CS: Pol-Why not to buy presents from Toys R Us this year
From: Paul Bartomioli, [EMAIL PROTECTED] the "shooting gallery" does not involve real firearms. it utilizes shotguns that shoot light (laser?) at a target. Very high tech method of firearms training. no bang, no smoke, no recoil, no projectiles. these people are dolts. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-drugs
From: "E.J. Totty", [EMAIL PROTECTED] ""Are you implying that we have a law regulating the MISUSE of drugs? --snip-- I've had friends use recreational drugs in the past, and I can tell you that this is a prime example of prohibition causing more problems than it ever solves. --snip-- -- I totally agree with you John, there are so many people in Walsall who have gotten onto heroin the way you describe that it is exceptionally hard for anyone to convince me that marijuana and ecstacy should remain illegal. --snip-- Also clearing out the jails of people convicted of growing marijuana would make space to keep the smack dealers in for much longer periods of time. Steve. Steve, John, Well, if you were to go the complete run and re-legalize the whole group of drugs that are currently outlawed, and merely make them obtainable by signature at a local apothecary/pharmacy or what have you, then the government would have a real idea as to the dimensions of drug use within the community -- something they have no idea of now. And, if every item were packaged with a description of the actual effects upon the body that the substance will have, as well as the long term effects, that could serve as a restraint. And, instead of playing the current lock'em up game, it would be a much better use of funds to simply have treatment centers for those who wanted to kick the addiction. As for the illegal market? If the price is so low that even the most poor could well purchase whatever, then there is no black market. To be sure, there would always be the abusers, but the glamor aspect has been removed. And the caveat of illegal usage: no concurrent activities that would cause others harm. If the price for breaking that law is stiff enough, it would deter the greater number. As you know, there will always be the hard cases. Allow me this: those who become addicted to any substance are pretty much of the same psychology: the aren't sick people, they are looking for an out from something that is bothering them. I you can get them into counseling, you can get to root causes of their dilemma. The general idea of getting young people to stay away from abusive drug use, isn't well thought out. Nobody I know of simply tells them the real story: "Your bodies are still growing, and everything you put into them will have an effect later on in life. When you abuse a substance, you are essentially weakening the building blocks of your life, creating possible havoc later on down the line. Everything in life is momentary except life itself. "Act in haste, regret in leisure". And regret lasts a lot longer than haste." Young people aren't taught to think in terms longer than the shortest spans of time, thus deriving the shortsighted mental attitudes that prevails in almost every culture. But that's another story. -- =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= Liberty: Live it . . . or lose it. =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= ET -- My personal view based on far too much sorry experience with young people in the local area is that any drug that has seriously harmful effects and is addictive should be banned. But also things like ecstacy and marijuana which at best are only mildly addictive and have mild health effects should be legal. My theory being the one of the lesser of several evils. Driving through some of the council estates in Walsall is an enlightening experience. There are people who live in Blakenhall who have sold the glass and doors out of their council house to buy heroin. People who advocate total legalisation do so on a flawed assumption of economics. I've always said that the problem with libertarianism is that it works great on civil rights, not so well with economics. If a substance is highly addictive, then demand is perfectly inelastic, regardless of price. The higher the price becomes the more crime you have as people attempt to obtain money to buy it. The only way to stop this is to stop people using it in the first place, and that means in part stopping the supply. The other half is to cut down on demand but I don't care how much money they pump into drug treatment, I have seen too many people on methadone one day and smack the next. The problem in many areas is that people simply won't admit they have a drug problem, because everyone around them uses drugs. If you can't get them to admit they have a problem, you can't treat them. So logically the finite resources of the police and Customs should be focused on the most damaging drugs, and the only way to do that is to legalise those drugs which don't do the damage. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Crime-gunman in police siege
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] GUNMAN DEFIES POLICE IN HOUSE SIEGE 260448 NOV 10 By Vanessa Allen and Harriet Tolputt, PA News A man who locked himself in his home with a gun after a row with his neighbour was today still refusing to surrender to police. Officers were called to a house in Kildare Crescent, Rochdale, Greater Manchester, yesterday afternoon after reports that a man had received head injuries following a fight with his neighbour. The neighbour who was injured was not seriously hurt, police said, but the other man has refused to leave his flat and has fired warning shots out of a window. Police negotiators spoke to the man overnight but he has refused to come out, a spokeswoman said. She said: "Negotiators are speaking with the man inside the flat and endeavouring to resolve the situation peacefully." Kenneth Pantling Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Pol-law-abiding?
