Re: [VOTE] Change community@ list settings
On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 2:28 PM, Jukka Zittingjukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: [ ] +1 Change list settings (allow anyone to subscribe or post) [X] -1 Keep the current settings The ASF does not have public lists that are not backed by either a PMC or a committee. As long as the subscription and posting was restricted to committers, then the list did not require active oversight. Yet, once a list becomes open for all to join and post, then it requires active oversight in the form of a backing PMC or committee. Cheers. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: community-unsubscr...@apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: community-h...@apache.org
.apache Freenode cloaks available
If are an ASF committer and use Freenode on IRC and want a username cloak, please feel free to place a request in committers:docs/freenode-cloaks.txt. More about cloaks: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#cloaks Nick setups (required): http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup At this time, we'll only have 'committers'. We may add more categories later at our discretion. Thanks! -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wikis for Geeks: anyone have a wiki that supports CVS/SVN for users?
--On Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:12 PM +0200 Erik Abele [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is Greg's SubWiki but I'm not sure how far/alive it is, seems to be working though: http://www.webdav.org/wiki/projects/SubWiki http://subwiki.tigris.org/ I've setup Subwiki in the past to do exactly this: some folks edit via SVN and some folks edit via the wiki pages. It's very slick for this purpose. If you need help setting it up, please grab me on IRC as I think I know why you want this. =) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Open Source, Cold Shoulder (fwd)
--On Tuesday, October 12, 2004 9:34 PM +0200 Santiago Gala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can separate both functions, i.e. development or patching and code review/quality control. The linux kernel is beginning to be a good example, where you have: - Linus (vanilla) tree as a reference value (think Fed Reserve) - Andrew Morton (mm) patches, making it a higher risk (think Dow Jones) - Full preemption and other special or highly experimental patches (think Nasdaq or even Hedge Funds) - Hardware manufacturers trying to get their code in, to get more wide support for their hardware. - Other people suggesting improvements around (I've sent three typos recently) just because they don't want to maintain their needed pieces. The Linux kernel is a great process example if you aren't trying to actually cooperate in the development process or build a *real* brand. Linus views RedHat, Debian, Mandrake, etc. as the ones who are responsible for dealing with users. It's also a very ego-centric model - perhaps some developers like that. I don't care for it at all. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Open Source, Cold Shoulder (fwd)
--On Wednesday, October 13, 2004 1:21 AM +0800 Niclas Hedhman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am sure that the upper-tier of ASF would shiver at the thought that hordes of people can gain direct access to the repositories. They/we will dust of the same arguments of why Wiki won't work. But it does. Why? Because *most* people *want* it to work. Baloney. Code review is *essential*. For httpd, we require *three* people to sign off on any change before it gets merged into the stable branch. We take our responsibility for providing stable software *extremely* seriously. We're not about to deploy untested (and unreviewed) fixes to the general population. It would not bode well on our personal reputations or of our software's. Therefore, we're also extremely cautious about adding new committers. Furthermore, for example, lots of people suggest patches to httpd. They think their patch is right. But, more often then not, their patches are incorrect because they aren't as familiar with the code as the committers are. If you turned the httpd repository into a wiki-style free-for-all, it would be an extreme uphill battle to keep the code clean because it would turn into anarchy. The current committers won't be able to keep up and the code would degenerate as everyone throws in what they think is right without having any mandatory review process in place. An ex post facto review process (CTR) isn't always acceptable for production-grade software because the reality is that real people can't keep up with a high volume! CTR works well only when you have a stable core of people whom you trust - as httpd does for its unstable branch, but even then we still use RTC for our stable branches because we want to be as-certain-as-we-humans-can-be that our fixes are right before we merge them into stable. I believe the quality of the code base is in direct proportion to the effort required to get commit bits and what it takes to get a change in. There are projects here in ASF-land that don't care at all about actual users and are willing to leave them in the lurch due to petty political battles. That's not the spirit of open source I care about or want the ASF to support. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Open Source, Cold Shoulder (fwd)
--On Tuesday, October 12, 2004 11:12 AM -0700 Tim Larson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My version of the idea is not to let random strangers manipulate the branch that will be released with our brand, but rather to have a version control system that allows random strangers to commit proposed changes with just normal version control commands, without the mental overhead of going outside this system to create a patch, find the right place in bugzilla, create a bug report and submit, attach the patch as a second step, find out the patch was formatted wrong, resubmit, etc. FWIW, Subversion could easily support such a model via its cheap branching model. The only thing that'd stop us are policy questions though. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Open Source, Cold Shoulder (fwd)
[Completely off-topic, but this is community@ where nothing is ever on-topic.] --On Friday, October 8, 2004 6:26 PM -0700 Yoav Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But you know what, on a night like tonight with the Sox moving on in the playoffs, even an apparently bashing article like this doesn't bother me much! Have a good weekend everyone ;) Oh, *what* a shot by Papi! Go Sox! BTW, I was able to see Games 1 and 2 here in SoCal...Yay! And, I'll be in Boston late next week, but sadly, I don't think I could finagle a ticket. But, it's all good now. =) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[NOTICE] site and site-tools migrated to Subversion
Hi everyone! If you were using the 'site' or 'site-tools' CVS repositories, they are now migrated to Subversion: http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/infrastructure/site/trunk/ http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/infrastructure/site-tools/trunk/ (As usual, if you are planning on committing, you need to use https.) For more about Subversion, please see: http://www.apache.org/dev/version-control.html If you have any questions, please contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks! -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Playboy mirror logo?
