Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Detlef Schmicker 
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Hash: SHA1

Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation symmetries
(and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than reduce)



Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
> If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and border, 
> ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
> 
> 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
> 
> 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the sides and
> 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also interested in the
> center value.
> 
> This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal patterns
> (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close to 2.
> 
> On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not find the
> number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetrie s.
> 
> Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I
> get 1093:)
> 
> Thanks, Detlef
>> ___ Computer-go
>> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> 
> ___ Computer-go mailing
> list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> 
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Álvaro Begué 
I get 1107 (954 in the middle + 135 on the edge + 18 on a corner).

Álvaro.



On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 2:00 PM, Detlef Schmicker  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation symmetries
> (and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than reduce)
>
>
>
> Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
> > If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and border,
> > ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
> >
> > 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
> >
> > 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the sides and
> > 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also interested in the
> > center value.
> >
> > This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal patterns
> > (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close to 2.
> >
> > On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not find the
> > number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetrie s.
> >
> > Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I
> > get 1093:)
> >
> > Thanks, Detlef
> >> ___ Computer-go
> >> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >
> > ___ Computer-go mailing
> > list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Detlef Schmicker 
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Am 03.11.2015 um 20:24 schrieb Jim O'Flaherty:
> I don't see how "leave the center empty" works as a valid case,
> assuming this it just any valid 3x3 window on the board. Given bots
> playing each other, there can be 9x9 clumps of a stone of the same
> color. I can see it being argued there is no computational value in
> this specific pattern instance. But, then what are the conditions
> of the exceptions to the generalization? And how do you effectively
> iterate through the other +20,000 variations (not reduced by
> location or color symmetry)?
> 
> So, I'm curious, is there some other assumption about the 3x3
> window other than it be a view into any valid 3x3 space on a Go
> board?

Sorry, I did not explain the details, the assumption is:
I play in the middle, so it must be empty. I thought legal moves might
not really reduce the number of 3x3 patterns, as there can be no
suicide known from 3x3 patterns, as a capture is always possible.

Therefore I wonder, what 14 patterns did not appear in my 4 games
harvested:)


> 
> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:04 PM, Álvaro Begué
>  wrote:
> 
>> I get 1107 (954 in the middle + 135 on the edge + 18 on a
>> corner).
>> 
>> Álvaro.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 2:00 PM, Detlef Schmicker 
>> wrote:
>> 
> Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation
> symmetries (and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than
> reduce)
> 
> 
> 
> Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
> If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and
> border, ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
> 
> 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
> 
> 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the
> sides and 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also
> interested in the center value.
> 
> This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal
> patterns (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close
> to 2.
> 
> On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not
> find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all
> symmetrie s.
> 
> Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4
> games I get 1093:)
> 
> Thanks, Detlef
>> ___
>> Computer-go mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> 
> ___ Computer-go
> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> 
>>> ___ Computer-go
>>> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
>>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___ Computer-go
>> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org 
>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>> 
> 
> 
> 
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[Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Detlef Schmicker 
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I could not find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetrie
s.

Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I get
1093:)

Thanks, Detlef
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Jim O'Flaherty 
Ah. That makes sense. It's a pattern centered on a possible next move. Very
cool. Tysvm for explaining.

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Detlef Schmicker  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
>
>
> Am 03.11.2015 um 20:24 schrieb Jim O'Flaherty:
> > I don't see how "leave the center empty" works as a valid case,
> > assuming this it just any valid 3x3 window on the board. Given bots
> > playing each other, there can be 9x9 clumps of a stone of the same
> > color. I can see it being argued there is no computational value in
> > this specific pattern instance. But, then what are the conditions
> > of the exceptions to the generalization? And how do you effectively
> > iterate through the other +20,000 variations (not reduced by
> > location or color symmetry)?
> >
> > So, I'm curious, is there some other assumption about the 3x3
> > window other than it be a view into any valid 3x3 space on a Go
> > board?
>
> Sorry, I did not explain the details, the assumption is:
> I play in the middle, so it must be empty. I thought legal moves might
> not really reduce the number of 3x3 patterns, as there can be no
> suicide known from 3x3 patterns, as a capture is always possible.
>
> Therefore I wonder, what 14 patterns did not appear in my 4 games
> harvested:)
>
>
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:04 PM, Álvaro Begué
> >  wrote:
> >
> >> I get 1107 (954 in the middle + 135 on the edge + 18 on a
> >> corner).
> >>
> >> Álvaro.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 2:00 PM, Detlef Schmicker 
> >> wrote:
> >>
> > Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation
> > symmetries (and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than
> > reduce)
> >
> >
> >
> > Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
> > If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and
> > border, ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
> >
> > 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
> >
> > 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the
> > sides and 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also
> > interested in the center value.
> >
> > This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal
> > patterns (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close
> > to 2.
> >
> > On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not
> > find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all
> > symmetrie s.
> >
> > Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4
> > games I get 1093:)
> >
> > Thanks, Detlef
> >> ___
> >> Computer-go mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >
> > ___ Computer-go
> > mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >
> >>> ___ Computer-go
> >>> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> >>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___ Computer-go
> >> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ___ Computer-go mailing
> > list Computer-go@computer-go.org
> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> >
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira 
If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and border, 
ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be


3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4

3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the sides and 3^4 
near the corners, assuming you are also interested in the center value.


This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal patterns (surrounded 
middle stone). So I'd hint it's close to 2.


On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

I could not find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetrie
s.

Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I get
1093:)

Thanks, Detlef
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Jim O'Flaherty 
I don't see how "leave the center empty" works as a valid case, assuming
this it just any valid 3x3 window on the board. Given bots playing each
other, there can be 9x9 clumps of a stone of the same color. I can see it
being argued there is no computational value in this specific pattern
instance. But, then what are the conditions of the exceptions to the
generalization? And how do you effectively iterate through the other
+20,000 variations (not reduced by location or color symmetry)?

