. If you want to be
a better coder, there is no better way than to learn a new language, and
actually do a project in it. The insights you find in doing this will make
you a better coder when your go back to doing whatever it was you were
doing before.
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.eduwrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one
that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and
the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can easily
get washed out of the calculation when you consider what languages you know
and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
This ... saddens me.
We can have evermore threads which hit the daily post limit about the
community and how everyone feels. But a thread about programming language
strength/weakness has to be shut down.
I think it's time to change the name. I'm completely serious.
/dev
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Ethan Gruber ewg4x...@gmail.com wrote:
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My major
issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method, so when
the
static method is being run in the context of the inheriting class it is
unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden are
static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java
because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case) because
classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many
compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
--
Sent from my GMail account.
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
I was just curious, so I threw the same thing into C#.
class Foo
{
public static void sayHello()
{
hi();
}
public static void hi()
{
Console.WriteLine(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar : Foo
{
public static void sayHello2()
{
hi();
}
public static new void hi()
{
Console.WriteLine(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Program
{
static void Main(string[] args)
{
Bar.sayHello();
Bar.sayHello2();
Console.ReadLine();
}
}
Result is similar:
Hi from foo
Hi from bar.
The C# compiler actually throws an error if you try to make a static class
extend another class. ( i.e., static class Bar : Foo ).
Static references are really a nice way to get around OO in the first place
though. Of course I use them as well, when I want to introduce more procedural
type methods into my code, or when I truly need something at the CLASS level,
rather than the OBJECT level. Although using static methods can occasionally
provide very small performance boosts, I would guess static methods also
reduces the ability to use reflection to examine code introduced or created
during runtime.
That said, it's hard for me to get too excited about the lack of the ability
for a static class to extend another static class and throw strongly typed
classes out the window for Javascript's hash implementation. And I have spent
a lot of time trying to get Javascript to feel more object-oriented, copying a
child classes hash from the parent and then adding new items (happen to be
functions) to it and using Prototype as well.
Either way, there are different models for everyone and perhaps every project.
But, I did learn something about Java (and then C#) from this thread.
Mark / UF
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Benjamin Armintor
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 1:22 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
If this thread is just code nerdery: You can't override static methods in Java.
It looks like you can because there's a generous search for statically bound
names (if B extends A, and A defines static a(), B.a() works), but it's not the
overriding mechanism because if you try to refer to super in an overriding
implementation, the compiler stops you (it's not bound). This also suggests
that classes are not objects, but that the reflection API cheats a little to
make them appear to be so.
I always thought Javascript both had primitives and was more functional than
OO, given the Prototype inheritance stuff, the fact that objects are really
hashes, and the fact that constructors are functions. Ruby, though:
totally OO. Except when it's not.
- Ben
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 1:00 PM, Adam Wead aw...@rockhall.org wrote:
Actually, I'm finding this thread very enlightening. I've only had a
little java experience, but always assumed it was the
ur-implementation of OO principles. Now, I've had that assumption corrected.
Thanks,
...adam
On Feb 21, 2013, at 12:53 PM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.edu wrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick
the
one that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience,
and the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can
easily get washed out of the calculation when you consider what
languages you know and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf
Of
Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to
meet our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of
conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static
method, so when the static method is being run in the context of
the inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi
from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo); } }
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar); } }
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
you really derailed me . . . i might be able to help with the javascript ypu're messing with though . . . maybe . . . mj
[CODE4LIB] Recall: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Jay, Michael would like to recall the message, [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?.
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
I feel that this is true. However, the more languages I learn, the more I find
myself doing embarrassing things like trying to update a JavaScript file and
then realizing I'm actually writing in PHP or C++. If only my brain had an
automatic language gearshift.
Genny Engel
Sonoma County Library
gen...@sonoma.lib.ca.us
707 545-0831 x1581
www.sonomalibrary.org
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Justin
Coyne
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:59 AM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Ian, I have to caution against taking the attitude we only code in what we
already know. Of course you are going to be able to hit the ground
running faster in what you are expert in. Putting on the blinders is a
great way to become irrelevant in the technology sphere. If you want to be
a better coder, there is no better way than to learn a new language, and
actually do a project in it. The insights you find in doing this will make
you a better coder when your go back to doing whatever it was you were
doing before.