--On Thursday, August 26, 2004 3:37 PM +1000 Ian Holsman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: mirror.au.apache.org or something which just does a round robin on available mirrors in the 'au' region.. that the downloader only sees a 'apache' domain. but this would should be a 'global' change.. not just for the mirrors some people don't like. IMHO, DNS-based round-robin makes it harder to provide the ability to route around broken mirrors for three reasons: 1) harder to insert/remove them dynamically: mirrors.cgi can use our freshness metrics gathered by mirmon to only show mirrors that have updated since a particular time (we want this for sec releases) 2) we'd have to update DNS on every status change: mirrors go stale and we take them out of active list and insert them when the problem is fixed (this is automated right now by mirmon) 3) doesn't allow the user to avoid a mirror that is broken (but we haven't noticed yet); additionally, it provides the user the ability to select a mirror that they know is close to them or have a particularly good connection to. My $.02. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: proposed ammendment to mirroring policy
--On Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:26 AM -0400 Daniel F. Savarese [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Disclaimer: The presence of a mirror on this list does not constitute an endorsement by the Apache Software Foundation of the organization's business or other activities. The Apache Software Foundation lists all mirror sites that request to be listed and meet the criteria specified at: http://www.apache.org/info/how-to-mirror.html I honestly don't think we need to go this far. More needless legal mumble-jumble creeping into the ASF. Yuck. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists
--On Thursday, July 22, 2004 4:54 PM +1000 David Crossley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BTW, i thought that Antonio's alert about another potential M$ attack was warranted. He seems to care for the ASF as a whole. On which other list is he going to alert us all? FWIW, the only sensible strategy to software patents is to ignore them completely until we get served with a lawsuit. As much as it might sound foolish, it's almost the only way to legally protect ourselves. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists
--On Thursday, July 22, 2004 9:07 AM +0200 Henning Schmiedehausen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or tell those others here on community@, what we can do to be considered as junior infrastructure people to relief your burdens. You could start off by not using community@ to discuss infrastructure topics. (I think Tetsuya started that unfortunate trend.) infrastructure@ is the place to talk about those items not [EMAIL PROTECTED] As for participating in infrastructure@ tasks here in the ASF, it's pretty much the same as open-source development: build trust with your peers over time. I don't care if someone has managed a large fleet of servers elsewhere - if I don't trust them, I personally don't want them touching our servers. (And, due to confidentiality restrictions, only members can get root access.) Yet, try to jump in as best as you can. Offer advice and help to others on [EMAIL PROTECTED] And, oh yeah, do *not* attack people already involved as that's not going to endear you to anyone. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists
--On Thursday, July 22, 2004 3:07 PM +0200 Nicola Ken Barozzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do it yourself scales, and I would think that any ASF member should be able to create a list, given evident consensus. We did the same for the Incubator files, remember? Uh, no. That's the argument here: lists require the appropriate oversight structure. No member should be allowed to create a list by themselves. A PMC or the board is the *only* legitimate requestors for new ASF mailing lists. Part of infrastructure@'s mandate is to ensure that the oversight structures are followed and the ASF is protected. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Inexpensive Lists
--On Thursday, July 22, 2004 1:20 PM -0400 Noel J. Bergman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He seems to feel that a Member can create a list and provide oversight. FWIW, the 'official' policy is documented at: http://www.apache.org/dev/list-setup.html -- Creating the List Ask your Project Management Committee to send email to the folks at [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- and at: http://www.apache.org/dev/committers.html -- Q: I need to request some changes to infrastructure? A: You might notice something that needs changing, for example the configuration for a mailing list. The request to the infrastructure@ list or the apmail@ alias needs to come from your Project Management Committee. That ensures that the requests are official, and not just an individual user's desire. This is the same for all requests for infrastructure changes. -- We've had this conversation before and even codified that requests must come from some 'official' entity not an individual on their own. So, that's our current policy... And who is going to oversee the new [EMAIL PROTECTED] list that we were asked to do? As for jobs@, I think the PRC may be the appropriate party to provide oversight to [EMAIL PROTECTED] I'll ping them and see what they think. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists (was: Re: Python anybody?)