From: "E.J. Totty", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Whatever happened to the idea of innocent until proven guilty? Puzzled a bit by this one. Who said anything about innocent or gulity? Semantics is not a favourite subject, but here we go. --snip-- IG, Go back and read your original comment. It was to the effect that there were no innocent people, only those who were not yet found out. The gist is that the world is full of criminals just waiting to happen. My terrier would rather chase rats than come to me. So I agree, they are good judges. Hope these drugs dogs didn't cock their legs on you tho! Well, all that proves is that your dog sees you as a lesser rat not worth chasing snicker. And, no, those dogs never cocked a leg in my direction. Dogs show respect by deferring to those whom they see as either equals or betters. Dogs don't pee on their friends. In my book, if you ain't under arrest, or being pursued, they you is as legal as legal can be. And no man has any authority to cast doubt upon you without reason. Hold on. In the states, does every arrest lead to a conviction Yippee. I'm on the way!! IG There you go again. Where did I infer that every arrest lead to a conviction? All I said was that if one not under arrest, or under suspicion for an illegal act, that one is free. -- =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= Liberty: Live it . . . or lose it. =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= ET Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-Recommended movies
From: Jeremy Peter Howells, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Quirkily 'Handgun' is often described as anti-gun. Though why this should be I don't really know as it seemed pretty balanced to me. My copy of Halliwell's TV and Video Guide 2000 lists Handgun as an EMI/Kestrel release in 1982 of 101 minutes. In their opinion it rates only one star but I found it quite interesting if a little slow in places. The plot line says ' A schoolmistress, raped at gunpoint, takes her revenge' and ' Novel, feminist revenge drama with a neat twist at the end'. Starring - Karen Young, Clayton Day, Suzie Humphreys, Helena Humann. No to be confued with a crime drama of 1994 with the same 'Handgun' title. Regards Jerry Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-schizophrenia
From: "E.J. Totty", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Here's another good read. It might explain more than just a few things. http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a1ccaff6e8f.htm -- =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= Liberty: Live it . . . or lose it. =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= =*= ET Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-Police Corruption
From: Jeremy Peter Howells, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yes, you are right! Bugger. IG Yes I believe that was covered in the Vagrancy Acts as well (or at least display of the equipment) :-) Regards Jerry Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Legal-Pellet pistols in Canada
From: "jim.craig", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fascinating stuff re Canadian airgun laws which I gather from reading between the lines limits the muzzle velocity of non-restricted airguns to 500 feet per second, a different approach to that adopted by the UK where muzzle ENERGY is the defining factor. Our 6 ft lbs limit for air pistols and 12 ft lbs limit for air rifles leaves a bit more room for manoeuvre than a muzzle velocity law but beware especially of exceeding the limit for air pistols since possession of an air pistol capable of 6.1 ft lbs will make you the proud possessor of a prohibited firearm! The muzzle velocity limit cuts both ways of course. In Sweden, where the limit is 600 feet per second .30 calibre air rifles are popular with airgun hunters since the heavier pellet gives a higher muzzle energy albeit at the cost of a distinctly more curved trajectory, but the dangers of nonsense like the Canadian situation where the law ends up banning some very low powered airguns are much increased. If we have to have a power limit, I suspect that for once we've got it right as far as the system goes although you can always argue about the exact power at which the gun becomes a firearm. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-Recommended reading
From: "Brian Toller", [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've mentioned this before, but a really good book is "Marine Sniper" by Charles Henderson, and it's still in print and you can still get it easily! Steve. Definitely agree as I bought it last time you recommended it and couldn't put it down. Purchased at the same time "One Shot-One Kill" by Charles W Sasser and Craig Roberts which covers American snipers in WW2, Korea, Vietnam and Beirut. Well worth a read. Brian T Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Pol-Stop or I'll chant!