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.eduwrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the one
that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience, and
the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can easily
get washed out of the calculation when you consider what languages you know
and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to meet
our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented than
Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's case)
because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language made
many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Justin,
I certainly agree that to become a better coder, it's good to experiment
with many languages and applications. I'm not advocating that any given
shop should always rule out a project in a new (to them) language. What I'm
saying is that the context of what you already know and what your
environment supports is an equally important part of the conversation when
choosing a language to develop in.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Justin Coyne
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:59 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Ian, I have to caution against taking the attitude we only code in what we
already know. Of course you are going to be able to hit the ground running
faster in what you are expert in. Putting on the blinders is a great way to
become irrelevant in the technology sphere. If you want to be a better
coder, there is no better way than to learn a new language, and actually do
a project in it. The insights you find in doing this will make you a better
coder when your go back to doing whatever it was you were doing before.
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.eduwrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the
one that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience,
and the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can
easily get washed out of the calculation when you consider what
languages you know and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf
Of Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to
meet our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of
conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi
from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented
than Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's
case) because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language
made many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object
Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
pendantic and ruby go together about as well as brevity and this
mailing list
class Foo
private
def bar
Calling a private method is foobar
end
end
$ irb
1.9.3p286 :009 Foo.new.bar
NoMethodError: private method `bar' called for #Foo:0x007f9e9184b8b8
1.9.3p286 :010 Foo.new.send(:bar)
= Calling a private method is foobar
They've been saying they're going to remove this in the next version for
about 5 years now...
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 9:37 PM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.edu wrote:
Justin,
I certainly agree that to become a better coder, it's good to experiment
with many languages and applications. I'm not advocating that any given
shop should always rule out a project in a new (to them) language. What
I'm
saying is that the context of what you already know and what your
environment supports is an equally important part of the conversation when
choosing a language to develop in.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of
Justin Coyne
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:59 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Ian, I have to caution against taking the attitude we only code in what we
already know. Of course you are going to be able to hit the ground
running
faster in what you are expert in. Putting on the blinders is a great way
to
become irrelevant in the technology sphere. If you want to be a better
coder, there is no better way than to learn a new language, and actually do
a project in it. The insights you find in doing this will make you a better
coder when your go back to doing whatever it was you were doing before.
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Ian Walls iwa...@library.umass.edu
wrote:
Agreed. Each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Pick the
one that works best for your situation, factoring in not only what the
application needs to do, but your and your team's level of experience,
and the overall community context in which the project will live. The
peculiarities of a given languages truth tables, for example, can
easily get washed out of the calculation when you consider what
languages you know and what platforms your institution supports.
-Ian
-Original Message-
From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf
Of Ethan Gruber
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:45 PM
To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] You are a *pedantic* coder. So what am I?
Look, I'm sure we can list the many ways different languages fail to
meet our expectations, but is this really a constructive line of
conversation?
-1
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.comwrote:
I did misspeak a bit. You can override static methods in Java. My
major issue is that there is no getClass() within a static method,
so when the static method is being run in the context of the
inheriting class it is unaware of its own run context.
For example: I want the output to be Hi from bar, but it's Hi
from
foo:
class Foo {
public static void sayHello() {
hi();
}
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from foo);
}
}
class Bar extends Foo {
public static void hi() {
System.out.println(Hi from bar);
}
}
class Test {
public static void main(String [ ] args) {
Bar.sayHello();
}
}
-Justin
On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Eric Hellman e...@hellman.net
wrote:
OK, pedant, tell us why you think methods that can be over-ridden
are static.
Also, tell us why you think classes in Java are not instances of
java.lang.Class
On Feb 18, 2013, at 1:39 PM, Justin Coyne
jus...@curationexperts.com
wrote:
To be pedantic, Ruby and JavaScript are more Object Oriented
than Java because they don't have primitives and (in Ruby's
case) because classes
are
themselves objects. Unlike Java, both Python and Ruby can
properly
override of static methods on sub-classes. The Java language
made many compromises as it was designed as a bridge to Object
Oriented
programming
for programmers who were used to writing C and C++.
-Justin