--On Sunday, July 18, 2004 4:20 PM -0400 Brian McCallister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I suspect that if 3 ASF'ers want to discuss a topic via email, and think a mailing list would help, there should be a mechanism to simply have it created, bang. Just my 2 cents =) Mailing lists without PMC oversight should be treated with extreme caution. Lists without the necessary oversight might expose the ASF to unwanted liability. The ASF isn't a personal soapbox medium: it's meant to facilitate collaborative software projects. For example, this list (community@) is a *horrible* waste of time that adds little value: almost every topic here has a more appropriate list elsewhere in the ASF (or, ideally, outside of the ASF). But, people seem to use this list as a dumping ground and are often too lazy to think about what the 'proper' list is - instead they just post to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bitter? Nah. ;-) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists (was: Re: Python anybody?)
--On Wednesday, July 21, 2004 12:54 PM -0600 Adam R. B. Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1) I might've missed a better place to post, I don't think so. I thought about it for a while, and this was the best I came up with. So if you know of one, then maybe I'm simply clueless, not lazy. Otherwise, here it is. My take is, right idea, wrong place. Not your fault. I might even subscribe to such a list. But, I fail to see what is ASF-specific about a python-talk list? It's not, and hence shouldn't be hosted by the ASF. 3) The ASF mantra of it's the community not the technology really dictates a community@ list. I'm sorry if you feel it is a waste, I don't. That's inaccurate. A better phrase, It's the community [around the technology] not the technology. community@ serves no place as it has nothing to do with anything that the ASF does or will ever do. 4) personal soapbox medium -- GAK! Why would anybody out of diapers waste breath on soapboxing? Come on, give the community some credit... I don't see why the ASF should care about potential MS patent attacks. That has no place on an ASF-sponsored list. From my perspective, community@ is and persists to be a giant waste of time. (If you are on or know of FoRK, that's a list that laps up pointless conversations like the one re: patents.) I'm just floating this idea. If you and/or others want to kill it, so be it. If it go nowhere 'cos of lack of support of the ASF powers that be, so be it. Python (for better or worse) is becoming part of ASF, but it is less well understood/supported than Java. I was just hoping for a bit of help getting some things going... Again, a list is fine. I'd just prefer to find someone else to host it: the ASF isn't the end-all-be-all to all of your hosting needs. And, obviously, feel free to invite all of the ASF folks to that list. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists
--On Wednesday, July 21, 2004 4:10 PM -0600 Adam R. B. Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why do you keep assuming it is for chit chat? If it were [EMAIL PROTECTED] and it was clear (community imposed/whatever) to be about Java @ ASF, wouldn't that make sense? Aren't there issues (i.e. supporting JDK1.5, not supporting JDK 1.2, that are good cross-project topics?) I'm not suggesting ASF host forums, but a list to discuss language issues/tips-tricks and help w/ fixes/changes, whatever. I don't see why the ASF should be involved. There are lots of other suitable forums for help with Python, Java, C#, etc. Must we host them all? I don't think so. We're not in the business of competing with them. I guess it's that I don't follow the argument that topics not specifically tied to the ASF should be given a home within the ASF. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Inexpensive Lists
--On Wednesday, July 21, 2004 5:40 PM -0500 William A. Rowe, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think one thing folks are asking for is an [EMAIL PROTECTED], one where idle questions and chitchat about cool solutions and code for our servers and sites would be shared. I wouldn't see an issue with ASF-related infrastructure chit-chat being on [EMAIL PROTECTED] community@ isn't the place for that, for sure. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: anyone going to hypertext 04?
--On Thursday, July 8, 2004 4:03 PM +0200 Gregor J. Rothfuss [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fifteenth ACM Conference on Hypertext and Hypermedia University of California, Santa Cruz, August 9-13, 2004 http://www.ht04.org is coming up. i was wondering if anyone is going to be there? I'm likely to go - should know for sure next week. -- justin P.S. You should post this on party@ not [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Author tags (Re: ASF Board Summary for February 18, 2004)
--On Saturday, March 6, 2004 6:32 AM +0900 Tetsuya Kitahata [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm going to clean up the www.apache.org site module What exactly are you going to be modifying? -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: ASF Board Summary for January 21, 2004
--On Tuesday, February 17, 2004 12:41 AM +0100 Jochen Wiedmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been using the attached relicense.pl rather than the python script in the committers directory, because it preserves the copyright years. It does even more, adding the year 2004 automatically. The python script in committers does preserve copyright years... -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Microsoft patents XML based script automation?
