Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
Control: tags -1 pending Hi, For final review: https://salsa.debian.org/ddp-team/release-notes/-/merge_requests/167 Paul OpenPGP_signature Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
On Thu, 27 Apr 2023 22:19:53 +0200 Holger Wansing wrote: > Hi Paul, > > Paul Gevers wrote (Thu, 27 Apr 2023 22:10:16 +0200): > > > > + If you depend on a screen reader and want to upgrade to , > > we suggest > > + that you install a desktop like MATE instead of GNOME. > > > > I guess our recommendation also holds for new installs. So maybe leave > > out the "and want to upgrade to bookworm" part? I think this should be very high up - first in the file, rather than at the end - seems like this is going to be a really big issue for some people. Perhaps at least tell them how to switch to mate (eg: what package to install - is it mate-desktop or is mate-desktop-environment needed for accessibility - i assume the latter is better?) And can we clarify "much less accessible" mean - doesnt work at all or something less worrying? (i couldnt find anything aimed at users on this) also - is a switch to mate rally all that is needed - would you not also need to switch away from every GTK4 app as well?, or do apps under mate revert to GTK3 again? Especially i would want to know: does Orca work under Mate? do any settings copy across? (i found a page on debian's wiki but it's not very illuminating - hopefully because it all just works!) Is it all screen readers (2nd para) or just orca? Some minor word changes and markup suggestions: (I wasnt sure if i have described GTK3/4 right - is it better to say version 4 of GTK for example?) GNOME has reduced accessibility support for screen readers Many GNOME apps have switched from the GTK3 graphics toolkit to GTK4. Sadly, this has made many apps much less usable with screen readers such as Orca. If you depend on a screen reader you should consider switching to a different desktop such as https://mate-desktop.org;>Mate, which has better accessibility support. You can do this by installing the mate-desktop-environment package. Information about how to use Orca under Mate is available at https://wiki.debian.org/Accessibility/Orca#MATE;>here. Ideally someone who is affected by this would comment too - im sure there are lots of questions that wouldnt occur to me that should be included here.
Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
Hi Paul, Paul Gevers wrote (Thu, 27 Apr 2023 22:10:16 +0200): > > + If you depend on a screen reader and want to upgrade to , > we suggest > + that you install a desktop like MATE instead of GNOME. > > I guess our recommendation also holds for new installs. So maybe leave > out the "and want to upgrade to bookworm" part? That part was not existing in the original report, but added by me :-) so - yes, I guess your argument counts. Holger -- Holger Wansing PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508 3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076
Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
Hi Holger, Thanks for doing the leg work. On 27-04-2023 21:50, Holger Wansing wrote: + Accessibility: GNOME GTK4 apps with reduced screen reader support + + Many GNOME apps have switched from GTK3 to GTK4. Sadly, GTK4 is much + less accessible with the Orca screen reader compared to GTK3. + (Tiny nitpick, we normally put those ^ one two lines.) + If you depend on a screen reader and want to upgrade to , we suggest + that you install a desktop like MATE instead of GNOME. I guess our recommendation also holds for new installs. So maybe leave out the "and want to upgrade to bookworm" part? Paul OpenPGP_signature Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
Control: tags -1 + patch I think, the text proposed in this report is almost fit for publication. So I have prepared a patch based on that. Holger -- Holger Wansing PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508 3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076 diff --git a/en/issues.dbk b/en/issues.dbk index 1de96461..dd96f5cc 100644 --- a/en/issues.dbk +++ b/en/issues.dbk @@ -293,6 +293,17 @@ + + Accessibility: GNOME GTK4 apps with reduced screen reader support + + Many GNOME apps have switched from GTK3 to GTK4. Sadly, GTK4 is much + less accessible with the Orca screen reader compared to GTK3. + + If you depend on a screen reader and want to upgrade to , we suggest + that you install a desktop like MATE instead of GNOME. + + + Things to do post upgrade before rebooting
Bug#1034248: release-notes: Document that GTK4 apps are not accessible with screen reader
Subject: release-notes: screen reader Package: release-notes Tags: a11y bookworm sid X-Debbugs-CC: debian-gtk-gn...@lists.debian.org Many GNOME apps have switched from GTK3 to GTK4. Sadly, GTK4 is much less accessible with the Orca screen reader compared to GTK3. If you depend on a screen reader, we suggest that you install a desktop like MATE instead of GNOME. Other Info - Debian Bookworm has GTK 4.8 and libadwaita 1.2. This issue is not significantly improved yet even with GTK 4.10 and libadwaita 1.3. My guess is that it won't be possible to fix this issue with Debian Bookworm Stable Updates once it is fixed upstream because the amount of changes will be too much. We hope that GTK4 apps will be accessible for Debian Trixie. There is a test case at https://launchpad.net/bugs/2015760 Thank you, Jeremy Bícha
