Re: WebMoney

2005-04-25 Thread Pawe Krawczyk
On Thu, Apr 21, 2005 at 09:15:06AM -0500, Shawn K. Quinn wrote:

  The fact that webmoney takes security so seriously suggests to me 
  that they are honest - but, of course, the fact that they are russian 
  suggests .
 This isn't the middle of the Cold War anymore. I don't think they are
 that dishonest, especially after some of the crap the US government has
 pulled in the last few years.

It's not middle but it's definitely closer to Cold War now than in early
90's, if you look at recent Putin's actions.

I still have doubts about using WM but next time I'll give it a try
as it's cheaper than Western Union and wire transfers. Technically the
system seems trustworthy but that's not enough - any Russia-based money
system can be shut down in one day if someone in Moscow decides so.

If you look at 90's denomination, then banks bankrupting last year
and Lukoil case then you understand why people don't want to send their
money through Russia. To Russia (like in my case) - maybe...

WM seems to be partially based on Ukraine which slightly gives more
confidence after last elections. I hope Ukraine sees this potential.

-- 
Pawe Krawczyk, Krakw, Poland
ABA http://www.aba.krakow.pl/
ul. Bociana 22a, 30-230 Krakw
tel. (0-12) 4158781



Re: WebMoney

2005-04-25 Thread James A. Donald
--
On 22 Apr 2005 at 16:20, Bill Stewart wrote:
 Last time I wanted to use an online gold system, I
 used pecunix as the currency and goldage.net as the
 payment handler.  That was partly because of the fees
 for the size of transactions I was doing (for small
 transactions, the minimum fee is more important than
 the percentage), but partly for convenience - one way
 to pay Goldage in the US is to go to a bank where they
 have an account and make a deposit - Wells Fargo is
 one of their more widespread banks.

A procedure that was, of course, anonymous.  You
probably made a deposit in cash.

In the cypherpunk vision, internet transactions should
be blinded, so that the adversary cannot do connection
analysis.  If Ann pays Bob, the adversary can detect
this, and perhaps suspect that Ann actually is Bob.  We
do however have anonymous deposits and withdrawals from
internet transaction services, and weakly nymous
providers of accounts.

Many foreign banks go through the motions of verifying
foreign account holders true names, but not all them try
all that hard.  E-gold goes through the motions, and
sporadically enforces its acceptable use policy, which
requires you to submit true name information, but really
does not try at all for the most part, unless the shit
hits the fan.  Pecunix does not require true name
information - merely an email account at which you are
capable of receiving mail - preferably PGP mail.

WebMoney does not even require an email account.  If you
use their classic security system, their client just
generates what I assume is a private key on your
computer, and that is your identifier.

Though these systems permit governments to do connection
analysis, most governments are not terribly interested
in doing connection analysis on foreigners, and
governments do not work well with other governments.

Not that I suggest that any of this is an adequate
substitute for true Chaumian blinded transactions, but
it is a substitute, and also foreshadows demand for such
transactions, and a profitable business model based on
such transactions.  The real obstacle is that 99% of
customers cannot understand WebMoney's security, or use
Pecunix's PGP based interface.  If you try to sell them
Chaumian blinded transactions, the average mobster is
going to be seriously boggled. 

--digsig
 James A. Donald
 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
 /rjlkisXJqOtx4zr4jGWmDeW6blJQ6vawOmxFssX
 4BiPlDhZsJ7G0P6TTWXEwYNbNs1ylu/oofbIhlUrv




Re: WebMoney

2005-04-22 Thread Tyler Durden
Are you continuing those dots correctly? I assumed they were leading to the 
words Russian mob, which has become quite the powerful force in Brooklyn 
these days.

-TD
From: Shawn K. Quinn [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: WebMoney
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 09:15:06 -0500
On Wed, 2005-04-20 at 19:40 -0700, James A. Donald wrote:
 The fact that webmoney takes security so seriously suggests to me
 that they are honest - but, of course, the fact that they are russian
 suggests .
This isn't the middle of the Cold War anymore. I don't think they are
that dishonest, especially after some of the crap the US government has
pulled in the last few years.
--
Shawn K. Quinn [EMAIL PROTECTED]