--On Friday, February 13, 2004 6:28 PM +1100 Conor MacNeill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It is hard to see Ant being affected as its publication precedes the filing date for the patent, if that is relevant. Not sure about the other projects. FWIW, in the US, it is first to invent not first to file. So, if you want to challenge this patent, you need to produce prior work dating before their invention date. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Board resolutions
--On Sunday, January 25, 2004 1:49 PM -0600 Tim O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone know where board resolutions are kept in CVS? I'm wondering if there is any historical record of board resolutions available to members of a PMC? http://www.apache.org/foundation/board/calendar.html HTH. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: automatic nagging for board reports?
--On Wednesday, January 21, 2004 5:39 PM +0100 Leo Simons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe many ASF projects are chronically late in sending in status reports in time for the board meeting. That's bad and they should be nagged about it. Since manual nagging is a chore, how about a small script in a crontab somewhere that automates sending out a timely reminder? As a PMC chair, I'd be against receiving notifications to submit something that I already know to do. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Who decides who is 'worthy' for Planet Apache?
--On Thursday, January 22, 2004 8:26 AM -0700 Adam R. B. Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, now what? Do I just add it back, or what? Maybe Planet Apache needs some PMC control... This is *exactly* why Planet Apache isn't part of the ASF. The fact that Thom exposes the RSS listing to the ASF committers is a courtesy. I, for one, posted that Gump should be removed. I believe several others chimed in with the same sentiment. So, Thom wasn't alone in his assessment in the situation. And, as to whether non-ASF content should be blogged, there was discussion about that on the Planet - and the consensus I saw was that we are interested in the person not their ASF activities. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Single Location for syndicated Apache blogs
--On Thursday, January 8, 2004 3:36 PM -0500 Tim O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This isn't to say that this is a bad idea. I think this is a **great** idea, but this is also something that could be done on someone's personal hardware resources. +1. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mailing from apache email address
On Tue, Nov 11, 2003 at 01:52:29AM -0800, Brian Behlendorf wrote: certain IP addresses that could send mail that claimed to be From: an @apache.org address, in an attempt to prevent forged spam. But I'm sure the infrastructure team would make a lot of noise before doing that. As in noise against it. ;-) Would this scheme allow DNS entries per LHS of the email address? Then, there might be something to it - otherwise, feh. If I were to send a message from [EMAIL PROTECTED], it should only originate from one machine - the one this one comes from - or am I really Justin at all? Muwhahaha. But, to expect us to tunnel all @apache.org originating email only from minotaur (accessible via SSH port forwarding or local origination) isn't realistic, IMHO. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Internationalization list/team
--On Wednesday, October 22, 2003 12:37 PM -0400 Noel J. Bergman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As for internationalization, I don't see why it should not be part of Apache Commons. I think that it is exactly the correct place for it. I don't know that it needs a CVS module, but I'm not opposed to one. Here's my $.02 as a Commons PMCer: If you want to write tools to support i18n, then Commons PMC will welcome the effort. If you want to create ASF-wide policy for i18n, then I don't think Commons Project is the correct place. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: establish a trust relationship (Re: missing signatures)
--On Thursday, September 25, 2003 07:58:50 +0900 Tetsuya Kitahata [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: P.S. However, still I can not build relationship with asf *members* ... dohhh... I know Pier and Brian have been known to travel to Japan (for pleasure and business). I'm sure others go to Japan periodically. I rarely, if ever, see any ASF members any more. Only at conferences and such. We're a virtual organization. The way you build relationships in this community is through interactions on mailing lists and contributions. There isn't any other way, really. That's why ApacheCon is so crucial. And, why we need to have European AC's too. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: EU Software Patents
--On Tuesday, August 26, 2003 10:09:14 +0100 Andrew Savory [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd like to propose that we close (ie swap the front page for a protest page) as many of the Apache web sites as possible. Not to belittle this protest, but we do a good job of bringing our own sites down ourselves (or UnitedLayer does). If we were to do this, IMHO, it'd be at the board's direction - no one else has the authority to do this. If you want to provide a page that we could replace it with, that may make it easier to receive approval. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: EU Software Patents
--On Tuesday, August 26, 2003 19:18:38 +0200 Gianugo Rabellino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is an almost standard page at http://swpat.ffii.org/group/demo/demo.en.html, so it would just be a matter of downloading and setting an .htaccess rule. But I understand that it might be pretty late to organize all this with such a short notice. Too bad, it's quite an important issue here. If someone (since there seems to be a lot of people +1'ing it) can come up with a *suitable* page for us to post, if we get a go-ahead from the board, then I'll post it (at least on www). I'd like to see a page contain: - the ASF logo so that this is obvious this is our official position - a description of the situation and what we want to see happen - links to the 'main' protest site - a passthrough to the real index page (taking the entire site off-line seems a tad excessive, but a link at the bottom of the page to the 'real' index page is okay with me). I'm not as pessimistic that we can get approval in time. ;-) But, someone needs to take charge of creating the content. Any takers? -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Added attending OSCON 2003 file to committers...