So, I'm curious, is there some other assumption about the 3x3 window other
than it be a view into any valid 3x3 space on a Go board?

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:04 PM, Álvaro Begué  wrote:

> I get 1107 (954 in the middle + 135 on the edge + 18 on a corner).
>
> Álvaro.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 2:00 PM, Detlef Schmicker  wrote:
>
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation symmetries
>> (and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than reduce)
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
>> > If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and border,
>> > ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
>> >
>> > 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
>> >
>> > 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the sides and
>> > 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also interested in the
>> > center value.
>> >
>> > This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal patterns
>> > (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close to 2.
>> >
>> > On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not find the
>> > number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetrie s.
>> >
>> > Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I
>> > get 1093:)
>> >
>> > Thanks, Detlef
>> >> ___ Computer-go
>> >> mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>> >
>> > ___ Computer-go mailing
>> > list Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>> >
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread David Fotland 
Many Faces of Go has 2052 3x3 patterns.  All have a empty point in the center.  
One value is used for all the illegal patterns, so there are 2051 valid 
patterns.  I use Aja’s idea of including in the pattern the Atari status of 
zero to four adjacent groups.  That’s why it’s more than Álvaro’s 1107.

 

There is no reason to iterate over all patterns.  Just iterate over the ones 
that are identical through rotation or symmetry.  One easy way to find the 
canonical pattern is to calculate hashes for all rotations and reflections and 
choose the smallest one as the pattern ID.   I use a table to map the pattern 
IDs to a set of consecutive index, 0-1251.

 

 

 

David

 

From: Computer-go [mailto:computer-go-boun...@computer-go.org] On Behalf Of Jim 
O'Flaherty
Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2015 11:35 AM
To: computer-go@computer-go.org
Subject: Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

 

Ah. That makes sense. It's a pattern centered on a possible next move. Very 
cool. Tysvm for explaining.

 

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Detlef Schmicker <d...@physik.de> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1



Am 03.11.2015 um 20:24 schrieb Jim O'Flaherty:
> I don't see how "leave the center empty" works as a valid case,
> assuming this it just any valid 3x3 window on the board. Given bots
> playing each other, there can be 9x9 clumps of a stone of the same
> color. I can see it being argued there is no computational value in
> this specific pattern instance. But, then what are the conditions
> of the exceptions to the generalization? And how do you effectively
> iterate through the other +20,000 variations (not reduced by
> location or color symmetry)?
>
> So, I'm curious, is there some other assumption about the 3x3
> window other than it be a view into any valid 3x3 space on a Go
> board?

Sorry, I did not explain the details, the assumption is:
I play in the middle, so it must be empty. I thought legal moves might
not really reduce the number of 3x3 patterns, as there can be no
suicide known from 3x3 patterns, as a capture is always possible.

Therefore I wonder, what 14 patterns did not appear in my 4 games
harvested:)


>
> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:04 PM, Álvaro Begué
> <alvaro.be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I get 1107 (954 in the middle + 135 on the edge + 18 on a
>> corner).
>>
>> Álvaro.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 2:00 PM, Detlef Schmicker <d...@physik.de>
>> wrote:
>>

> Thanks, but I need them reduced by reflection and rotation
> symmetries (and leave the center empty so 3^8 + 3^5 + 3^3 and than
> reduce)
>
>
>
> Am 03.11.2015 um 19:32 schrieb Gonçalo Mendes Ferreira:
>>>>> If you are considering only black stone, white, empty and
>>>>> border, ignoring symmetry, wouldn't it be
>>>>>
>>>>> 3^9 + 3^6 + 3^4
>>>>>
>>>>> 3^9 for patterns away from the border, 3^6 for near the
>>>>> sides and 3^4 near the corners, assuming you are also
>>>>> interested in the center value.
>>>>>
>>>>> This makes 20493, then you need to take out illegal
>>>>> patterns (surrounded middle stone). So I'd hint it's close
>>>>> to 2.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 03/11/2015 18:17, Detlef Schmicker wrote: I could not
>>>>> find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all
>>>>> symmetrie s.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4
>>>>> games I get 1093:)
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, Detlef
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Re: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns

2015-11-03 Thread Hiroshi Yamashita 

Hi Detlef,

I have same number 1093 for 3x3 from 4 pro games as symmetory
is same pattern. Each point has 4 types, empty, black, white and
out of board.

3x3 pattern is small. So recently I combined it with distance of
previous move. Each 3x3 pattern has 17 kinds of distance of previous
move. And by using Latent Factor Ranking, I got 40.2% accuracy from
38.8% by MM.

Latent Factor Ranking(LFR) is almost same as Factorization Machines.
And original paper's explanation is nice. I use LFR_K=5, and AdaGrad
to change learning rate. It is effective (Thanks to Kato-san).

My LFR test code.
http://yss-aya.com/lfr_20151104.tar.gz
Factorization Machines
http://www.ismll.uni-hildesheim.de/pub/pdfs/Rendle2010_Factorization_Machines.pdf
Move Prediction in Go, Modelling Feature Interactions Using Latent Factors
http://www.ismll.uni-hildesheim.de/pub/pdfs/wistuba_et_al_KI_2013.pdf

Regards,
Hiroshi Yamashita

- Original Message - 
From: "Detlef Schmicker" <d...@physik.de>

To: <computer-go@computer-go.org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 3:17 AM
Subject: [Computer-go] Number of 3x3 patterns


I could not find the number of 3x3 patterns in Go, if used all symmetries.

Can anybody give me a hint, were to find. Harvesting 4 games I get
1093:)

Thanks, Detlef


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