From: Don Baldwin, [EMAIL PROTECTED] A firearm? A baseball bat? CS or pepper spray? A cattle prod? A plastic shield such as the police use? A clothes prop? A rottweiler? Our right to self defence has not descended anywhere. I repeat...ad nauseumyou all have a right to self defence!!! It just so happens that firearms are not available for self defence. Can't you even see the internal contradictions inherent in those comments? You can't own a firearm for the purpose of self defense in the home. You can't carry ANY weapon for purposes of self defense in public. In contrast, I am able to carry lockback knives at all times. I am able to carry pepper spray at all times. I am licensed to carry a concealed handgun. Are you going to honestly say that British folks on this list have as much ability to defend themselves as I do? The law only restricts self defence as being a good reason for possession. Why? IT's the most important reason for owning firearms. If you give up the right to use firearms as defensive weapons then they are just dangerous toys - why not ban them? Don Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-drugs
From: "IG", [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are people who live in Blakenhall who have sold the glass and doors out of their council house to buy heroin. If there were no gun controls, they could have legally bought firearms and nothing could have been done about it. It is but a small escalation to then use that firearm to carry out a raid on an all night garage. Or anywhere really. A bit like America. BTW..armed robberies are still less common than unarmed ones. Before the posts start flying in. So logically the finite resources of the police and Customs should be focused on the most damaging drugs, and the only way to do that is to legalise those drugs which don't do the damage. Or concentrate on the source of the problem. Colombia, Pakistan, etc etc. Get rid of the drug tzar and actually do something about the importation of drugs. I am surprised that anyone who admits to seeing the damage done by tack and E could advocate legalising such substances. Cannabis...hmmm..open to argument.but Emy God. What is a recreational drug by the way? Its another nonsense term, like 'friendly fire'. Its merely an attempt to minimise and legitimise the consequences caused by ingestation of chemical substances to alter a state of consciousness or to reduce inhibitions, etc. IG -- E isn't addictive though, not like heroin at any rate. I know a guy in Walsall who is brain damaged because he used too much of it but the doctors reckon it was because of a bad recipe. He has these spells where he sits and rolls his eyes and sometimes he has fits. However, that is nothing compared to what I have seen done to people who use heroin and I tend to feel that if ecstacy were legal it would be properly manufactured so any adverse affects would be minimal. And BTW, I didn't advocate that there be no gun controls, remember? Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Pol-law-abiding?
From: "IG", [EMAIL PROTECTED] How many police officers have spotless pasts, whether they were convicted or not? Would you rather form a partnership with non-criminals in your country in opposition to serious crime? Or treat every non-officer like a future perpetrator...and become their enemy? Eh? IG Confused. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-drugs
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] any drug that has seriously harmful effects and is addictive should be banned I know it's tempting to agree with this, but the history of governments banning things (including guns...) is a very sorry one. Reason invariably flies out of the window, the rules are arbitrary, there is a massive growth of bureaucracy and a parallel diminution of civil rights. To call for something to be banned is to say either "I disapprove of this even if it has no direct effect on my liberty and I don't think others should be allowed to make up their own minds," or "I think a bunch of politicians and civil servants should have the power to decide what I can eat, drink, smoke or sniff." Banning things creates all manner of dangerous precedents - as shooters, of all people, should know. Like gun-control, the "war on drugs" is a massive scam perpetrated on the citizens by duplicitous governments, to whom it gives greater freedom to tax us, spy on us, and interfere with our liberty. Alcohol meets your definition of a potentially dangerous, habituating drug, Steve - but the great majority of us don't let that glass of sherry at the vicarage tea-party lead subsequently to our sitting under a railway arch swigging methylated spirits. If a few weak-minded people want to destroy themselves with heroin or whatever, let them - they won't last long. It's just Mother Nature's way of culling the bozos. Anthony Harrison -- I knew someone was going to say "Oh yes, Steve, but that includes booze and fags as well." No it doesn't. Also this argument about only weak-minded people is utter crap as well, anyone can become a drug addict I've seen it with my own eyes. I have to say quite frankly that people who say things like that obviously have little or no experience with drug addicts. I've seen blokes who are obviously very bright who can defeat every car security system known to man in seconds, but instead of using their intelligence to get a real job they are addicted to heroin so they steal cars and live from day to day. If it only affected people because of some genetic reason then it would affect all age groups equally, it doesn't, it affects young people to a far, far greater degree, certainly in Walsall at any rate. People do not sell every possession they have, live in poverty and commit burglaries every day when they have a drinking or smoking addiction. And it's not because they started out living in poverty either, most of them don't in my experience. And it's not because drugs are artificially expensive because they're banned either, heroin is quite inexpensive, but when you are addicted to it you can barely function as a human being so you can't make much money. I've seen this "Oh, it could never happen to me, I'm far too bright (or my kids are)" and then they find out their daughter uses smack every day or they get addicted to it themselves. Wake up everyone, there is a large and growing proportion of the population going down the tubes because of heroin. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Pol-Stop or I'll chant!