If you are going to be attending OSCON 2003 next week, please add your information to committers/docs/attendingoscon2003.txt. Gracias and see ya'll there! -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Contact infrastructure@ for help was RE: The cash of our lives / Dvorak
--On Tuesday, June 10, 2003 1:58 PM +0100 Danny Angus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Moving and re-naming files in an ssh terminal session is not crazily graphical nor easy enough for a 4 year old, but I bet there are enough people in Apache who can do it without sweating that it is, IMO, a poor excuse for throwing away useful information. Just as a point of information, if any project needs technical assistance with something, please don't hesitate to email [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Congratulations ASF
--On Saturday, June 7, 2003 9:14 AM -0700 Sander Temme [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Looks like the Apache Web Server won a Webby Award. Check out: http://www.webbyawards.com/main/webby_awards/nominees.html Scroll down about 80%, or click 'Technical Achievement' in the column at the right. http://www.webbyawards.com/main/webby_awards/criteria.html I think it's based on the website not any of our projects. =/ -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How BSD hurts OpenSource
--On Wednesday, May 14, 2003 8:13 AM +0200 Nicola Ken Barozzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And given what he thinks about the publicity cause in the Apache License, that makes it incompatible with GNU, it's really amusing. At an academic workshop I was at last weekend on open source, someone brought up the 'statistic' that 70-80% of open source projects use GNU GPL for their license. (No idea where that came from, or how accurate it is - lies, damn lies, and statistics.) What I wonder is how many of those authors/copyright-holders have actually read the GPL and understand what it really means. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hackathon at OSCON?
I'm not entirely sure party@ is the place for this since it's not quite a 'party,' but I've heard a rumor (from Duncan) that O'Reilly is hoping to provide space at OSCON for interested parties to hold a hackathon for two days (Sunday and Monday) before the actual conference in July. I don't believe you're going to have to be registered at the conference to attend a Hackathon, so you could just show up in Portland on Sunday and Monday, I guess. So, is there any interest in holding an ASF hackathon at OSCON? No idea if we've already passed an expiration of the offer though. Hopefully, we'll be having an ApacheCon again soon. *kick RoUS* -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: news.apache.org (was: apache.org vs. mozilla.org)
--On Saturday, April 5, 2003 5:05 PM +0200 Leo Simons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: NNTP makes more sense than SMTP for group discussions. No, it doesn't necessarily. NNTP was based for transient discussions rather than discussions that have lasting impact. I read allmost all OSS mailing lists I participate in through gmane. It kicks major ass. Two problems I'd have with switching to NNTP exclusively: - NNTP server admins tend to be very aggressive about deleting messages. We could take the policy of never deleting messages off *our* news server, but that doesn't allow us to synchronize/use other NNTP hosts. That'd be the major benefit of using NNTP exclusively - people could read the lists on their local NNTP server rather than our private server. But, if I go away for a week and come back, I could have missed messages that my local Usenet server harvested. That's not acceptable. - Disconnected support and filtering would be non-existant There would be no way to read the lists offline unless I install my own NNTP server locally that synchronizes. Uh, no. And, I have to rely on the filtering scheme of the news server rather than my own custom scheme. I have some lists that go to the same mailbox (namely related CVS commits) - not everyone would agree with this filtering scheme. But, it's the way I prefer it. So, I don't really care if we offer NNTP as well as keeping ezmlm, but if you remove email access, you'll hear my loud screams. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [proposal] daedalus jar repository (was: primary distribution location)
--On Wednesday, February 26, 2003 6:15 PM +0100 Leo Simons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my take: keep everything. Again, policy should be the same as for the contents of /dist/. I dunno if there is an asf-wide policy for that...looking at http://www.apache.org/dist/httpd/old/, those guys don't share my view :D The ASF policy (such as there can be one) is here: http://www.apache.org/dev/mirrors.html HTTP Server hasn't yet rearranged their directory structure. That's mainly because I don't think it's done a release since the policy was agreed-upon. -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [PROPOSAL] Open this list
--On Wednesday, February 5, 2003 4:08 PM -0800 Morgan Delagrange [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If we talk about it now, I'm pretty sure people will feel that it's been done to death and be fairly intransigent. +1. =) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[OT] Re: Hashing it out [was: Re: Clear the air Re: ATTN: Maven developers ...]
