Re: Horseman Number 3: Osama Used 40 bits

2002-01-20 Thread Stef Caunter

- Original Message -
From: Jon Simon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2002 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: Horseman Number 3: Osama Used 40 bits


 Can anyone else confirm or deny that this is the case?  If it is so,
 it would bring new meaning to the term weak encryption.
 Thanks,
 Jon Simon


For Win2K, it seems that the local administrator is the default recovery
agent on that box; Microsoft EFS provides built in data recovery; this is
a policy which must be configured before EFS will be available to users; a
recovery certificate must exist; Microsoft recommends that it be removed
from the recovery agent's personal store and only installed in case of
necessity; it seems that there is no irreversible file encryption using
Microsoft EFS.

BTW their default strength is 56 bit DESX, upgradeable to 128 bit for North
America.

It is important to note that local settings are overridden by domain
settings on a correctly configured network. The NT change password utility
is AFAIK _not_ remotely exploitable; it provides write access to the SAM on
any locally mountable NTFS. An attacker with floppy boot access to a Win2K
system would get reverse access to that machine's encrypted files only if
the recovery cert for the domain was locally available (unlikely), or if the
machine was not part of a domain.

There is quite possibly a general backdoor to the Microsoft EFS about which
we do not know. The EFS is a deterrent to network interception or system
theft. Users should be under no delusion about EFS and file readability. A
bad guy might not be able to read your files, but the boss can.

BTW, with encrypted file systems on linux, CFS and Transparent CFS files
will not be readable by the sysadmin unless they run a sniffer or a
keylogger to grab the passwords protecting the user's key. AFAIK there is no
reversibility short of cryptanalysis with these utilities.

Stefan Caunter, MCSE


[Moderator's note: lots of trailing quoted material deleted. *Please*
trim your messages before posting. --Perry]


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Re: Horseman Number 3: Osama Used 40 bits

2002-01-19 Thread Jon Simon

Can anyone else confirm or deny that this is the case?  If it is so, 
it would bring new meaning to the term weak encryption.
Thanks,
Jon Simon

Well, no matter if they used 128 bit encryption. using M$ EFS only is
secure from other users.  All one has to do is break the Administrator
password using change NT Password and they can decrypt the file with no
problem.  I love how things are exagerated :)


Cheers,

Jeremy

R. A. Hettinga wrote:

  I wonder if he can sue BillG? :-).

  Cheers,
  RAH

  http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns1804

  Weakened encryption lays bare al-Qaeda files


  17:07 17 January 02
  Will Knight


  Relatively weak encryption appears to have been used to protect files
  recovered from two computers believed to have belonged to al-Qaeda
  operatives in Afghanistan.

  The files were found on a laptop and desktop computer bought by Wall Street
  Journal reporters from looters in Kabul a few days after it was captured by
  Northern Alliance forces on 13 November. The files provide information
  about reconnaissance missions to Europe and the Middle East.

  A report in the UK's Independent newspaper indicates that the encryption
  used to protect these files had been significantly weakened by US export
  restrictions that existed until last year.

  The files were reportedly stored using Microsoft's Windows 2000 operating
  system and protected from unauthorised access using the Encrypting File
  System (EFS), which comes as standard on this platform. They were protected
  with a 40-bit Data Encryption Standard (DES), according to the Independent
  report. This was the maximum strength encryption allowed for export by US
  law until March 2001. All systems are now sold with the standard 128-bit
  key encryption, exponentially stronger than 40-bit.

  Wall Street Journal reporters say that they decrypted a number of files
  using an array of high-powered computers to try every possible
  combination, or key in succession, a process that took five days.

  Billions of keys

  Brian Gladman, an ex-NATO encryption expert based in the UK, says that
  40-bit DES means checking about a billion billion different keys in
  succession. This would take the average desktop computer a year, but a
  group of powerful machines could perform the feat in a few days, he says.
  However, he adds: If you go much beyond 40 bits it is outside the realm of
  possible.

  But Gladman says the US should not seek to reintroduce controls on the
  export of strong encryption products in light of this evidence. He believes
  that export controls would not necessarily stop terrorists and could harm
  the security of companies outside the US.

  The internet is already vulnerable and if we do not implement strong
  encryption, criminals will get away with murder, Gladman told New
  Scientist. Any efforts to prevent the deployment of this technology will
  damage us rather than help.

  Gladman says that terrorists can rely on far more elementary techniques to
  keep information secret and communicate covertly. These include using
  secret code words and anonymous internet cafes.


  17:07 17 January 02
  -
  R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/
  44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
  ... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
  [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
  experience. -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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Re: Horseman Number 3: Osama Used 40 bits

2002-01-18 Thread Ben Laurie

Trei, Peter wrote:
 [Moderator's note: It wasn't a direct quote, and I generally assume
 reporters misquote people anyway. Also, note that the general
 confusion because the UK uses thousand million for the US billion
 makes the whole thing even less clearly the expert and not the
 reporter. --Perry]

Actually, to my perpetual dismay, we are now supposed to use a billion
in the US sense (it used to mean a million million). As a result, I
don't use the word at all, since it predictably has become ambiguous in
the UK.

Cheers,

Ben.

--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html   http://www.thebunker.net/

There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit. - Robert Woodruff



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