From: "John Hurst", [EMAIL PROTECTED] The law does not restrict self defence as being a "good reason", Home Office Guidance does. Home Office Guidance even points out that the police _should_ not issue certificates for that purpose, it does not say they can't. A small but important point. OK, I will wear that one. IG, That is not good enough. Your Oath of Alleigance requires that you accept the law as it is, specificaly the common law confirmed by the Bill of Rights and the entrenching clause; Article 7 " That the Subjects which are Protestants may have Arms for their Defence suitable to their Conditions and as allowed by Law...". "...Now in pursuance of the Premisses the said Lords Spirituall and Temporall and Commons in Parlyament assembled for the ratifying confirming and establishing the said Declaration and the Articles Clauses Matters and things therein contained by the Force of a Law made in due Forme by Authority of Parlyament doe pray that it may be declared and enacted That all and singular the Rights and Liberties asserted and claimed in the said Declaration are the true auntient and indubitable Rights and Liberties of the People of this Kingdome and soe shall be esteemed allowed adjudged deemed and taken to be and that all and every the particulars aforesaid shall be firmly and strictly holden and observed as they are expressed in the said Declaration And all Officers and Ministers whatsoever shall serve their Majestyes and their Successors according to the same in all times to come...". Your previous posting was; It just so happens that firearms are not available for self defence. If a firearm had been used in this case, then, provided it was legally held for say, clay shooting, then no jury in a million years would convict someone using it. Don't delude yourself. The law only restricts self defence as being a good reason for possession... This is incorrect for those reasons. Claiming otherwise through innorance is no excuse either because it breaches the common law requirement for Crown servants to know the law; 'We will appoint as justices, constables, sheriffs, or other officials, only men that know the law of the realm and are minded to keep it well.' Regards, john Hurst. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Pol-dates of laws
From: "IG", [EMAIL PROTECTED] A recent case in Kent had a judge being furious with a Crown prosecutor who declined to co-operate with his plea-bargaining strategy over some Kosovars and other ex-Yugoslavian dross who'd created mayhem in the street, and they escaped the prison sentence they deserved because they "copped a plea" to some lesser offence. I'm sure you know all about that kind of thing, IG. Is this your interpretation of events, or was this information actually published? If you let me know the case details, ie roughly the date and the name of any one of the defendants, I will pull the court transcript to establish what happened. Incidentally, would it have been as big a problem if it hadn't been 'Yugosalvian dross'? What happened with presumption of innocence here? They deserved prison even prior to conviction did they? I bet a hundred million pounds (or dollars even!) that not one single person will object to your comments on here. But if I had made them! lol Not that I'm bothered, amused, yes, bothered, no! IG Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-Recommended reading
From: "N. L. Cobb", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Another Forester work worth reading is "Rifleman Dodd." During the Peninsula Campaign Dodd, through no fault of his own, becomes separated from his outfit and eventually joins a guerrilla band, sniping at the French. Forester could have gone into more detail about the Baker rifle but, on the whole, it's a good adventure yarn offering a pretty good "feel" for an infantry campaign of that era and service in the Rifle Corps. Norm Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