--On Wednesday, February 05, 2003 21:25:47 -0800 Daniel Rall dlr@finemaltcoding.com wrote: can't change /opt/tomcat/webapps/eyebrowse/index/apche.org/community Man, I hope our search engine doesn't index www.apche.org. I actually encountered this site at ApacheCon while Brian and David were running etherpeg. ;-) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Where are we?
--On Wednesday, January 29, 2003 19:15:16 + David Reid [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do we have to be truthful and honest? :) Maybe we could have one that shows where we'd *like* to be... In your case, we could show where your plane is. 40,000ft above the Atlantic Ocean in the middle of nowhere. =) -- justin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: wiki data migration (was: Do vs. Talk)
--On Friday, January 10, 2003 6:44 AM -0800 Aaron Bannert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I got it from fink, which gets it from this URL (part of netbsd?) http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/~checkout~/basesrc/games/wtf/ wtf?rev=%vcontent-type=text/plain I tried to install it last night from fink and figured out that that URL is wrong. It should be: http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/~checkout~/src/games/wtf/wtf?rev= HEAD You also need the acronyms file from: http://cvsweb.netbsd.org/bsdweb.cgi/~checkout~/src/share/misc/acronym s?rev=HEAD NetBSD's CVSWeb is *really* slow. -- justin
Re: subversion (was: fyi wiki statistics)
--On Tuesday, January 07, 2003 14:48:18 -0800 Greg Stein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: daedalus to support building Subversion. Next up is to try building it. Assuming that works, then yes: we're going to enable a Subversion server on icarus, and we'll have clients on icarus and daedalus. Ah, heck, I have the privs and know-how to build/install Subversion on icarus. (I need to update its httpd anyway.) I'll take a pass at it tonight unless someone screams before I get to it. Should we put the client binaries in /usr/local, or somewhere else? -- justin
RE: email notification done...sorta
--On Wednesday, January 8, 2003 2:17 PM -0500 Noel J. Bergman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm going to be curious to see how Subwiki works out -- if the intent is to switch --- being in Python, not Perl, but still not in Java. Are there more Python coders than Perl here? Certainly more than Perl. =) I know Perl just fine, but I won't touch it unless I have to. If we use a Java wiki, that means we can't use it on icarus. If it is in python, it can be part of our infrastructure. Not that I care too much if we use the SubWiki installation or not, but if we do, I think it is goodness. The real good thing is that you don't have to use the wiki interface to edit the pages. You can also use the CVS model to edit it. -- justin
Re: Wiki RSS
--On Monday, December 30, 2002 16:56:04 -0500 Andrew C. Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: this over. The point being, this technology will allow passive notification based on topic selection in a way not found on mail lists. And of course the sources to the wiki I'd much prefer mailing list notifications over RSS feeds. These types of notifications shouldn't be pull. Push-based notifications suit this problem domain far better than pull-based approaches. It also allows archiving of the changes. (We can recreate our entire CVS archive in the event of a castrophic failure just from the complete CVS commit archives.) Let's just create a wiki@ mailing list and send everything there. Have it send unified diff's in the style of our CVS mailer. -- justin
Re: First take on server load graphs...
--On Thursday, December 19, 2002 12:31 PM -0500 Vadim Gritsenko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All: In addition to web log statistics, I've created load average graphs. Check them out at: http://www.apache.org/~vgritsenko/stats/load.html Feedback is very welcome. Cool. Quick question about the daily web traffic stats. Is it possible to break out the httpd download traffic into httpd and httpd-python? httpd-python should be located in www.apache.org/dist/httpd/modpython. I'd like to get an idea where all of the download traffic within httpd is. Problem is httpd-python isn't using mirroring and before beating up on Grisha again to change his external link on modpython.org, I'd like to know how much of a problem it really is... Also, perhaps we should commit your scripts/pages into CVS somewhere so that people can edit it themselves. =) We might also want to move it out of your home dir... =) I'm definitely finding this information useful. Thanks! -- justin
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Sunday, December 1, 2002 8:25 PM -0500 Andrew C. Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So Sam Ruby is the ECMA conveiner for the .NET CLI.. I propose (since its well known) that he's an apache committer and the PMC chair of Jakarta that he be told he can't do that anymore. Ugh! No, you are missing the point here. Sam can do whatever he wants to do as Sam Ruby. I'm not going to tell Sam what to do *ever*. But, I feel that if he decides to rant about ECMA or .NET or IBM or Sun or the price of pigs in Beirut, then he shouldn't do that within the forum of the ASF unless the foundation is willing to legally stand behind his views. The foundation is responsible for everything on our servers. I don't care for it to be associated with *personal* views. Go find a different soapbox to stand on top of. Your contributions to the ASF don't merit you getting a personal bully pulpit. -- justin
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Sunday, December 1, 2002 7:23 PM -0800 Stefano Mazzocchi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are 450 people with commit access. Each one of them can put something in our servers that can screw the ASF, including web sites. Why is this any different? Because of community oversight. There are no mechanisms within the ASF that allow an individual any degree of freedom without some degree of oversight and mandated collaboration. For example, no release can be made without three committers approving it. For example, all CVS commit message end up at some mailing list where the interested participants review them. For better or worse, all of our processes are designed to limit the ability of a single person to corrupt the ASF or its projects. That's the benefit of the ASF - this isn't SourceForge where a person can do something on their own. IMHO, that is why Sam's allusion to the JSPA index left out a key point - within hours, the community had enforced oversight and removed that item from the front page (Ted moved it to the 'news' page). Furthermore, a discussion ensued in the appropriate forums as what to do next. Eventually, an 'official' position on the JSPA was reached and posted on the website. The community oversight process worked beautifully. Yet, a personal web site is just that - personal. It's purposely not part of the ASF community. There's no oversight. Therefore, I question what benefit can be gained by endorsing personal web sites hosted on the ASF infrastructure. -- justin P.S. There are about 590 people with commit right now!
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Monday, December 2, 2002 10:56 AM -0500 Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Justin, if you would like to put forward a set of rules, guidelines, and suggest an enforcement mechanism, I would be inclined to endorse it if it would further consensus. As I have said before, what I would prefer is more projects using the 'contributors' page that lists all contributors with a short blurb about them - much along the lines of what Stefano originally suggested. It'd be on the project pages, not on individual person's pages (that ensures oversight). Their entry can then link to the non-ASF site of their choice. My canonical example is: http://httpd.apache.org/contributors/ Although Jakarta has one of their own: http://jakarta.apache.org/site/whoweare.html My issue with the Jakarta page is that it doesn't have a picture (rather, room for a picture) and not everyone has their favorite link associated with it. For a page so large, the index at the top with everyone's name on it would be goodness, I think. I also have a hunch that each Jakarta sub-project should have a contributors page rather than a maintaining a global Jakarta one. That page is just too big. What I would think would also be agreeable is that we have a foundation-wide page that links to each project's contributors page. I'd be loathe to see duplication though. Hence, just link to each project's page. However, I could see a case where someone on community@ doesn't know what projects I'm on and hence doesn't know where to look for my info. That may make the case for polishing up Jim's page that lists all committers and their projects and putting it somewhere more 'official.' Perhaps, we could also follow a similar pattern as we do for members with committers. Jim's page could be tweaked to have a simple 'name, organization' with preferred links for both. That'd be it. Nothing more (every committer would be arranged alphabetically with no mention of what PMCs, ASF membership, etc, etc.). Yet, your 'name' link should do a job of describing who you are. If your preferred website doesn't describe you, then I wouldn't complain that no one knows who you are. =) There is such a directory for members. And I'm pleased to report that I have yet to come across a Beanie Baby in any of the links I have visited. The members directory just has their name and organization (perhaps URLs for both). But, all those links are external. =) I don't care if you sell Beanie Babies or have pictures of your kids on your site. -- justin
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Sunday, December 1, 2002 1:53 PM -0500 Rodent of Unusual Size [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ick to what? its existence, or the format? :-) Its existence and the fact that Andy is on a campaign to get Google to pick up on it. -- justin
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Sunday, December 1, 2002 6:01 PM -0500 Rodent of Unusual Size [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 5. is it an all-or-nothing proposition (everyone has them or no-one does)? -1. someone tries to force its opinion on me about how i may choose to express myself and describe my participation in the asf, i tell it to sod off in no uncertain terms. if someone doesn't like it, then it should a) not do it, and b) not look at others. but don't obstruct people who think the idea has value, particularly since it won't affect *you* in any way. (generic 'you' there, not anyone in mind at all.) I'm afraid of it reflecting poorly upon the ASF. Not matter how hard you try to say that the content isn't representative of the ASF as a whole, as long as the content is hosted on our site/domain, it will be deemed as such. Imagine the day when one of our committers rants about Java on their community.apache.org/~name page and it is posted to /. and Sun gets its panties in a knot due to the bad publicity. If a member or committer does this in a non-ASF forum, fine. But, giving people a platform from which to imply association with the ASF isn't helpful to the foundation or its mission. Reacting passively to these situations isn't going to help. Once the story would be posted on /., we're all in hot water. I believe the best course of action is not to encourage this behavior. -- justin
Re: [proposal] creation of communitity.apache.org
--On Wednesday, November 27, 2002 12:34:00 -0800 Stefano Mazzocchi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would like to propose the creation of the 'community.apache.org' web site. Currently, some people have their apache homepage on www.apache.org/~name and some on cvs.apache.org/~name and some don't have it. I'm -0 on the proposal for the following reason: what happens when someone places something inappropriate on their website? While I know we're all reasonably sane adults, I've run enough 'community' websites to get fed up with morons complaining about potentially offensive comments one of our users posted. Even worse, when people place infringing code/music/pictures, I end up being the bad guy shutting the account down. I don't appreciate it when someone does that. (Comments that we don't assume liability for the content doesn't assuage an irate moron - they'll still complain.) I'm about as a strong proponent of free speech as there is, but this has the propensity to snowball into a bureaucratic nightmare. I'd rather people only have ASF-related stuff on their 'personal' ASF website, or a redirect/link to their 'official' non-ASF site. I don't see how this coincides with the goals of the ASF. IMHO, each project (or sub-project) should have a page that lists all frequent contributors with a link to their preferred page (this is what HTTP Server and a few other projects do). For HTTP Server, some people have pictures and (not-so) witty comments on the 'contributors' page. (Note: on infrastructure@, Stephen brought up ASF-wide blogs - my reply was essentially the same as this.) -- justin
Re: Story behind dev@httpd.apache.org and new-httpd@yahoogroups.com
--On Friday, November 15, 2002 5:07 PM +0100 Ignacio J. Ortega [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hola a todos: I'm curious bout why the [EMAIL PROTECTED] list has such a poor activity, i know the quick response is it's simply not used but why?, and there is a list outside asf new-httpd that is so active, and seems for me that they are on the same topics at least very for the casual lurker, like me.. Huh? dev@httpd.apache.org is the main list for HTTP Server development, and it's quite active. new-httpd@apache.org was the old name for that development mailing list. (Don't remember when we switched though.) There are no ASF external mailing lists that any of us use for ASF development. Perhaps you are confusing Yahoo's 'archive' of the mailing list for the real mailing list. -- justin
Re: Hackathon
--On Monday, November 04, 2002 14:18:30 -0500 Rich Bowen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Having not been to a hackathon before, I'm not sure how this all works, but I wanted to mention some of the things that I was hoping to work on there, so that people can be thinking about it. Likewise, it would be nice to know what other people intend to be working on. Well, there's going to be a sizable group that will be interested in DAV related items (which have a tangential effect on Subversion). However, most of these changes are going to be in mod_dav not in anything directly related to Subversion - hence it's on-topic for an ASF Hackathon. Namely, DAV ACL support and perhaps some mechanisms for DAV Server-DAV Server support (i.e. distributed DAV). We have some rough ideas how some of this will play out - I can show people some of our notes, but we really haven't had fleshed-out conversations regarding these topics yet. During the week, I'll probably also be working on serf some more. I've recently been doing some work on that, so perhaps others will have ideas for directions serf can go. I can probably help Rich out with the Auth tutorial for the new httpd auth implementation since I'm partly to blame for the new auth code... And, it'd be *real* nice if we came up with a strategy for how we can separate the APR and APR-util build systems so that we can have a 1.0 release of APR. I bet we could release APR 1.0 during ApacheCon. =) It'd also be nice if we can figure out how to get PHP to become streamy (currently, PHP requires file descriptors for script input). However, I'm not sure if we're going to have enough PHP people present at the Hackathon to really make any substantial progress. It'd be nice, and I think that's a topic Cliff and (possibly) Aaron might be more interested than I am. Oh, and I guarantee someone will want to redesign how httpd does its filtering (perhaps coming out of the PHP filter issue above). If that happens, everything else gets shot to hell. That topic is a massive time sink. And, of course, if anyone has any other ideas, I'm game, but that's my starting point of a plan. -- justin
